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  1. #37
    Sapere Aude Jack's Avatar
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    Tell me how you define "socialist" and perhaps I can reply.



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  2. #38
    Hot Lava iolo's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    Tell me how you define "socialist" and perhaps I can reply.
    'Believing in democratic control by the working-class majority rather than the pretence of democracy by a tiny controlling minority of the extremely rich'?


  3. #39
    Igneous Magma
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    Iolo's definition is a bit broad. Usually, it specifically refers to the school of thought advocating partial or total management of the economy by the state. Until 1980 or thereabouts it typically referred even more specifically to the nationalization of industry.
    But other definitions can be justified. Use your own as long as it's sensible...


  4. #40
    Sapere Aude Jack's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: iolo View Post
    'Believing in democratic control by the working-class majority rather than the pretence of democracy by a tiny controlling minority of the extremely rich'?
    Our current republic, in its ideal form as depicted in the Constitution, would fit that description.



    The Forum Rules

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    [John F. Kennedy]
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    [Senator Dick Clark of Iowa]
    The presence of those seeking the truth is infinitely to be preferred to the presence of those who think they've found it.
    [Terry Pratchett]

  5. #41
    Lobotomized Angry Citizen's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: sulh-i-kul View Post
    I suspect they've got a slightly more specific definition.

    Seriously, assuming there's no policy against mods coming out, is there even a single socialist mod? I'm kinda curious.
    The owner of this site is, for all intents and purposes, a democratic socialist I believe.

    But the point stands. There is an overwhelming bias for left-wing, atheistic moderators. Even though I'm left-wing and atheist, I think this is a travesty of the highest order and is totally inexcusable. I have also seen demonstrable instances of such political bias among the moderators - not so much antagonism towards conservatives, but cronyism towards blatantly foul left wingers whose abuses would be intolerable from a right winger. Typically I'm ignored in calling it out.

    A man said to the universe:
    "Sir, I exist!"
    "However," replied the universe,
    "The fact has not created in me
    A sense of obligation."


    -- Stephen Crane

  6. #42
    Igneous Magma
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    You said you were a social democrat (a Marxist denomination) yet you speak about "the free market" and vocally support plutocracy in a fashion similar to those who are called "libertarians" in your country nowadays. I imagine you could be a left-winger in Texas but, coming from you, I'm not sure what "democratic socialist" is supposed to mean. I've heard the phrase used to describe people who are to the left of social democrats but who aren't orthodox Marxists or anarchists. I don't suppose that's what you mean.


  7. #43
    Lobotomized Angry Citizen's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: sulh-i-kul View Post
    You said you were a social democrat (a Marxist denomination) yet you speak about "the free market" and vocally support plutocracy in a fashion similar to those who are called "libertarians" in your country nowadays. I imagine you could be a left-winger in Texas but, coming from you, I'm not sure what "democratic socialist" is supposed to mean. I've heard the phrase used to describe people who are to the left of social democrats but who aren't orthodox Marxists or anarchists. I don't suppose that's what you mean.
    Of course I speak about the free market - it exists. I cant say I support it, but it could exist if there were no regulations in place. Please cite an example in which I "support plutocracy".

    Democratic socialists are socialists who disavow Marxist revolution in favor of democratic change. They differ from social democrats in that social democrats support elements of capitalism in their economic model. Some social democrats lean towards socialism, and some towards capitalism. I am about in the middle. Nationalize about half the economy, regulate the rest as circumstancea dictate.


  8. #44
    Hot Lava iolo's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    Our current republic, in its ideal form as depicted in the Constitution, would fit that description.
    But, alas, only in an ideal form - and in that it is not alone.


  9. #45
    Igneous Magma
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    Of course I speak about the free market - it exists. I cant say I support it, but it could exist if there were no regulations in place. Please cite an example in which I "support plutocracy".

    Democratic socialists are socialists who disavow Marxist revolution in favor of democratic change. They differ from social democrats in that social democrats support elements of capitalism in their economic model. Some social democrats lean towards socialism, and some towards capitalism. I am about in the middle. Nationalize about half the economy, regulate the rest as circumstancea dictate.
    Monty Python - Life of Brian - PFJ Splitters - YouTube -- Sorry citizen, just couldn't help myself.




  10. #46
    Stephen Best barts's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    Of course I speak about the free market - it exists.
    It does? Where?

    Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd - Voltaire

  11. #47
    Stephen Best barts's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    There is an overwhelming bias for left-wing, atheistic moderators. ... I think this is a travesty of the highest order and is totally inexcusable.
    Why?

    The site is free. I pay for it. The advertising covers about half the costs. All the managers of Volconvo are volunteers who donate their time. People of all views are encouraged to post what they want, just so long as they show some reasonable courtesy to others. Not a lot to ask.

    So, where's the travesty? And, not just a run-of-the-mill "travesty", but a "travesty of the highest order" that "is totally inexcusable".

    I could appreciate your criticism if this was a government or institutional operation, paid for with tax dollars or involuntary fees, but it's not.

    And here's what really interesting: even though you think the way Volconvo's volunteer managers run the joint is inexcusable and our biases are a travesty, we still welcome you to express even those views.

    That's quite a travesty.

    Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd - Voltaire

  12. #48
    Destroyer of Worlds minorwork's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: barts View Post
    It does? Where?
    Farmer's markets. Garden tending. Car buying and selling. Bouncers. Speakers for events.

    If the terrain and the map do not agree, follow the terrain.

    When motherhood becomes the fruit of a deep yearning, not the result of ignorance or accident, its children will become a new race.

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