Many posts hint and are partially about this, but I think it's about time to create a thread exclusively to the death penalty. I'll kick it off with a couple of things that I have posted in various other topics.
In the Clinton/Gore administration the amount of inmates doubled from 1 to 2 million.
In a 23 year period (1973-1995) a study found 7 out of 10 capital sentence cases out of 4,578 had serious, reversible error.
Since 1973 95 death row inmates were fully exonerated by the court. 96 have been realesed as a result of DNA testing.
In 85% of death penalty cases the error rates are 60% or higher
This is a direct quote from Social Work Speaks sixth edition Nation Association of Social Workers Policy Statements:
Abolition of the Death Penalty
There is no evidence that the death penalty serves as a deterrent to violent crime. In fact the recent increase in homicides in the United States has occured despite the reinstitution of capital punishment in most states. The abolition of the death penalty would bring the United States' penal system in line with those of other modern industrialized societies. As it is currently used, the death penalty violates the constitutional prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment. In addition, the equal application of the death penalty deprives many people of color and low-income people of the Fourteenth Amendment's gurantee of "equal protection under law."
End quote
I agree that capital punishment is not a deterrent to serious crime, hell alot of the sickos see it as a glorious way to die, their 15 minutes of fame so to speak because they never did anything worthwhile in their lives.
In saying that I still support the Death sentence, in Australia we are spending millions of much needed tax keeping these animals in comfort, they can even sue now if they are injured in an accident in there, crazy stuff.
Every study I've read concludes that it costs more to execute someone than it does to imprison them for life. Cost isn't really a good argument -- unless you want to restructure the whole justice system, eliminate the right of appeal and so forth. If that's what you want, then there are countries that will accomdate you, but I would prefer not to live in any of them.
As I said, there are countries that don't havce such a rigourous appeals system. If you promise to emigrate not leave there for five years, I'll even buy your tickets to Sudan. They have a death pentalty and virtually non-existant appeals system, so you should love it there.
Originally posted by Geoff332@09-24-2003 07:49 AM As I said, there are countries that don't havce such a rigourous appeals system. If you promise to emigrate not leave there for five years, I'll even buy your tickets to Sudan. They have a death pentalty and virtually non-existant appeals system, so you should love it there.
Well aint we a smartarse Geoff, they also have corrupt warlords who rape and murder their own people, they would be the first I would have hung, if I had the power.
OK then. You go out and find a country that uses the death penalty and doesn't have an appeals process that you would like to live in. I'll even help you with a list of countries that still have the death penalty.
AFGHANISTAN
ALGERIA
ANTIGUA AND BARBUDA
BAHAMAS
BAHRAIN
BANGLADESH
BARBADOS
BELARUS
BELIZE
BENIN
BOTSWANA
BURUNDI
CAMEROON
CHAD
CHINA
COMOROS
CONGO (Democratic Republic)
CUBA
DOMINICA
EGYPT
EQUATORIAL GUINEA
ERITREA
ETHIOPIA
GABON
GHANA
GUATEMALA
GUINEA
GUYANA
INDIA
INDONESIA
IRAN
IRAQ
JAMAICA
JAPAN
JORDAN
KAZAKSTAN
KENYA
KOREA (North)
KOREA (South)
KUWAIT
KYRGYZSTAN
LAOS
LEBANON
LESOTHO
LIBERIA
LIBYA
MALAWI
MALAYSIA
MAURITANIA
MONGOLIA
MOROCCO
MYANMAR
NIGERIA
OMAN
PAKISTAN
PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY
PHILIPPINES
QATAR
RWANDA
SAINT CHRISTOPHER & NEVIS
SAINT LUCIA
SAINT VINCENT & GRENADINES
SAUDI ARABIA
SIERRA LEONE
SINGAPORE
SOMALIA
SUDAN
SWAZILAND
SYRIA
TAIWAN
TAJIKISTAN
TANZANIA
THAILAND
TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO
TUNISIA
UGANDA
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
UZBEKISTAN
VIET NAM
YEMEN
ZAMBIA
ZIMBABWE
Why don't you pick one and then tell us about the superiority of their appeals process over the US? Since what you're advocating is such a good idea, there must be a place that actually uses it.
I think capital punishment has had its days, as most countries besides America have already realized. I think making the criminals live out the remainder of their lives in captivity is a greater punishment than death. The only downside is that tax dollars must be allocated for the upkeep of these prisoners. And, also, as Section 8 said, innocent prisoners are being executed - which is absolutely not acceptable.
Overall, abolishing capital punishment is something that needs to be done soon - we (America) are behind other countries by using the death penalty in that it's a step above the use of torture...Very archaic stuff.
The only downside is that tax dollars must be allocated for the upkeep of these prisoners.
Sorry to go on about this, but if you are referring to the US specifically, then this is not a valid argument. It costs considerably more to execute a prisoner than it does to imprison them for life. This is based on their time on death row vs general population in a maximum security prison. These costs could be reduced by shortening the appeals process (hence reducing the time on death row), but this would increase the number of "innocent prisoners ... being executed - which is absolutely not acceptable."
<edit>
I should give some sort of facts to back up what I have said. I can't find the original sources, but these two pages have information about death penalty costs. World Policy (about half way down) Amnesty USA
A brief summary is:
LA County: death penalty costs $ 2 M vs $ 1.4 M for Life Without Parole (LWOP).
Texas: $ 2.3 M for death, about three times the cost of LWOP.
North Carolina: death costs 2.16 M more than LWOP.
Florida: $ 3.2 M for death, $600 K for LWOP.
New York: death is about three times the cost of LWOP.
Similar studies in Kansas and Maryland give similar results.
</edit>
FA, why did you say that it's "crazy stuff" that they can sue if they are injured in an accident. According to what you posted then if I was an inmate and I was brutally beaten and raped while a guard just stood there and watched I should not be able to sue. This makes absolutely no sense. And by the way to meals a day in a tiny cell is not exactly comfort.
Sorry to go on about this, but if you are referring to the US specifically, then this is not a valid argument. It costs considerably more to execute a prisoner than it does to imprison them for life. This is based on their time on death row vs general population in a maximum security prison. These costs could be reduced by shortening the appeals process (hence reducing the time on death row), but this would increase the number of "innocent prisoners ... being executed - which is absolutely not acceptable."
This is an old lame argurement, the sytem does need an overhaul, and that price is one of the things that need fixing...
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