The gang in blue: Police

[barts]

To the groups of socially respected professionals and social leaders who, in fact, prey on people, causing death, illness, injuring, and suffering, we can add police. This is one example of how dangerous the police in fact are, and can only lead to the conclusion that every encounter with police threatens a person's life, and that the police ought not be called except as a last resort,

When architect [Carl Johnson] crashed his car while suffering a diabetic reaction on the way home from Bible study class, state and county police pepper sprayed him in the face and clubbed and Tasered him to death...

...when State Trooper Davon Parker arrived and tapped on the window, and Johnson managed to lower the window, Parker pepper sprayed him in the face. Johnson then got out of his car and Parker clubbed him at least once in the knee. Defendant Officer Loss (fnu) then arrived and whacked Johnson at least twice with his club...

Baltimore County Police Officer Nicholas Wolferman then arrived, whacked Johnson "at least three times" with his own baton, then he and Officer Loss grabbed Mr. Johnson and threw him over the guardrail... after throwing [Johnson] over the guardrail, the cops applied pressure points to his ears and armpits... Three more cops arrived, including Baltimore County Officer Andrew O'Neill, who Tasered Johnson twice. Officer Loss then punched him in the face and the six officers managed to handcuff him...

Eight more cops arrived, and someone took his wallet, which included a medical alert card about his diabetes. Nonetheless, the cops forcibly held him down, though he was not resisting, and was handcuffed...

...approximately 52 individuals that responded to the scene...Johnson was Tasered at least three times, while he was lying on his back, helpless, surrounded by police. He became "motionless and speechless" and was pronounced dead within an hour of cardiac arrest.

[Johnson] was the 10th person to die since 2004 after being subjected to police electroshock in Maryland, the Baltimore Sun reported in a story about Johnson's death.

Let me also add,



The fact is that America's police are waging war on ordinary citizens. Most of them are brutal and dangerous thugs--a gang in Blue. They are not protecting ordinary people, they are preying on them and brutalizing them.

[samson]

To say that every encounter with a police officer endangers one's life from a relative small sample is fallacious and the belief in such may be dangerous in itself. In refuting your conclusion, it is entirely possible that such incidents that you have cited and other related unstated incidents may be isolated events and are overrepresented in the media. We must consider the possible hundreds, perhaps thousands, of encounters with the police that resulted in a neutral or positive consequences that are under-represented in, perhaps not reported at all, in the media. Because of the possibility of under representation of pro-social encounters and over representation of anti-social, possibly isolated, events, we cannot conclude, from the stated and unstated incidents, that every encounter with the police endangers a life. Furthermore, to conclude that the police should not be called except for a last resort can lead to the endangerment of life. Consider a scenario in which a person attempted to stop a bank robbery. In believing that the police should not be called because they believe that they can handle the situation, this person grabs a gun and attempts to stop said robbery. It is entirely possible that said person is untrained and, by his actions, endangers his life and the life of the innocent people inside the bank. It may result in the harm or loss of life that, otherwise, the police could have prevented through their training. There are many situations in which the police are specifically trained to handle that much of the general population could not handle, so to say that the police should not be called under any circumstances except as a last resort is ill advised.

In a way, your argument seems ironic. The police should not be called because it always endangers a life but failing to call the police can endanger a life in itself. If we are to conclude definitely that there is a significant, and I stress significant, increase in the rate of police endangering lives, then a scientific study must be done. To argue without scientific evidence will not lead to progress in this discourse.

If you do have scientific evidence, please present it for discourse.

[Darklordabc]

To the groups of socially respected professionals and social leaders who, in fact, prey on people, causing death, illness, injuring, and suffering, we can add police. This is one example of how dangerous the police in fact are, and can only lead to the conclusion that every encounter with police threatens a person's life, and that the police ought not be called except as a last resort,

I'm chalking your absurd statement up to an attempt of being deliberately incendiary to start a debate. Well you got me. I'm only half-way through the video, but most of these lefties are so obviously trying to troll police its infuriating. Bar one or two psycho cops, the rest have been trouble-making leftists who have nothing better to do but break laws (albeit very minor laws) and use up valuable police resources, in some strange attempt to prove a point.
If somebody is blowing bubbles in your direction with the intent of pissing you of, that's a chargeable offense in my legal opinion.

Edit: After watching all of that, there are definitely at least 4 examples of real police brutality. But the majority are not real examples.

[Winter wind]

This is one example of how dangerous the police in fact are, and can only lead to the conclusion that every encounter with police threatens a person's life, and that the police ought not be called except as a last resort,

Isn't this argument a textbook example of the hasty generalization logical fallacy? I mean, I would be far more concerned if you linked us to a study showing 90% of encounters with cops end in pepper spray. Maybe you have in the past and I didn't see it. Regardless, I know a few police officers and this isn't representative of the ones I know, at least.

(I'm basically repeating samson).

[ruksak]

Though actual physical brutality is a minority occurring, I find it curious that many states had laws against pointing your camera at them, even when not interfering with their duties. Yet they could point their cameras at you. To my knowledge, this was shot down by Federal appeals courts on September 1, 2011.

Putting the police in a position whereas they're above the laws that we, as citizens are bound to, is step #1 to many problems. Google 'Michael Allison' if you need an example (faced 75 years in prison for "eavesdropping"). The police could record you without your permission, for their own protection, but you could not record them for your protection.

Most police impropriety isn't of the overt 'physically brutal' variety. Usually it is far more innocuous. Being given so much leverage to act above the law creates a 'god complex'.

[barts]

Isn't this argument a textbook example of the hasty generalization logical fallacy? I mean, I would be far more concerned if you linked us to a study showing 90% of encounters with cops end in pepper spray. Maybe you have in the past and I didn't see it. Regardless, I know a few police officers and this isn't representative of the ones I know, at least.

(I'm basically repeating samson).

Quantifying police brutality and malfeasance is difficult because, not surprising, the police do not keep good records of their own crimes, and most victims simply take their beatings. Also, most investigations into police brutality are done by the police themselves, and they are notorious for protecting their own. There is copious evidence of police lying and manufacturing evidence.

That being said, in this world of every phone with a camera and Youtube the number of videos becoming public is in the many tens of thousands, all randomly caught. Police brutality is so prevalent that ordinary citizens are capturing it on video almost every day.



It seems to me that anyone who despite these reports remains undisturbed by the thousands of videos must be inured to the evidence. Surely, everyone, except those who approve of police brutality and criminality, should demand independent investigations into this very real problem.

[barts]

Police departments have, for too long, tried to bully, intimidate, threaten, arrest, or otherwise harass law abiding citizens from recording the activities of law enforcement in public. Enough is enough! It is time for all of us to take a stand and expose police brutality when we witness it. Even if the officers behavior is correct, and justifiable, we still encourage the recording of the police activities for the transparency and accountability that is desperately needed in many departments.

If you see something, film something, the freedom of press begins with you!

If you feel the need to upload this video to your Youtubes, please contact us and we will make sure you acquire a high quality version of the film with our info. And please, add our links in the description, thanks

Police Brutality

[lsbskins1]

Is there any institution on the face of the planet that you think is useful? Medical doctors are evil, mental health professionals are evil, police are evil. Who isn't evil, in your estimation? I can promise you, that if you can name any institution you think is worthy, I can find evidence of corrpution somewhere within that institution.

Why is it necessary to view the world in extremes? On one side, you have those who seem to feel that conservatisism demands they revere all institutions as bastians of virtue and on the other, there seems to be this belief that all institutions are inherenty bad and serve only to oppress. Neither view is rational, in my opinion. The truth is that every human institution is going to have examples of corruption, every class of humans you can imagine, be it racial classifications, ethnic, national, professional, or whatever...all will have those who are moral "failures" and many more who are not. The answer is not to either villify or elevate any class of people or institution, it is to understand that all are subject to the same "failure rates" and all, also, have inherent stregnths that make them beneficial and necessary.

We should be about the business of attempting to minimize the damage the few are capable of inflicting on the many, no matter what the institution. Destroying or villifying the whole will not fix the problem. It will create a whole new set of problems. When the "cure" is worse than the "disease", you have not offered a solution, you have compounded the problem.

[ruksak]

Is there any institution on the face of the planet that you think is useful? Medical doctors are evil, mental health professionals are evil, police are evil. Who isn't evil, in your estimation? I can promise you, that if you can name any institution you think is worthy, I can find evidence of corrpution somewhere within that institution.

Why is it necessary to view the world in extremes? On one side, you have those who seem to feel that conservatisism demands they revere all institutions as bastians of virtue and on the other, there seems to be this belief that all institutions are inherenty bad and serve only to oppress. Neither view is rational, in my opinion. The truth is that every human institution is going to have examples of corruption, every class of humans you can imagine, be it racial classifications, ethnic, national, professional, or whatever...all will have those who are moral "failures" and many more who are not. The answer is not to either villify or elevate any class of people or institution, it is to understand that all are subject to the same "failure rates" and all, also, have inherent stregnths that make them beneficial and necessary.

We should be about the business of attempting to minimize the damage the few are capable of inflicting on the many, no matter what the institution. Destroying or villifying the whole will not fix the problem. It will create a whole new set of problems. When the "cure" is worse than the "disease", you have not offered a solution, you have compounded the problem.

Obviously it is fallacious to state that all police are crooked. It is also a fallacy to presume that all police are out to get you. However, there is a serious problem with police and their inherent overabundance of authority. They are given far more authority than what is necessary to keep the peace.

One thing that sticks out to me while watching the videos posted above, as well as any video I've seen of excessive police force, is that citizens never strike back. Whether the person being assaulted by the police, or bystanders, no one ever strikes them back. To me, that is a problem. It shows the inherent fear of consequence for protecting ones self from criminal police action. No other occupation or classification of American is granted this sort of protection via fear of consequence.

"Criminal police action"...think about that. If an officer punches you in the face for smarting off to him, than you should be given full right to defend yourself. Good luck with that if no cameras are rolling. Hell, even if the incident is recorded in high definition, you better cross you fingers, because the way our system is set-up, you cannot strike an officer.

[barts]

Is there any institution on the face of the planet that you think is useful?

In fact, with few exceptions, I think most institutions are useful. I think, however, we should be clear-eyed about what they are. Too often we accept the mythologies these institutions and professions foist on us.

[lsbskins1]

In fact, with few exceptions, I think most institutions are useful. I think, however, we should be clear-eyed about what they are. Too often we accept the mythologies these institutions and professions foist on us.

So, you define being "clear eyed" as expecting every interaction to lead to your life being threatened?

[Choose Life]

...The fact is that America's police are waging war on ordinary citizens. Most of them are brutal and dangerous thugs--a gang in Blue. They are not protecting ordinary people, they are preying on them and brutalizing them.

On a dark street in the middle of the night, who would you rather encounter? A group of police officers or a group of armed Mexican gangbangers?

Not to say that unwarranted police aggression is not a dangerous precedent or otherwise should be tolerated, just that the REAL war being fought on your streets is being mostly overlooked.. The illegal street gangs spill far more of the blood of your countrymen than the police or even Muslim terrorists. The biggest fish isn't the one people seem to want to fry.