The Truth About Gun Control

[MerlinsByte]

By Pooeypants.......Do I feel oppressed about not being able to own a weapon that can kill at ease in med and long range? No, I don't and the majority of the British public doesn't feel so either.

Merlin writes.......First let me say Pooeypants I am not singling you out. Your writing just "sums up the opinion of the other side so well", so, my attention to your posts aren't personal in nature.

I live in the rural southeast where it is common a deer strapped to the hood as a SUV or pick up.So I may not live in the same enviroment many of you. Crime is a non issue here. I don't hunt for personal reasons, but do own several, ummm', to be exact a staniless .380, a Glock 9mm, one assault AK-47 style rifle, one bolt action rifle,two .22 plinker auto rifles, ahhh two shotguns... weapons. None were bought new or have a paper trail. Until now, I'd reckon.

I enjoy target shooting and even in a low crime area as in where I live, use these weapons for self defense. I sometimes wonder If the high ownership of guns is the reason for low crime here. May I ask the anti gun people here to do a thought experiment? If you were in bed with your wife, opened your eyes and saw a criminal (not your kids or dog)! coming at you with the intent to rape, kill, steal, then rape kill and steal, would you rather be armed with your voice and a cell phone or a 9 mm?

You call 911......I'll call on the 9mm....sorry and if someone was going away? I would have to be there, but I don't have too much sympathy for the criminal that was whacked, his untimely and regrettable demise may have saved your or your neighbors life.

ps Pooeypants you say you dont own a long or med range device for protection. What kind of short range protection do you own? .... A sawed off ,18" barrel length,12 ga. pump makes a fine home defense gun. One round of .00 one slug,one round of .00, one slug of......

mb

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: The Dunedan I long ago gave up on trying to win reasoned arguements with Hoplophobes. All of their arguements are based upon feelings and emotion, and no amount of evidence can sway them. One important distinction, however, I will point out to Pooey: The reason for the disparity between the UK crim rate and US is this; In the UK, only crimes for which someone is convicted are counted, whereas in the US it is crimes reported. This is one of several mechanisms used by the Home Office to disguse Britains' soaring violent-crime rate, and was reported on by the Times of London in November of last year, if I'm not mistaken. I'll source this tomorrow, as I am both tired and ill, and am going to bed.

Again I say, considering how most of British public have effectively not touched firearms see 1920's (apart from during WWII perhaps), surely a rise now recently wouldn't actually be a direct contribution from that fact.
And are you trying to tell me that in reality the guncrime per capita in US and UK is really the same?

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: MerlinsByte I enjoy target shooting and even in a low crime area as in where I live, use these weapons for self defense. I sometimes wonder If the high ownership of guns is the reason for low crime here. May I ask the anti gun people here to do a thought experiment? If you were in bed with your wife, opened your eyes and saw a criminal (not your kids or dog)! coming at you with the intent to rape, kill, steal, then rape kill and steal, would you rather be armed with your voice and a cell phone or a 9 mm? You call 911......I'll call on the 9mm....sorry and if someone was going away? I would have to be there, but I don't have too much sympathy for the criminal that was whacked, his untimely and regrettable demise may have saved your or your neighbors life. ps Pooeypants you say you dont own a long or med range device for protection. What kind of short range protection do you own? .... A sawed off ,18" barrel length,12 ga. pump makes a fine home defense gun. One round of .00 one slug,one round of .00, one slug of...... mb

Most criminals such as burglars don't usually possess firearms, after all, they are costly and even harder to obtain as they are illegal here. So, if you legalise firearms, what's to stop the burglar from easily obtaining a legitimate firearm? So he goes in your house...it'll be a matter of who draws first and with your disadvantaged as having just woken up.

[Mr.Vicchio]

One of the first things I plan on doing when I return to God's Country (that would be Texas to those on the left coast) is to apply for my concealed handgun permit. Actually my Fiance may beat me to it hehe. We want:

2 pistols (I want a Barretta she wants a Luger)
2 Shotguns (One pump one auto)
3 Rifles (.230 30-30 M-1)

And ya know what, if someone broke into my house, he'd be a dead man. The criminal forfits his life when he enters your house. If he lives he got lucky, if he dies he wasn't.

[Pooeypants]

You know, the Comedian Michael Moore's (that's how I see him) film Bowling for Columbine had a cartoon showing a satirical brief overview of America and it's formation. Now I don't buy that crap about the NRA/KKK, but what I did find truly amusing was all the fear and paranoia that the colonials were show to have, reflects reality quite fervertly.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Fear and Paranoia? What are you talking about?

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Fear and Paranoia? What are you talking about?

I'm willing to accept the need of handguns for protection but shotgun and rifle? I'm not so sure about. Are you afraid the intruders might wear armoured jackets?

Though to be honest I was more thinking about this post

Quote by: Retired Guy Poor choice on the girls part (and that of their parents for allowing it), running around the neighborhood at night, ringing peoples doorbells and then running away. Fair warning: You come creeping around MY house in the middle of the night, you get what ever HAPPENS to you, as the safety of my family comes FIRST. Oh, you were just delivering COOKIES in the middle of the night..... too bad, so sad..... I'll put flowers on your grave!

You don't think that sounds like someone who is paranoid?

[Mr.Vicchio]

A pump action 12-Guage has a rather distinct sound. What better whay to scare the hell out of an intruder (thus negating any need to shoot them) then by chambring a round?

I know few people that would claim to need a hunting rifle to protect thier house. I for one want the shot guns for Dove hunting, and the rifles for Deer and Boar. The pistols more for shooting targets (which is hella' fun) then for actually gunning anyone down.

Now if I owned land, lets say 50+ acres, sure I'd want the rifles for defense of my land. You put up no tresspassing signs, and someone is tresspassing.... Would you rather use a pistol or a rifle?

[Pooeypants]

Well for a start, I'd want to get up close enough to them to question why they are on my land as opposed to picking them off in the distance.

[Mr.Vicchio]

You sir, have a death wish. "Gee that guy ignored all my signs saying stay off the property... will shoot tresspassers.. I should ask him what he is doing..."

"No Tresspassing" means... don't get on my land. If you are you automatically annoint yourself as being someone up to no good. My life, my families life is far more important to me then the life of someone who chooses to ignore such signs.

(Most likely I would hit them rock salt)

[Chris the Chees]

I suspect that I have read more about this case than you have Mr Marine Corps.

1. As for the sentence, it was reduced to manslaughter.

2. The law is very specific about what you can and cannot do ion the "name of home defence", shooting a burglar in the head at something like 10 yards, is not "minimum necessary force".

3. Owning unregistered fire arms is not legal.

4. Theft in this country is punished by fines and custodial sentences, not execution.

5. Most home owners don't have serious mental issues that make them unstable.



Martin commited a crime, and he has paid for it, we have laws for a reason. If people choose to ignore them, then they diserve everything thats coming too them.



Some real facts about Gun control: -

1. Rightwingers with an agender to push claim that guns in the home protect people from crime.

2. The USA has vertually no gun control laws.

3. In the UK we have some stringant gun control laws.

4. Conservatives argue gun ownership makes society safer. I disagree: -

- US Gun crime = 353,880

- UK Gun Crime = 10,000

http://www.channel4.com/news/2003/01...2/9_crime.html


http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm

5. Gun ownership doesn't stop crime, the conservatives are wrong, as usual.

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio You sir, have a death wish. "Gee that guy ignored all my signs saying stay off the property... will shoot tresspassers.. I should ask him what he is doing..." "No Tresspassing" means... don't get on my land. If you are you automatically annoint yourself as being someone up to no good. My life, my families life is far more important to me then the life of someone who chooses to ignore such signs. (Most likely I would hit them rock salt)

What if they were just kids? Teenagers that thought it would be okay to trespass for a shortcut?
If you truly valued all human life you wouldn't be so trigger happy.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Haveing done just that, crossing a field as a short cut and getting fired on... hehe I know it sucks (my buddy got a large chunk of rock salt in his right but cheek for our efforts) BUT it's the property owners discretion. If it were teens, it would depend on the time of day and what htey were doing. If it looked like they were just "crossing the field" I would fire a shot away from them just to scare them or fire rock salt in thier general direction. If it was after dark and I saw someone... well...

That's different.

I value life, but not at the cost of my own.

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Haveing done just that, crossing a field as a short cut and getting fired on... hehe I know it sucks (my buddy got a large chunk of rock salt in his right but cheek for our efforts) BUT it's the property owners discretion. If it were teens, it would depend on the time of day and what htey were doing. If it looked like they were just "crossing the field" I would fire a shot away from them just to scare them or fire rock salt in thier general direction. If it was after dark and I saw someone... well... That's different. I value life, but not at the cost of my own.

Wouldn't you at least wait for confirmation that the intruder was actually hostile & dangerous?
Seems like this "Shoot first, ask questions later" is quite unnecessary. Do you live a really violent area with plenty of gun crime? If you did it would be understandable.

[Mr.Vicchio]

It's not gun crime Pooey, which you are so stuck on, it's CRIME in general. I don't trust people. A criminal doesn't need a gun to kill you, or beat you, or rpae your wife and kids.

Would you be able to live with yourself if you let such happen to your family? Say you saw someone on your property and drove out to them, only to get a gun/weapon stuck in your face, your wife and daughter raped while you watched? Is that worth the risk considering such can and has happened before?

That's the real question, is you and your families life worth the risk?

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio It's not gun crime Pooey, which you are so stuck on, it's CRIME in general. I don't trust people. A criminal doesn't need a gun to kill you, or beat you, or rpae your wife and kids.

Okay, so first of all, why don't you trust people? Are the people in the area that bad?

So if the criminal isn't likely to have a gun? Or is he/she? Why would I want to shot an unarmed man from far off?

Anyway, I think the above quote demonstrates how full of fear and paranoia you are.

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Would you be able to live with yourself if you let such happen to your family? Say you saw someone on your property and drove out to them, only to get a gun/weapon stuck in your face, your wife and daughter raped while you watched? Is that worth the risk considering such can and has happened before?

Like I said, if this happens frequently, I'd be wary of doing so but if it's just a slim possibility, I'd rather not risk hurting an unlawful trespasser who has no real ill intentions upon me and my family.

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio That's the real question, is you and your families life worth the risk?

I'd weigh it against if it is worth killing someone with no bad intentions against me.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Crime happens, even in quiet small towns. Texas (where I will move too)is a border state, and the incidents of violent break-ins is much higher then say here in Maine where I am at currently

It's not paranoia, if I put up signs every ten yards as required by law saying "NO TRESSPASSING" and someone ignores that, chances are they are not just happy go lucky innocent people.

Hoping that just because you live in a low crime area means you are immune from such is foolhardy.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Chris, nice numbers but they are absolutely POINTLESS.

Utter trash.

Useful numbers you should go dig up:

Population sizes and the corralation to those numbers you provided

Number of guns used by criminals vs lawfully owened weapons by their rightful owners in a crime.

Violent Crimes Vs Non-violent Crimes.

Home intrustions occupied Vs Unoccupied

Better yet, get the crime numbers for Chicago and DC vs Say Houston and Dallas. (I love that one)

[Scribbler1]

Quote by: Pooeypants Okay, so first of all, why don't you trust people? Are the people in the area that bad? So if the criminal isn't likely to have a gun? Or is he/she? Why would I want to shot an unarmed man from far off? Anyway, I think the above quote demonstrates how full of fear and paranoia you are.

Personally, I think posts like those simply give the anti-gun people more ammunition because it makes gun owners look like paranoid and bloodthirsty killers who like to shoot anything that moves.
I think this is also a lot of hot air and the cookie girls won't be slaughtered on somebody's porch and the teenagers with the ATVs out on someone's south 40 will not be picked off by a homeowner/sniper.
It's big talk but I'd bet a paycheck it won't happen, as all the gun owners I know would actually USE the weapon as a last resort and we much prefer target shooting.

[SunnyBeaches]

I live in a relatively low crime area and city. I have a gun and I WILL use it with no questions asked! Not at someone in my yard (which is 3/4 acre surrounded by a 6' wood privacy fence.......in that instance I would call the police) but at anyone that attempts to break into my house! I would NEVER wait for the police to arrive if someone were breaking into or had already broken into my home. BOOM! BOOM! Game over! I am not an inexperienced gun owner.....I have been hunting since I was about 11 or 12 years old and am pretty much a dead aim.......but I wouldn't stop with just one shot at an intruder in my house! 2 shots aimed at the chest should do it........it's a bigger target than their head!