Mail Order Brides: A Disturbing Phenomenon In America

[DoloresIbarruri]

Quote by: syracusa I am not sure exactly how Americans evolved into this "on-your-own" state of mind, but on a superficial level, I guess everyone calls it "individualism". Maybe in the begining (colonial times), the newly-formed society still preserved some of the old Euroopean ways, but then...whatever individualistic bug pushed these people to break away with the village-like European ways, acted further to take individualism one step further...and then the extended family stopped mattering, everything started to revolve arund the nuclear family - and here you had the "do-it-alone" American people.

Yes, it's an odd thing, the way this "independent" U.S. streak hasdestroyed the extended family and is now on the way to destroying the nuclear family.

[syracusa]

Mia,

I would not say that Eastern Europe still has "arranged marriages", in the literal sense of the word. It doesn't. Though some still happen in a very masked, beat-about-the-bush kind of way.

HOWEVER: people (women much more than men) are faced with huge societal pressure to "get hooked" by a certain age.

There is a serious stigma attached to not having a boyfriend after a certain age (early twenties) and not being married by a given age (mid twenties I would say).
It is in Eastern Europe that parents still say "better to have a widowed daughter than a spinster in your house". :eek:

If you are not steadily "going out" in some male company, there is the automatic assumption that there is something wrong with you, that you are deficient in some kind of way, that men don't like you (which is a major no, no).

There is no such thing as "I have not found a man that I liked".
It is only "THEY (the men!) don't like YOU!" Hence YOU - the woman - is the deficient one. Better do something to change yourself so that SOME man (to be read ANY man, when the situation gets really desperate) will be nice enough to date you.
And believe me, the situation gets desperate pretty soon.

This was the mentality that literally chased me out of that country. Not economic issues.

Here I met an American man that makes people green with envy when we visit home together. Somehow, this incredible guy with 100 things going on for him - from looks, to job, to intelligence, to economic situation and everything in between - deemed me "worthy".

But over there I was just "not liked" by any of the men. That was the general assumption.
I was a virgin until I was 24 (never dated a man in my country) simply because I did not find a single one that I would have wanted to date. Truth be told, men weren't crazy about me either, maybe they sensed that I was expecting more than the average EE women was? I don't know.

But people did not see it this way - my own family included. The problem was with ME.
As a woman, you are supposed to do anything to be wanted by a man.
Do not be too picky, just make sure some man agrees to date you.

The mentalities can kill you over there. But what kills me even more is how Eastern European women are MASTERS at fostering their own oppression and their own screwy situation in society. They are always miserable in their relationships (any wonder?) but they do NOTHING to hold men responsible for all those miseries. Or societal values of pressuring women into lowering their standards to an embarassing level.

They adopt those values and love to oprress themselves by saying "what can you do? there's nothing you can do about it, this is how men are".
In additon, women hate each other to death.

I have a neighbor there who at the age of 60, has become so bitter about men in that country (including her own drunkard husband) that she always says:

"You know...it is not men's fault. It's us, the women. It is US who do this to ourselves".

And I agree. Unfortunately, she is one of the extrenely few who are able to see the truth. A little too late in her case.

It is pathetic what's going on. So I left "the village" and came here to deal with an overly individualistic culture (the other extreme). I changed the devil I knew for the devil I didn't.
But I am glad becasue had I not, I would have never met my husband who is literally the light of my life.

[syracusa]

Quote by: DoloresIbarruri Yes, it's an odd thing, the way this "independent" U.S. streak hasdestroyed the extended family and is now on the way to destroying the nuclear family.

Yeap. Here we have a whole different set of problems.

Why can't people just have it together? Like Mia said...somewhere "in between"? :(

[DoloresIbarruri]

Quote by: syracusa Mia, I would not say that Eastern Europe still has "arranged marriages", in the literal sense of the word. It doesn't. Though some still happen in a very masked, beat-about-the-bush kind of way. HOWEVER: people (women much more than men) are faced with huge societal pressure to "get hooked" by a certain age. There is a serious stigma attached to not having a boyfriend after a certain age (early twenties) and not being married by a given age (mid twenties I would say). It is in Eastern Europe that parents still say "better to have a widowed daughter than a spinster in your house". :eek: If you are not steadily "going out" in some male company, there is the automatic assumption that there is something wrong with you, that you are deficient in some kind of way, that men don't like you (which is a major no, no). There is no such thing as "I have not found a man that I liked". It is only "THEY (the men!) don't like YOU!" Hence YOU - the woman - is the deficient one. Better do something to change yourself so that SOME man (to be read ANY man, when the situation gets really desperate) will be nice enough to date you. And believe me, the situation gets desperate pretty soon. This was the mentality that literally chased me out of that country. Not economic issues. Here I met an American man that makes people green with envy when we visit home together. Somehow, this incredible guy with 100 things going on for him - from looks, to job, to intelligence, to economic situation and everything in between - deemed me "worthy". But over there I was just "not liked" by any of the men. That was the general assumption. I was a virgin until I was 24 (never dated a man in my country) simply because I did not find a single one that I would have wanted to date. Truth be told, men weren't crazy about me either, maybe they sensed that I was expecting more than the average EE women was? I don't know. But people did not see it this way - my own family included. The problem was with ME. As a woman, you are supposed to do anything to be wanted by a man. Do not be too picky, just make sure some man agrees to date you. The mentalities can kill you over there. But what kills me even more is how Eastern European women are MASTERS at fostering their own oppression and their own screwy situation in society. They are always miserable in their relationships (any wonder?) but they do NOTHING to hold men responsible for all those miseries. Or societal values of pressuring women into lowering their standards to an embarassing level. They adopt those values and love to oprress themselves by saying "what can you do? there's nothing you can do about it, this is how men are". In additon, women hate each other to death. I have a neighbor there who at the age of 60, has become so bitter about men in that country (including her own drunkard husband) that she always says: "You know...it is not men's fault. It's us, the women. It is US who do this to ourselves". And I agree. Unfortunately, she is one of the extrenely few who are able to see the truth. A little too late in her case. It is pathetic what's going on. So I left "the village" and came here to deal with an overly individualistic culture (the other extreme). I changed the devil I knew for the devil I didn't. But I am glad becasue had I not, I would have never met my husband who is literally the light of my life.

How interesting. I heard the same thing goes on in Russia. Funny thing tho, in Spain, women get married at a rather advanced age without any stigma at all. For example, a woman can marry at 30, 31, 32 and nobody thinks a thing of it. In fact, it's thought of as rather cool.

Wonder how those things get started?

[cheesenuggett]

mail order brides, thats sick, i think any use of a women as property is disgusting, how are mail order brides not viewed as a form of prostitutiopn?

[tinybear]

Because you don't marry a prostitute?

[cheesenuggett]

well, what would be a reason for ordering a bride? are you going to order one and not have sexual relations with her?