Homosexual Marriage

[Dirty Name]

I'd venture to say that couple-to-couple, almost no sexual behavior is exactly the same. (Here are some examples from Dr. Phil.). Some couples have sex three times a day, others live in sexless marriages. Some have affairs, some have consensual sex with others, some married couples even have homosexual affairs. My point is that sex and marriage are (sadly, for those men whose wives lose their sex drive right around the time they walk down the aisle) often unrelated. The best marriages don't rely on great sex to continue, but rather great friendships.

Irrelevant. We aren't talking about sexual activity. We are talking about the impact of a sexual relationship on society and on the couple, regardless of frequency and regardless of any of the other factors you mentioned.

When you break it down, a heterosexual union carries with it a significantly higher burden (and potential benefit) to society and the individuals in the union than does a homosexual union.

[Dirty Name]

Duplicate post

[Dirty Name]

What is the potential EFFECT on society of same sex marraige? (Impact implies some sort of physical contact, effect is the proper term)

You tell me.

[Dirty Name]

Someone explain to me again how same sex marraige is going to hurt my relationship.

In the same way a counterfeit $50 bill spent by someone else hurts the legitimate bills in your wallet...

[Dirty Name]

I'm tired of hearing about my friends having to show a marraige certificate to visit thier partner was dying in the hospital when the hospital knows full well the reason why he cannot produce one.

How is that discriminating against gays? Answer: It's not. Because unmarried heterosexuals would also be barred from visitation under the hospital rules.

Don't like it? Take it up with the hospital. It has nothing to do with marriage and everything to do with bad policy. It shouldn't matter if one is married or not. A significant other, regardless of sexual orientation, should be allowed to visit a hospital patient if they have a serious relationship.

Next red herring please.

Also, homosexuals being financially recognised would have no effect on heterosexual couples.

Already available to any two people, regardless of sexual orientation, gender, etc. It's commonly referred to as a PRIVATE CONTRACT, and sometimes takes the form of a LIVING WILL, a LAST WILL AND TESTAMENT, PARTNERSHIP AGREEMENTS, etc.

Next red herring please.

I'm tired of the other hundreds of little things you'd never expect to come due to this discrimination hitting me and my partner in the goddamn face like the legal equivalent of a semi.

Specifics, please.

[fushigi]

What is the potential EFFECT on society of same sex marraige? (Impact implies some sort of physical contact, effect is the proper term)

Quote by: Dirty You tell me.

No, it's not up to us to provide examples supporting your argument. Please provide them yourself.

[Dirty Name]

No, it's not up to us to provide examples supporting your argument. Please provide them yourself.

Uh... perhaps you don't realize that my argument claims there isn't much impact... (or effect) from a homosexual relationship. Thus to prove me wrong, you'll need to be the one demonstrating otherwise, genius.

[fushigi]

Quote by: Dirty Name Uh... perhaps you don't realize that my argument claims there isn't much impact... (or effect) from a homosexual relationship. Thus to prove me wrong, you'll need to be the one demonstrating otherwise, genius.

No, I'm not. I wasn't the one who claimed the "impact" on society is different. You were.

Quote by: Dirty When you compare sexual relationships between heterosexual couples versus same-sex couples, the potential impact on society and on the couple - good or bad - is NOT equal. Therefore, same-sex relationships don't need to be treated equally by society.

I don't claim to be a genius, but at least I can remember what I've been arguing from one post to the next. You, apparently, cannot.

[Pockets]

hey what if..The Seattle Times: Search Results

[Zee-Axis]

Quote by: Dirty Name In the same way a counterfeit $50 bill spent by someone else hurts the legitimate bills in your wallet...

Only when you begin with the assumption that the first $50 isn't legitimate.
Your analogy isn't relevant.

[Mozart1220]

Quote by: Dirty Name In the same way a counterfeit $50 bill spent by someone else hurts the legitimate bills in your wallet...

That's a really bad analogy, but to answer you anyway, you are telling us that a counterfet $50 in my wallett makes all the other money counterfeit?

Is THAT what you are trying to tell us?

No seriously, how can a marraige between two people of the same sex HURT OR HARM anyone elses relationship? Are you saying that if Gays are allowed to marry, I will have to split up with my wife?


You say the "impact" will be different. How about some examples?

Still sounds like Homophobic, bigoted BS to me...

[Mozart1220]

Quote by: Dirty Name Nope. How do you figure that? Clearly, a lesbian must get sperm from a third party, which is outside the lesbian relationship. Even if that third party waives all legal rights to the child, we aren't talking about an exclusively lesbian relationship, due to the possibility that the donor could legally attempt to reassert paternity rights if he chooses to do so. Thus, any sperm donor must be considered a third party, i.e. not an exclusively lesbian relationship.

It IS possible (though difficult) for two women to procreate, though they could only produce girls. They lack they "Y" chromosome to produce a boy. It's been tested on animals, though I haven't heard of any human testing to date...

[Dirty Name]

That's a really bad analogy, but to answer you anyway, you are telling us that a counterfet $50 in my wallett makes all the other money counterfeit?

No, I'm saying it threatens the real money in your wallet because it destabilizes the entire currency system if left unchecked.

Likewise, same-sex marriage threatens the institution of marriage rather than individual marriages.

[Dirty Name]

It IS possible (though difficult) for two women to procreate, though they could only produce girls. They lack they "Y" chromosome to produce a boy. It's been tested on animals, though I haven't heard of any human testing to date...

Irrelevant. Sexual relationships between two women do not carry with them the same consequences - both positive and negative - that sexual relationships between males and females carry. End of story. You people can conjure up all the bizarre genetic experimentation you want, it doesn't change the basic biological fact that sexual relationships between males and females are more significant to society and the individuals involved than sexual relationships between same sex couples.

In the latter, all you have is physical and emotional gratification. In the former, you have the same gratification issues PLUS the additional - and awesome - potential to create new human life, and all of the life-changing decisions that go along with that responsibility.

This is simply not an apples to apples comparison.

[Dirty Name]

Only when you begin with the assumption that the first $50 isn't legitimate. Your analogy isn't relevant.

Let's explore that. Why isn't that first $50 bill legitimate? I made it in my basement with high-quality engraving plates and a fine grade linen type paper. The ink is identical in color to a real $50 bill. I even managed to embed the security thread and the watermark. But the fact remains that I made this bill and it wasn't printed by the US Government.

Do you agree that the bill is counterfeit, and thus, not legitimate?

Why then, can we not say the same thing about a gay marriage not recognized by the government?

More importantly, how is my analogy not relevant?

[Zee-Axis]

Quote by: Dirty Name No, I'm saying it threatens the real money in your wallet because it destabilizes the entire currency system if left unchecked. Likewise, same-sex marriage threatens the institution of marriage rather than individual marriages.

How does infidelity figure into your monetary system? Do divorce and adultery (at all-time highs with heterosexual marraiges), also de-stabalize your $50 dollar bill?

and what are you doing, flashing that $50 around anyway. Maybe you should consider keeping it to yourself.

[Dirty Name]

Quote by: fushigi No, I'm not. I wasn't the one who claimed the "impact" on society is different. You were.

Are you telling me that sexual relations between gay people has the exact same impact on society as a sexual relationship between a male and a female?

I'm guessing you're about to answer your own question.

[Dirty Name]

How does infidelity figure into your monetary system? Do divorce and adultery (at all-time highs with heterosexual marraiges), also de-stabalize your $50 dollar bill?

More irrelevance. Divorce and infedility are failings of individual marriages, not of the institution. Likewise, people who rip their money in half or burn it in fireplace are not proof that the economy is failing.

[Dirty Name]

No seriously, how can a marraige between two people of the same sex HURT OR HARM anyone elses relationship?

No, seriously. How can a counterfeit $50 bill HURT OR HARM anyone else's $50 bill?

Are you saying that if Gays are allowed to marry, I will have to split up with my wife?

Are you really so ignorant that you believe that's what I'm saying?

[Dirty Name]

Still sounds like Homophobic, bigoted BS to me...

Still sounds like typical liberal stupidity to me. If you can't win using logic, demonize your opponent by pointing fingers and calling names.

You say the "impact" will be different. How about some examples?

I've done this countless times. Try reading my original argument, entitled "The Secular Case Against Gay Marriage," for which I provide a link in EVERY post I make on Volconvo, because it never fails that some name-calling, finger-pointing hot-head comes in and tries to challenge the logic of my argument BEFORE he's taken the time to read and comprehend it.