Do inmates get too many privileges?

[Silent Munkey]

Why, when has abusing some one ever taught them to respect?

They are not truly punished they way they should be. Hitting someone from time to time and keeping them in the prisons we have today is hardly abuse.

Because america is made up of sheeple and we can't have anyone thinking for themselves, now, can we.

They gave up the right when they robbed the store, raped the person or broke any number of laws.

You lot really do not know much about prisons or prison life do you. For quite a lot of them going to prison is nothing more than paying their dues to belong to a gang. Those that they consider family are the people in prison, they have nothing to fear in there.

Change the prison system to what I want and it wouldn't be a rite of passage for any gang. There wouldn't be families on the inside. Everyone would fear prison.

It is only the amatuer, the once off criminal, those with no connection that fear prison.

This isn't the guy I would want to go to prison... =) This is the public flogging or 'example'.

As i pointed out before and all of you others have tried to ignore. The only bad thing about prison is the loss of freedom.

And it shouldn't stop there.

[barts]

I do believe that after 10 years of being told what to do and not be given even the slightest option to act otherwise would change a person. They wouldn't get worse...it would break them. Well break them or kill them.

As satisfying and enjoyable as the ill treatment of people in jail may be to you personally, the consequences of it for society are truly dangerous. A person who is treated in prison as you'd enjoy them being treated once released is unable to function in regular society and quickly becomes a dangerous threat, but that doesn't seem to worry you.

You seem to welcome the idea of doing everything possible to turn a person who is a threat to society into an even greater threat and danger. And, if it can be done as cruelly as possible so much the better.

Am I misstating your position?

[Diogenes]

The humane thing would be to kill them. Humane for them and society at large.

That may seem harsh...but I find the way we deal with them now to be more inhumane to them and to society.

But...along with that...I've also said the prisons are full of people who don't even belong there...that we should use alternative methods to deal with them...and that prisons should be abolished altogether.

I only advocate the killing of the worst of the lot...the ones that should never be re-released upon society...the ones you never want moving in next door to you, dating your daughter, or hanging around the schoolyard.

Now I know someone ( let's not mention names ) will want to pipe up...something along the lines of:

' my daughters dating a guy I don't like, with a bad attitude, I don't want him dating my daughter, should we kill him too? '

which would be a completely ridiculous statement entirely out of context...but hey, I expect it...come now, don't be shy...say something stupid

[SoylentGreen]

They are not truly punished they way they should be. Hitting someone from time to time and keeping them in the prisons we have today is hardly abuse.

Nor should it be abuse. We throw people in jail for being abusive to others and you want them treated with abuse when they get in there.
Does the word hypocrite come to your mind.

They gave up the right when they robbed the store, raped the person or broke any number of laws.

True, but the rest of society did not give up it's right to behave in a humane manner because they did those things.

Change the prison system to what I want and it wouldn't be a rite of passage for any gang. There wouldn't be families on the inside. Everyone would fear prison.

Which only means they will try harder not to get caught. and if the punishment for killing someone is the same as not killing someone, then guess how hard they will try to stay out of prison.

This isn't the guy I would want to go to prison... =) This is the public flogging or 'example'.

Things like public flogging and other humiliations and torture have been used throughout history. And not one of those methods can make a claim for successfully stopping crime.

And it shouldn't stop there

Because you really have no clue about what that feels like.

[samsara15]

In this nutty world, we are all inmates. Given that many may be imprisoned unfairly or unjustly, or for social or political reasons, in a nation that imprisons a large percentge of its population, I can find many other more important things to complain about.

[Silent Munkey]

As satisfying and enjoyable as the ill treatment of people in jail may be to you personally, the consequences of it for society are truly dangerous. A person who is treated in prison as you'd enjoy them being treated once released is unable to function in regular society and quickly becomes a dangerous threat, but that doesn't seem to worry you.

You seem to welcome the idea of doing everything possible to turn a person who is a threat to society into an even greater threat and danger. And, if it can be done as cruelly as possible so much the better.

Am I misstating your position?

Yes you are. =) I would not enjoy what would be done to them in prison. You count me as a cruel person. The goal isn't for the people to 'get better' in prison. If they are in there then they did something to get in there. If they were good then they wouldn't be mistreated.

The idea behind making a prison a horrible place is having society fear going into one. I would not enjoy the conditions of a prison. The thought that anyone would enjoy it makes me a little sick. (Have I said enjoy enough?)

What do parents alway tell their children? "This is going to hurt me more than it hurts you." They don't enjoy the punishment...but they carry it out anyway.

[Silent Munkey]

What would you guys do? Put them up in a nice bed and give them 3 meals a day and have them sit around and talk about their feelings all day? Give the the option to get educated and work release and cable television. Never mind... that is what we do now. Prisons work to a point. They do not work as well as they could and they sure as hell don't reform criminals.

I have always had a plan for myself if I was at the very end of my ability to look after myself and keep money in my pocket. I have one person in my life that I deemed long ago to be a blight on humanity. I would kill him then give myself up. (I actually struck the guy from that list a while back. He is turning himself around. Now I have no one to kill... =) ) I hear the prisons are nice and cozy.

My life will never come to that though. Everything I have now I have worked hard to get and it pains me to see people living for free.

[SoylentGreen]

Yes you are. =) I would not enjoy what would be done to them in prison. You count me as a cruel person. The goal isn't for the people to 'get better' in prison. If they are in there then they did something to get in there. If they were good then they wouldn't be mistreated.

.

Why isn't the goal for people to get better while in prison?
I don't think your cruel just not thinking things through.
You say if they were good they wouldn't be mistreated. , but also recommend brutalising them , contradiction don't you think.

The idea behind making a prison a horrible place is having society fear going into one. I would not enjoy the conditions of a prison. The thought that anyone would enjoy it makes me a little sick. (Have I said enjoy enough?)

Such simplistic thinking is why prisons don't work. Prisons have been around for thousands of years and yet we still need them.
and again you display a complete ignorance on prison and institutionalisation .

What do parents alway tell their children? "This is going to hurt me more than it hurts you." They don't enjoy the punishment...but they carry it out anyway

By doing as you suggest and creating brutal uncaring home life for their kids.
You are obviously just as ignorant on child raising then.

[Diogenes]

If we have to have prisons...then we should ensure that their stay there is safe, well-kept, and they are afforded only the necessities of life.

They should be put in a cell of their own, with a clean bed, toilet, a desk, get 3 square meals a day in their cell, access to books, no contact at all with other prisoners ( except from one cell to the next ), private yard/shower time, to work out, clean up, exercise outside their cell...

and little if anything else.

Most of the problems in prison are as a result of allowing the population to mix...in the yard, during meals, showers, etc...by not allowing them to mix you effectively reduce the problems, especially the safety risks to inmates and guards, by a substantial amount.

Simple fact...you can't stab someone, rape someone, assault someone, etc if you are denied access to them. You can't revolt, overpower guards, etc...easily...if it's just you. And it would greatly reduce the drug, and disease problem.

I'm not talking isolation...just inaccessibility.

Prisons, if we must have them...should be ' safe ' environments...and the inmates should be ' well taken care of '...but they should not have TV's, Radios, or any luxuries of any kind.

Necessities only.

The only thing I would allow in prisons that are not a necessity would be books...and they would only be educational-type books.

[SoylentGreen]

If we have to have prisons...then we should ensure that their stay there is safe, well-kept, and they are afforded only the necessities of life.

They should be put in a cell of their own, with a clean bed, toilet, a desk, get 3 square meals a day in their cell, access to books, no contact at all with other prisoners ( except from one cell to the next ), private yard/shower time, to work out, clean up, exercise outside their cell...

and little if anything else.

.

And the purpose of this is what?

Most of the problems in prison are as a result of allowing the population to mix...in the yard, during meals, showers, etc...by not allowing them to mix you effectively reduce the problems, especially the safety risks to inmates and guards, by a substantial amount.

Simple fact...you can't stab someone, rape someone, assault someone, etc if you are denied access to them. You can't revolt, overpower guards, etc...easily...if it's just you. And it would greatly reduce the drug, and disease problem.

I'm not talking isolation...just inaccessibility.

Prisons, if we must have them...should be ' safe ' environments...and the inmates should be ' well taken care of '...but they should not have TV's, Radios, or any luxuries of any kind.

Necessities only

Good way to teach an anti social person how to socialise.
In the end we end up with people who need to be locked away forever at taxpayers expense or people let out of prison with few skills , no ability to get a job and a certainty to return to crime.

Great going diog. you certainly have come up with a complete failure to tackle the problems of crime.
By creating conditions that will lead to it.

[Diogenes]

Good way to teach an anti social person how to socialise.
In the end we end up with people who need to be locked away forever at taxpayers expense or people let out of prison with few skills , no ability to get a job and a certainty to return to crime.

Great going diog. you certainly have come up with a complete failure to tackle the problems of crime.
By creating conditions that will lead to it.

You're kidding, right...you think by allowing violent anti-social convicts to mix that you're teaching them social skills...gawd, that's a new one.

All you're succeeding in doing is creating more victims...usually the social ones.

And creating an unsafe environment for everyone including those in charge of keeping them in there.

And , as usual...you're not looking at this in context of other statements I've made...you're probably assuming that this would include minimum security convicts, like the guy who stole a TV...or the guy who had a bag of weed on him...
who I believe shouldn't even be in prison.

You really need to learn ' context '...we would probably agree a lot more if you see beyond the few words in a single post.

[SoylentGreen]

You're kidding, right...you think by allowing violent anti-social convicts to mix that you're teaching them social skills...gawd, that's a new one.

All you're succeeding in doing is creating more victims...usually the social ones.

And creating an unsafe environment for everyone including those in charge of keeping them in there.

And , as usual...you're not looking at this in context of other statements I've made...you're probably assuming that this would include minimum security convicts, like the guy who stole a TV...or the guy who had a bag of weed on him...
who I believe shouldn't even be in prison.

As far as i am aware this is your first mention of any separation of security levels.

And all your method is doing is creating criminals.
It is your method that creates an unsafe environment because in it the prisoner has nothing to lose.

No i am assuming you haven't got a clue what goes on in a prison. Prisoners get moved from differing security levels depending on their behaviour. The higher the security level the less freedom and personal goods a prisoner is allowed.

I cannot see anything in your other statements that suggest the context did not include minimum security.