Prostitution

[JaneDoe321]

I think there is plenty of evidence of people voluntarily living by more restrictive "laws", such as keeping kosher, or choosing more modest clothing, or not cutting your hair, or whatever. And I figure GO YOU if that's important to you. The line I draw is when people want me to live by their religious restrictions even tho I'm not an observant member of their religion.

[grandpa]

Quote by: JaneDoe321 I think there is plenty of evidence of people voluntarily living by more restrictive "laws", such as keeping kosher, or choosing more modest clothing, or not cutting your hair, or whatever. And I figure GO YOU if that's important to you.

That's a fascinating thing about the mind - it can be in dual states. People might not truly want to do something and may actually dread it, but they'll still consider it totally voluntary. I'm sure similar psychology motivates the Arab-Israeli war.

In fact, most are in an arrangement where this mind-state is necessary.

Grandpa h.

[big_lefty]

Quote by: DCAPBTLS77 Can you even imagine the taxes that could be made off of legalized prostitution, we could probably put a major dent in the national debt, And if you have enough imagination there are sex toys available in every store , Take a look around, massagers, KY jelly, spatulas , produce.....sex toys far as the eye can see ......Let me take it down to a really basic level , dating is kind of almost legalized prostitution anyway , all men pay for sex in some way, and all women sell it, i dare anyone to try and tell me im wrong,Marriage is stupid anyway, and all prostitution does is cut out allthe spending of money on nonsensical crap, like flowers and junk that men pay for in the hopes of getting laid.

So you feel the only purpose of relationships between men and women is for men to get sexual service?
As for "all men pay for it and all women sell it", that sounds like a reflection of your personal experience, and it's unfortunate that no woman has ever really wanted to have sex with you, but instead offered it as a service in return for dates and gifts as you have implied. Perhaps if you improved your technique...? Or it could be you are choosing the wrong women to date.
Be aware that your own experience is not reflective of something universal.
So yes, I am telling you that you're wrong. Relationships are not all about sex, and plenty of women engage in sex without thought of recompense.

Whenever I hear somebody say "marriage is stupid", I know I'm talking to somebody who has failed at relationships. Rather than examine your own culpability, you choose to believe that ~all~ relationships are doomed. That way it's not your fault and you don't have to change the behavior which caused the failures.
This is a very human response but it's one that will keep you bitter and unhappy.

[big_lefty]

Quote by: HelioPrime Because I can't look at it from that perspective. Prostitution is wrong. To agree that legalizing it might reduce some problems would be ammo for libertarians and other secularist to demand it be legalized.

Why is it wrong? Further, why should something which carries no inherent harm to society or individuals be illegal just because certain segments of society think it is wrong?

[big_lefty]

Quote by: MplsBison From the article: His basis for keeping prostitution illegal is that trafficking teenage girls is harder. But those are two fundamentally different things: prostitution has no victim while trafficking has an obvious victim. Trying to link the two and thus apply restrictions on one for the sake of the other is ethically and intellectually dishonest.

The way I read it, he was saying that making it legal would reduce trafficking in minors.

[MplsBison]

He was saying that making it legal would increase trafficking.

[grandpa]

Quote by: MplsBison He was saying that making it legal would increase trafficking.

Why would making prostitution legal increase trafficking of, say, children for sexual purposes? They are ultimately different things.

Grandpa h.

[big_lefty]

Quote by: MplsBison He was saying that making it legal would increase trafficking.

Okay, this was the quote I thought you were speaking of;

."If brothels were legalized and inspected, I believed, then we could uproot child prostitution and reduce AIDS and sexually transmitted infections."

You must be talking about another quote.

[big_lefty]

Quote by: HelioPrime Prostitution just assists lowering the value of marriage and relationships. Promotion of sex as nothing but a tool to satisfy your pleasures. Rather than glorifying marriage and couples we reduce everything to instant gratification. And following the legalization would of course be the sex toys and DVD's available in every store, and sex legalized in public.

That's an odd statement. How would allowing public sex follow from legalizing prostitution?

BTW, I have news for you- porn DVDs are already available in every video store, and many department and drug stores sell vibrators. They just call them "personal massagers".

I have trouble with the notion that marriage should or could be be "glorified" by making commercial sex illegal.
You are in essence saying that your personal values should be forced on others via making choices you don't agree with criminal acts.
Enforcing morality is not the law's job. Enforcing peace and order is.
Some people have no interest in marriage and do not value it, and they should have the legal right to seek other options as long as they do not harm others or violate their rights.

[MplsBison]

Quote by: big_lefty Okay, this was the quote I thought you were speaking of; ."If brothels were legalized and inspected, I believed, then we could uproot child prostitution and reduce AIDS and sexually transmitted infections." You must be talking about another quote.

Note the past tense of "believed".


IE, that is what he used to think.

[Chris]

Quote by: HelioPrime Prostitution just assists lowering the value of marriage and relationships. Promotion of sex as nothing but a tool to satisfy your pleasures. Rather than glorifying marriage and couples we reduce everything to instant gratification. And following the legalization would of course be the sex toys and DVD's available in every store, and sex legalized in public.

thats one huge conclucion there and also as someone pointed out they already sell astroglide in wal mart if you mean that once we legalise prostitution, we are then going to be seeing dildos at the 7/11 then i would like to know how you come to such a conclusion. Also explain why in the state of Victoria they don't sell dildos in 7/11s and yet prostitution is legal

[big_lefty]

Quote by: MplsBison Note the past tense of "believed". IE, that is what he used to think.

Ah, understanding dawns. My bad for not reading the rest.

[big_lefty]

Quote by: Chris thats one huge conclucion there and also as someone pointed out they already sell astroglide in wal mart if you mean that once we legalise prostitution, we are then going to be seeing dildos at the 7/11 then i would like to know how you come to such a conclusion. Also explain why in the state of Victoria they don't sell dildos in 7/11s and yet prostitution is legal

Heehee! Dildos a the 7-11! I'm picturing a rack of sex toys next to the Big Gulp drink machines.
There's a bad pun in there somewhere.

[DCAPBTLS77]

Quote by: big_lefty So you feel the only purpose of relationships between men and women is for men to get sexual service? As for "all men pay for it and all women sell it", that sounds like a reflection of your personal experience, and it's unfortunate that no woman has ever really wanted to have sex with you, but instead offered it as a service in return for dates and gifts as you have implied. Perhaps if you improved your technique...? Or it could be you are choosing the wrong women to date. Be aware that your own experience is not reflective of something universal. So yes, I am telling you that you're wrong. Relationships are not all about sex, and plenty of women engage in sex without thought of recompense. Whenever I hear somebody say "marriage is stupid", I know I'm talking to somebody who has failed at relationships. Rather than examine your own culpability, you choose to believe that ~all~ relationships are doomed. That way it's not your fault and you don't have to change the behavior which caused the failures. This is a very human response but it's one that will keep you bitter and unhappy.

Lefty, sweetheart, I am a woman, ,a straight woman, so I really have no desire to date another woman, unless it leads to a really hot 3 some with a man....and please dont tell me how unhappy i am , I am in a 14 year relationship with the love of my life, we are VERY happy together, he understands I am not a monogamous person, and we are very , very much in love,, DO not presume to psychoanalyze me , youre far too far off base , good try though. As far as relationships not being about sex there too, you are incorrect, how many marriages last when one spouse is NOT having sex with the other , not too many. But I am wrong???? Dont think so.

[MplsBison]

100% of the time, people will get bored with each other.

It matters not how deeply and passionately in love you were to start with.


It always happens.





Some people ... a lot of people ... decide to grind on anyway because society says that they are supposed to stay together. They find ways to limit the time they have to spend together (longer hours at work, etc.).

[big_lefty]

100% of the time, people will get bored with each other. It matters not how deeply and passionately in love you were to start with. It always happens.

Maybe it aways happens to you. Why do people always assume their own feelings are universally felt by others? What a self-absorbed attitude.

I've been with my spouse 21 years. Still not bored.

Some people ... a lot of people ... decide to grind on anyway because society says that they are supposed to stay together. They find ways to limit the time they have to spend together (longer hours at work, etc.).

Obviously, you've had a bad experience and it's made you cynical.
But why do people who have failed at relationships so often try to bring other people down by projecting their own unhappy feelings and experiences onto everyone else? Is it envious spite, or something else?

[big_lefty]

Lefty, sweetheart, I am a woman, ,a straight woman, so I really have no desire to date another woman, unless it leads to a really hot 3 some with a man...

.

Why are you telling me this? Did you think I was asking you for a date?

and please dont tell me how unhappy i am , I am in a 14 year relationship with the love of my life, we are VERY happy together,

Yet you wax cynical about relationships. Why? People with happy relationship experiences don't tend to take a cynical attitude about them.

he understands I am not a monogamous person, and we are very , very much in love,, DO not presume to psychoanalyze me , youre far too far off base , good try though.

Again, how dos that jibe with your embittered attitude about relationships?

As far as relationships not being about sex there too, you are incorrect, how many marriages last when one spouse is NOT having sex with the other , not too many. But I am wrong???? Dont think so.

Illogical. Most relationships would fail if one person had disgustingly poor personal hygiene, but that doesn't mean relationships are all about good hygiene.

Be that as it may, there are long-lasting marriages where the couple no longer has sex.

These researchers found the divorce rate for sexless marriages was below the national average.

Top 10 Myths About Sexless Marriages (When It's the Man's Choice) -- ThirdAge

So yeah, you're wrong.

Your beliefs are not realistic because they are based only on your personal feelings and personal experience.
You've got o remember that your feelings and experiences are not universal to all people.

[MplsBison]

Quote by: big_lefty I've been with my spouse 21 years. Still not bored.

You can claim it all you want. But you know that you are not like you were when you first started.


Human nature is designed that way.



Love is a chemical in your brain to increase the chance that you will get her pregnant.


Then it wears off in a month or two when you are supposed to leave her to take care of her child and then go on to the next mate.



That is how the most genes get spread around.

[DCAPBTLS77]

Quote by: big_lefty . Why are you telling me this? Did you think I was asking you for a date? Yet you wax cynical about relationships. Why? People with happy relationship experiences don't tend to take a cynical attitude about them. Again, how dos that jibe with your embittered attitude about relationships? Illogical. Most relationships would fail if one person had disgustingly poor personal hygiene, but that doesn't mean relationships are all about good hygiene. Be that as it may, there are long-lasting marriages where the couple no longer has sex. These researchers found the divorce rate for sexless marriages was below the national average. Top 10 Myths About Sexless Marriages (When It's the Man's Choice) -- ThirdAge So yeah, you're wrong. Your beliefs are not realistic because they are based only on your personal feelings and personal experience. You've got o remember that your feelings and experiences are not universal to all people.

Quote by: big_lefty
So you feel the only purpose of relationships between men and women is for men to get sexual service?
As for "all men pay for it and all women sell it", that sounds like a reflection of your personal experience, and it's unfortunate that no woman has ever really wanted to have sex with you, but instead offered it as a service in return for dates and gifts as you have implied. Perhaps if you improved your technique...? Or it could be you are choosing the wrong women to date


This quote here would be the reason I told you I was a woman, NOT because i thought you wanted a date.


I dont call my attitude about dating cynical, I call it not living in a fairytale, most peple start dating because they have common interests, similar beliefs, and they want to get each other naked.

As far as your support article goes , thats great. What if the spouse cheats due to a sexless marriage? It does often end in divorce, after the initial " Im sorry, it will never happen again", and then it happens again..... i have seen it, and have lived through it, with my bio father...

[big_lefty]

This quote here would be the reason I told you I was a woman, NOT because i thought you wanted a date.

Thank you for taking the time to explain. Such courtesy is rare on the internet. :-)

I dont call my attitude about dating cynical, I call it not living in a fairytale, most peple start dating because they have common interests, similar beliefs, and they want to get each other naked.

Okay, but you must understand that your perception of relationships is just that- your perception. It's not a universal truth.
You did say marriage was stupid. That's cynical.

As far as your support article goes , thats great. What if the spouse cheats due to a sexless marriage? It does often end in divorce, after the initial " Im sorry, it will never happen again", and then it happens again..... i have seen it, and have lived through it, with my bio father...

People don't just cheat because of sexless marriages. In fact, the majority of infidelity is in marriages that are sexual. So that's not an argument against sexless marriage. Some couples even choose to be celibate.

I'm sorry to hear about your dad. Did it not occur to you that your attitude towards marriage might have something to do with that?