Benedict backs excommunication over Mexican abortion vote:

[Praxius]

Benedict backs excommunication over Mexican abortion vote

The ChronicleHerald.ca

The Pope says he's in favour of excommunicating Roman Catholic politicians who support a proposed law allowing women to have abortions in Mexico City. Pope Benedict XVI made the comment Wednesday during a news conference aboard a plane carrying him to Brazil on his first pilgrimage to Latin America. Benedict noted that church doctrine calls for automatic excommunication for anyone procuring an abortion. A Vatican spokesman said later that politicians who voted to legalize abortion had automatically excommunicated themselves by their actions. "It's nothing new, it's normal, it wasn't arbitrary. It is what is foreseen by the church's doctrine," the Pope told reporters. While Benedict has previously told Catholic politicians that the Vatican's stance against abortion was "not negotiable," he had not explicitly said that excommunication would be the penalty for politicians who supported it. The proposed law to permit abortion during the first 12 weeks of pregnancy was approved by Mexico City politicians on April 24 by a 46-19 vote with one abstention. While it would only apply within the capital, women could travel there to have the procedure performed. Mexico City hospitals would be required to provide abortions and the door would also be opened to the establishment of private abortion clinics. Federal Mexican law allows abortion only in cases of rape, if the fetus has been deemed to have severe birth defects or if the pregnancy puts the mother's life at risk. Roman Catholic church officials in Mexico said earlier that doctors and nurses who perform abortions will be excommunicated, along with pro-abortion legislators. About 90 per cent of Mexicans are Catholic, the largest number of any country after Brazil. While polls show a majority of Mexico City residents support legalizing abortion, there is also significant opposition, with some groups vowing to appeal the measure to the Supreme Court. 5,000 march against abortion in Brazilia Prior to the Pope's five-day visit, about 5,000 people turned out on Tuesday for an anti-abortion march in the capital, Brazilia. The procedure is legal in Brazil only in cases of rape or when a woman's life is in danger. Benedict, who visited Brazil as then-cardinal Joseph Ratzinger in 1990, will celebrate several open-air masses, including a canonization ceremony for Brazil's first native-born saint, and visit a church-run drug and alcohol rehabilitation centre. He will also meet with bishops from throughout Latin American in a once-a-decade meeting in the shrine city of Aparecida near Sao Paulo. During his visit, the Vatican has said Benedict will deliver a tough message on poverty and crime. He will meet with Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva in Sao Paulo, but a spokesman said the centre-left leader does not plan to bring up abortion or other sensitive issues, such as a government anti-AIDS program that distributes millions of condoms each year.

Thank Jesus I'm no longer in that religion.... pun intended.

And the Roman Catholic community is wondering why they are losing followers?

I always found that excommunication is just stupid for any religion or any situation.

Excommunication is a religious censure used to deprive or suspend membership in a religious community. The word literally means out of communion, or no longer in communion. In some churches, excommunication includes spiritual condemnation of the member or group. Censures and sanctions sometimes follow excommunication; these include banishment, shunning, and shaming, depending on the group's religion or religious community.

I love this system... It's a basic "Do as we say or we will kick you out, we'll point our fingers at you, and will put you down anytime we see you."

Yeah..... that's real Christian..... well.... I guess it is by todays standards of Christianity.

They do this to clearly make sure nothing changes in their religion and that nobody can enter the religion with different opinions and views. You kick them out, you banish them, you shame them, etc.... it's just basically making sure everybody thinks they're evil so they are not influenced outside of the Religious practices...... So much for love thy neighbor..... and his wife

But seriously, this is why there is so much hatred between religions and those who don't follow them..... it's the whole "We're better then you because we have the Right God." attitude.

Cripes.

[tman_ndsu08]

Hopefully, perhaps within the next couple generations, the pope will become so irrelevant that he'll simply cease to exist.

[Rinoa]

The pope won't cease to exist as long as the Roman Catholic religion exists, and if you're hoping for the abolishment of religion...good luck...It'll take quite a bit longer than that.

[tman_ndsu08]

You never know.


Entire countries have fallen in less time.

[Rinoa]

What country has ever had the following that the catholic church has? It may influence a smaller percentage of the population than ever before, but there are more people withing that, and to exterminate their beliefs...We'd probably have to catch the pope himself with an alter boy...And even then that would only rid us of most of one religion.

[tman_ndsu08]

How many did the USSR encompass? 250+ million?


They fell pretty quickly.

[Rinoa]

True, but the major difference? The follwers of the religion are actually loyal to it. Governments fall because in general they lack the ability to inspire loyalty to the same degree as religion. You don't give up something 'sinful' for something you don't believe in, but living somewhere doesn't mean that you agree with the local politics.

For example, I've seen religious gay men give up gay sex because 'god says so', when has a gay man ever completely given that up for his country? People who join the mormon church regularly give up smoking. While some might do that for their country, I'd be willing to bet that it's a much smaller percentage.

[tman_ndsu08]

Quote by: Rinoa The follwers of the religion are actually loyal to it.

That goes without saying.


My point was that doing things like this decreases loyalty.

[CoffeeSaint]

Quote by: Praxius Benedict backs excommunication over Mexican abortion vote The ChronicleHerald.ca I love this system... It's a basic "Do as we say or we will kick you out, we'll point our fingers at you, and will put you down anytime we see you." Yeah..... that's real Christian..... well.... I guess it is by todays standards of Christianity. They do this to clearly make sure nothing changes in their religion and that nobody can enter the religion with different opinions and views. You kick them out, you banish them, you shame them, etc.... it's just basically making sure everybody thinks they're evil so they are not influenced outside of the Religious practices...... So much for love thy neighbor..... and his wife But seriously, this is why there is so much hatred between religions and those who don't follow them..... it's the whole "We're better then you because we have the Right God." attitude. Cripes.

This goes beyond simple religious differences. If the pope only wanted to excommunicate the people who voted for the law, he would simply do it; I'm sure there is some process whereby you announce to the sinner himself that he is about to damned to eternal hellfire (Is there an Excommun-o-Gram? Or maybe an automated phone call? "If you would like to beg for mercy, press one. If you would like to curse the Church, press two. Please be aware that pressing two ensures that you will suffer double the torture once you are in Hell.") and then you perform the ceremony and the sinner is damned; no muss, no fuss.

The fact that the Pope has announced this publically, and that he is threatening lawmakers instead of those who actually get the abortions, and/or those who perform the abortions, shows that the Vatican is trying to influence the political agenda of a foreign nation. Personally, I'd see this as an act of war, and respond accordingly -- maybe with sanctions or a blockade of Vatican City, and certainly with an outraged reply in the UN and through a delegation to the Pope himself. Maybe it's time the Roman Catholics in Mexico followed Henry VIII's lead and started their own Catholic church.