Watch the videos. What the Gay Agenda is doing, to 1st-3rd graders.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Now, I know the initial reaction is "Why should I watch some right wing propaganda BS?" And I would agree, why should you? In this case, you ain't. This is an educational video for teachers and instructors, it is NOT a video done by some right winger.

The right wingers got a hold of it.

The second video is really interesting, wait till you see what Mr. Teacher has the kids do AFTER the young lady reads her essay.


Homosexuals brainwashing our children in elementary schools

[Jack]

"The Gay Agenda" has a snazzy ring to it, but I've asked many times for someone who uses the phrase to define the agenda for me. No one can. Do people think that kids can be converted into gays? If they do, then they haven't thought much about their own sexual identity and how they came to be straight.
What I'm seeing in these videos is an effort to teach tolerance. Is that an evil thing? Does the right not believe in tolerance? Is tolerance limited to liberals? Or is it just a matter of the Christian coalition attempting to institutionalize homophobia?

[Jason]

This is not a "Gay Agenda", and in fact such statements lead to more problems than solutions. This is called irresponsible education because the curriculum is in appropriate. But, to generalize and say this is promoted by gay people as a whole is bigoted and incorrect.

[RickSp]

What a load of unmitigated crap. The only agenda here is that of the bigoted right-wingers getting worked up over basic tolerence. I am just grateful that my kids are smarter than the right wing cross-burners.

We happen to have gay neighbors on both sides of us, as well as Blacks, Hispanics, Asian and Islamic friends on the street and around the block. The world is complex and diverse place. I am glad my neighborhood looks a little bit like the world. It is a great place to raise kids.

[Kamehameha34]

Quote by: The link How many more young children are being desensitized to homosexuality in their young years by these sophisticated techniques?

I think this quotation is a good summation of their position. :rolleyes:

[CoffeeSaint]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Now, I know the initial reaction is "Why should I watch some right wing propaganda BS?" And I would agree, why should you? In this case, you ain't. This is an educational video for teachers and instructors, it is NOT a video done by some right winger. The right wingers got a hold of it. The second video is really interesting, wait till you see what Mr. Teacher has the kids do AFTER the young lady reads her essay.

I am shocked! SHOCKED! How dare that teacher ask his students to discuss something? Doesn't he know that children are to be seen and not heard? That they are to be instructed in the morals handed down to us by THE LORD OUR GOD, He who made this country and gives us all good things, and made our laws and wrote the Constitution -- oh, wait. Crap. :rolleyes:

I cannot for the life of me understand how this is supposed to be brainwashing, or propaganda, or inappropriate, or anything other than a useful lesson in variation and differences. It is one day out of the year, and it certainly sounded to me like anyone who didn't agree was allowed to disagree; nobody said that THIS was the right thing to do and THIS was the wrong thing to do. This is what education should be like.

Though I find it ironic in the extreme that at the end of the second video were a couple of Bible passages and the (unbelievably ridiculous) statement that if all humans were gay, then humanity would die out in 100 years and thus homosexuality is evil and wrong. THAT was the closest thing I saw to brainwashing. And the stupidest.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Did you watch both films?

Yeah.

Hey question for ya, we can teach this "Tolerance" in schools, but you can't say the pledge of allegiance without a court order... might offend a "Non religious person" But this tolerance taught... don't matter if it offends religious folk.

Yeah.

[rez]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Did you watch both films? Yeah. Hey question for ya, we can teach this "Tolerance" in schools, but you can't say the pledge of allegiance without a court order... might offend a "Non religious person"

it might even offend a religious person too. Not everybody believes in the Christian god Vicchio. I thought you knew that by now?

edit to add: I find it revealing that Vicchio and others like him think that critically thinking and engaging in conversation is a form of brainwashing.

[Slevin57]

I'm not really sure where I stand on this one.

I dont' like indoctrination. But that is the point of public schools I guess.

Because it's such a sensitive issue, I think there should be alot of discussion before a school, especially an elementary school holds a Gay and Lesbian pride day.

While there wasn't much evidence of blackfiring in that video, sexual orientation is not a very easy concept to understand. Obviously if you already have "two mothers", then you don't really need this day to know and understand what being lesbian is.

But, there is a certain danger in children rejecting this idea because of stronger values instilled by their parents.

If they have been taught since they were born to stay away from gay people, or that they were evil, wrong, etc., A Gay and Lesbian pride day is not going to help.

If I were going to hold an event like this, I would send a letter home to parents, and give them the option of not having their child participate. Just like they do for sexual education ("Family Life").

[The Bacon Guy]

I fail to see how this qualifies as brainwashing. Introducing them to homosexuals is simply broadening their horizons and preparing them for what they are likely to encounter in the real world. At no point did I see them being fed an agenda.

Besides, they do the same thing with race and religion. Why should sexuality be any different?

[RickSp]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio don't matter if it offends religious folk. Yeah.

I'm sure you'll have plenty of opportunity to teach bigotry outside of the classroom.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Quote by: rez it might even offend a religious person too. Not everybody believes in the Christian god Vicchio. I thought you knew that by now? edit to add: I find it revealing that Vicchio and others like him think that critically thinking and engaging in conversation is a form of brainwashing.

This isn't appropriate for 1st graders.

Hell not even for 5th graders. MAYBE 9th grade, maybe.

[rez]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio This isn't appropriate for 1st graders. Hell not even for 5th graders. MAYBE 9th grade, maybe.

When did you learn about sexuality?

[Jack]

I going to risk my reputation by agreeing to some extent with Mr. V on this topic.

I'm not sure at what age detailed education on sexuality should be implemented, but K-5th grade does seem quite early. It's a good time to teach tolerance, getting along with others, sharing, friendship, those sort of values. I agree that early education is almost more about socialization and indoctrination into the norms of society than it is the imparting of knowledge.

I think young people ought to be made aware of the different races, sexes, nationalities, etc. But specific sexual education should only be introduced when the educators believe the children will actually benefit from it and be able to apply it to their lives. Schools can teach respect and tolerance for gays, Blacks, Orientals and the rest without going into the specifics of what those groups represent until such a time that the kids can appreciate what they're learning.

[Kamehameha34]

I finally got around to watching the videos.

It's disgusting that someone would call that brainwashing. It's basic tolerance, and respect for other human beings.

The most ridiculous part was the end of the second documentary, where the website operators tried to validate their prejudices with quotes from the bible, and their little "what if everyone turned gay?" hypothetical.

How did the belief that treating gays like human beings would somehow contribute to the entire population "turning gay" infect their minds?

[Jack]

Primarily through religious propaganda (brainwashing) foisted on children well before they ever get to kindergarten.
The other day I saw a woman walking with her daughter. The youngster obviously had just started walking not too long before. She tottered over to a planter to admire the flowers. The mom said, "Who made the flowers, honey?" and sure enough the girl replied, "God did". I was stunned. She sounded like an automaton to me, you know, the "robot" we're doomed to become without free will? What free will?

Gays and atheists shouldn't worry theists. They're doing just fine in the "get 'em while they're too young to reason for themselves" department.

[Kamehameha34]

Indeed. Theists seem to want special pleading in every category.

It's ok to accept the bible without evidence, and this sort of thing is just fine.

But as soon as someone infuses tolerance into a video - well, that's just "unnatural".

[phoenix_fire]

Ya' see, I have a problem with stuff like this. It's using peer pressure and worse: authoritarian pressure in order to enforce a viewpoint upon very young children. This is something that people have to make a decision about on their own, when they're old enough. It's not just saying that you should tolerate homosexuality: it's saying that if you don't totally accept it, you're a bad, mean, closed-minded and wrong person. I'm sure that most people would be up in arms if schools started having a Christianity awareness day in which teachers were required to teach about Christianity and imply that its beliefs were correct. Or how about Vegetarianism? SHW wouldn't mind, but some of the rest of us might. I don't think that a whole lot of parents would like it if their 6-year-old came home and started calling them a murderer every time they had a chicken nugget. How about communism? How about if the Republican Party came in twice a year and told the kiddos how to vote? Kids that age aren't old enough to know if they want to be gay or straight or what. Most of them probably have no idea what sex is and still think it's a curse word. I am totally against this kind of indoctrination.

[Kamehameha34]

it's saying that if you don't totally accept it, you're a bad, mean, closed-minded and wrong person.

So children should be encouraged to treat others as human beings, but it's "not that big o' deal"?

Kids that age aren't old enough to know if they want to be gay or straight or what.

This has nothing to do with "teaching kids to be gay", so what the children "want" to be is a non-issue.

I'm sure that most people would be up in arms if schools started having a Christianity awareness day in which teachers were required to teach about Christianity and imply that its beliefs were correct.

Tell me, should we not assume that racism is inherently wrong?

[Jack]

It's not just saying that you should tolerate homosexuality: it's saying that if you don't totally accept it, you're a bad, mean, closed-minded and wrong person. I'm sure that most people would be up in arms if schools started having a Christianity awareness day in which teachers were required to teach about Christianity and imply that its beliefs were correct.

You're unfairly comparing a character trait that one has no control over (sexual identity) with the adoption of a belief system which is entirely, ought to be entirely, voluntary. You chose to be a theist, I can choose to openly criticize that choice, and you my choice to not be. But I cannot fairly hold a bias against you for the color of your hair (if natural...if not, then it's a choice thing), the color of your eyes, your sex or sexual persuasion. For the sake of humanity we should teach children to respect others regardless of their inherited attributes or physical impairment. We can teach them to be polite. But they should be free to form their own opinion regarding the choices people make. Whether they accept, are neutral or opposed to other's choices.