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CX Champ · Feb 20, 2007, 10:04 pm

I was watching CNN today and there was a discussion on the southern flag, and if it should be displayed. The African Americans argued that, it shouldn't be displayed because it stands for treason and slavery, but didn't the U.S. rebel and commit treason against the British, and wasn't the U.S. built from slavery (not saying it's right)? They also compared it to showing the swastika on a flag. I don't want to fly the flag, but it kind of bothers me, shouldn't the U.S. flag offend them under the same reasoning?

Eclipse · Feb 20, 2007, 10:30 pm

Flags; symbols for what a people stand for. Fortunately they don't, or shouldn't, encompass the entire population nor do they really mean anything. It's all arbitrary.

I'm not entirely familiar to the specifics on the US history prior to the war. Was the flag present before the war and before slavery? Or was it brought in just for the purpose of the war?

In all honesty any flag or symbol can insult anyone if given the right placement history. The swastika was originally a symbol of luck among a few other things and now it is deep within the pits of unacceptable displays. Eventually we'll run out of symbols. :rolleyes:

The basis of why it is a problem lies within the cog-work of language. Every symbol that represents a word is arbitrary in reality but nonetheless some words are offensive because we put meaning to the symbol (verbal and written). We take in the symbol, memorize it and utilize it without much conscience effort.

The same thing happens with other cultural symbols like this flag. Now, I'm not sure how hard it is to turn a symbol around in someone's POV but it must be difficult. I would wonder if it is not just over reaction but I'm not too sure yet.

Osborn F Enready · Feb 20, 2007, 10:35 pm

We are seeing a rebirth of proud polarization in the U.S. based on political divide, class divide, and encroaching laws upon civil rights.

This is CNN's way of covering it in a non-committed, touchy-feely, BS kind of way, in order to avoid the real issues that are driving the wedges of seperation between us.

Jachin · Feb 20, 2007, 11:00 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Eclipse

I'm not entirely familiar to the specifics on the US history prior to the war. Was the flag present before the war and before slavery? Or was it brought in just for the purpose of the war?

The flag is one of a series of flags used by the Confederate States of America. The CSA existed essentially only during the Civil War. Slavery in America substantially predates the flag in question.

My opinion is that the flag is a symbol, and as a symbol it can be interpreted many different ways. It didn't just stand for slavery and slavery alone.

brien · Feb 21, 2007, 11:38 am

Quote:

This is CNN's way of covering it in a non-committed, touchy-feely, BS kind of way, in order to avoid the real issues that are driving the wedges of seperation between us.

I am with Osborn on this. This is merely CNN's way of seeking ratings. All news organizations act out of ratings. So if one examines the reason for CNN's motivation in this story, it is all about ratings and not about any moral or ethical concerns for those who fly the Stars and Bars.

RickSp · Feb 21, 2007, 12:04 pm

The flag is a symbol of certain Southerner's refusal to acknowledge or completely endorse the abolition of slavery. In 1955 at the beginning of the civil rights movement the state legislature of Georgia adopted a new state flag that incorporated the Confederate battle flag in a none too subtle message that "things haven't changed down here." The Mississippi, Alabama and Florida state flags send the same message, all either incorporating or being modeled after the battle flag.

As one born and raised in the South, I think that it is time for things to change.

I have no problem with anyone who wants to fly the Confederate flag on private property. They can wear rebel caps, swig sour mash and complain about the "War of Yankee Aggression" too for all I care.

I do disagree with the flying of the Confederate flag over state buildings as was done for many years. It is a flag of another country and has no more business being flown on state property.

CX Champ · Feb 21, 2007, 05:35 pm

Flying the southern flag over state buildings is wrong, they are no longer rebelling, but in my opinion the arguement that it stands for slavery is outrageous. We too had slavery, an thats why our country was so powerful and just because the south fought to keep slavery going, at the time there was nothing wrong with it, in our eyes. Besides, we understand now slavery is illegal, and wrong, not to mention that it's a viloation of free speech to outlaw the flag. Sorry I am not responding to your comments, but the arguments brough forth on CNN bothered me and I have to get it out. I need to quit watching CNN and start watching FOX, haha jk guys.

Feb 20, 2007, 10:04 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
CX Champ Lv5 Night Elf Location: USA Posts: 37	The Confederate Flag I was watching CNN today and there was a discussion on the southern flag, and if it should be displayed. The African Americans argued that, it shouldn't be displayed because it stands for treason and slavery, but didn't the U.S. rebel and commit treason against the British, and wasn't the U.S. built from slavery (not saying it's right)? They also compared it to showing the swastika on a flag. I don't want to fly the flag, but it kind of bothers me, shouldn't the U.S. flag offend them under the same reasoning?

Feb 20, 2007, 10:35 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
Osborn F Enready Principled Observer Location: Toledo, Ohio Posts: 13,873	We are seeing a rebirth of proud polarization in the U.S. based on political divide, class divide, and encroaching laws upon civil rights. This is CNN's way of covering it in a non-committed, touchy-feely, BS kind of way, in order to avoid the real issues that are driving the wedges of seperation between us. Petition of Redress of Grievances: http://www.givemeliberty.org/default.htm Canadian Lawsuit Against Their National Banks: http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/ Osborn F. Enready

Feb 21, 2007, 12:04 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
RickSp Volcanic Erupter Posts: 9,491	The flag is a symbol of certain Southerner's refusal to acknowledge or completely endorse the abolition of slavery. In 1955 at the beginning of the civil rights movement the state legislature of Georgia adopted a new state flag that incorporated the Confederate battle flag in a none too subtle message that "things haven't changed down here." The Mississippi, Alabama and Florida state flags send the same message, all either incorporating or being modeled after the battle flag. As one born and raised in the South, I think that it is time for things to change. I have no problem with anyone who wants to fly the Confederate flag on private property. They can wear rebel caps, swig sour mash and complain about the "War of Yankee Aggression" too for all I care. I do disagree with the flying of the Confederate flag over state buildings as was done for many years. It is a flag of another country and has no more business being flown on state property. Rick "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." Sinclair Lewis

Feb 20, 2007, 10:30 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
Eclipse Igneous Magma Posts: 248	Flags; symbols for what a people stand for. Fortunately they don't, or shouldn't, encompass the entire population nor do they really mean anything. It's all arbitrary. I'm not entirely familiar to the specifics on the US history prior to the war. Was the flag present before the war and before slavery? Or was it brought in just for the purpose of the war? In all honesty any flag or symbol can insult anyone if given the right placement history. The swastika was originally a symbol of luck among a few other things and now it is deep within the pits of unacceptable displays. Eventually we'll run out of symbols. :rolleyes: The basis of why it is a problem lies within the cog-work of language. Every symbol that represents a word is arbitrary in reality but nonetheless some words are offensive because we put meaning to the symbol (verbal and written). We take in the symbol, memorize it and utilize it without much conscience effort. The same thing happens with other cultural symbols like this flag. Now, I'm not sure how hard it is to turn a symbol around in someone's POV but it must be difficult. I would wonder if it is not just over reaction but I'm not too sure yet.

Feb 21, 2007, 05:35 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
CX Champ Lv5 Night Elf Location: USA Posts: 37	Flying the southern flag over state buildings is wrong, they are no longer rebelling, but in my opinion the arguement that it stands for slavery is outrageous. We too had slavery, an thats why our country was so powerful and just because the south fought to keep slavery going, at the time there was nothing wrong with it, in our eyes. Besides, we understand now slavery is illegal, and wrong, not to mention that it's a viloation of free speech to outlaw the flag. Sorry I am not responding to your comments, but the arguments brough forth on CNN bothered me and I have to get it out. I need to quit watching CNN and start watching FOX, haha jk guys.