child love is

[talinh]

Children have the right to say no?

* Did the children have the right to say no when we bring them to school, put them to bed, etc. etc.?
* Have the children the right to say yes also?
* If they have only the right to say no but not yes, that means they have no choice to say otherwise. Is this really a right?

child love is good for this society if given the right to say no to love they must have the right to say yes no matter what the age...

A case of child sex-law abuse?

* Not giving food to a hungry child is child abuse.
* Not giving sex to a sex hungry child should also be child abuse.
* Hence, the current child protection law is another form of child sex abuse.
* The current child pornography law strengthens the abuse further by:
o punishing not only the “feeders”, but also those who pretend to be feeding the child
o postponing the legal age of the child to be fed.

what dose this have to do with child love a lot more then you think.. child love is the people who do not wish to be in the same category as molesters... because their need are not the same... where a molester is out for sex with someone from any age group by force a child lover is not... they are in it for love...
for all you that will use that agents what i am trying to explain Love is a basic dimension of human experience that is variously conveyed as a sense of tender affection, an intense attraction, the foundation of intimacy and good interpersonal chemistry, willing self-sacrifice on behalf of another, and as an ineffable sense of affinity or connection to nature, other living beings, or even that which is unseen. It manifests itself in feelings, emotion, behavior, thoughts, perception and attitude. It influences, underlies and defines major patterns in interpersonal relationships and self-identification.

The diverse range of meanings associated with the English word contrasts with the plurality of Greek words for love, reflecting the depth, versatility, and complexity of the concept. This diversity of meanings is reflected in the many distinct classifications of love including romantic love; sexual desire; platonic love; religious love; familial love; true love; and the more casual application of the term to anything pleasurable, enjoyable, desirable, or preferred, including activities and favorite foods.

further more Pedophilia Definition is as follows The word comes from the Greek paidophilia (παιδοφιλία)—pais (παις, "child") and philia (φιλία, "love, friendship").

but somehow these people have been put in the same class as molesters
the term pedophile is also used colloquially to denote significantly older adults who are sexually attracted to adolescents below the local age of consent,[1] as well as those who have sexually abused a child.

yet here are the differences
The term paedophilia erotica was coined in 1886 by the Vienna psychiatrist Richard von Krafft-Ebing in his writing Psychopathia Sexualis.[4] He gave the following characteristics:

* the sexual interest is toward children, either prepubescent or at the beginning of puberty
* the sexual interest is the primary one, that is, exclusively or mainly toward children
* the sexual interest remains over time
Strictly speaking, this definition would include many adolescents and prepubescents, for whom such an interest might be normal; thus, some experts add the criterion that the interest be toward children at least five years younger than the subject. See entry for sexologist Dr. John Money.

Krafft-Ebing also categorized child molesters into three types:

* a.) pedophile,
* b.) surrogate (that is, the child is regarded as a surrogate object for a preferred, non-available adult object)
* c.) sadistic.

so the fact that the child love would stay with the girl over the years suggest love because even if their is a sexual need... it is not bound just to sex
not only that but what about older child lovers what did they do and how do we get rid of them

No market, no pedophiles?

* No porno market, no rapists? No violent movies, no violence……?
* What are the causes for pedophilia?
* Would the pedophiles become more dangerous without pornographic outlet?
* Pedophiles are punished for what they read or for they are interested in, not for what they have done!
* Discrimination based on sexual inclination?
* Famous pedophiles:
o Lewis Carroll : “Alice in Wonderland”
o James Barrie: “Peter Pan"

i would like to end this with something from china
Some writing from a Chinese female:

"Love is not the same thing as sexual coercion."

"I must oppose age-consent laws as I oppose any form of tyranny which works on the assumption that liberty is unnecessary. I must agree that I am opposed to any form of legal age, the assumption is unnecessary tyranny, freedom works."

"It may be true, Jai children are always a mystery in people's minds. It may be true that physical affection and warmth will forever be lost in the abyss of ignorance. It may be true, the intimacy and warmth is always lost in the abyss of ignorance. It may be true that justice will fall victim to merciless brutality. affection and kindness that have no place in society. that considering everything of value. liberty can not be found -- but it is the heart of the Humanitarians and the lovers of youth and compassion to oppose these possibilities with every ounce of strength that can be mustered. It may be true, justice will suffer ruthless, affection and kindness, not in the community, value freedom everywhere but can not find the heart -- love and compassion, humanitarian and youth mustered forces do our best against such a possibility."

Nice to see a similar point of view, written through the perspective of a person living in a very different country, speaking a very different language.

A source I found said Jai means "heart" in Thai.

[talinh]

and in no way am i saying sex with kids under ten is ok

[talinh]

i am just saying are we going to far

[Compugasm]

Quote by: talinh * Not giving sex to a sex hungry child should also be child abuse.

Ok, I've read enough, sicko.

[The Bacon Guy]

Quote by: compugasm Ok, I've read enough, sicko.

Quote by: THE RULES No personal insults or attacks in the main forums: Insulting fellow users and getting too personal only de-rails good topics. This rule includes the use of images or text-based signatures that mean to insult or attack. Respect other opinions: If a topic does not interest you, avoid it and post in another topic. Replying to a topic to dismiss the very discussion of it will not be tolerated.

You don't like what he says, either debate it or take a hike, bigot.

Anyway, with regards to the OP, while I completely agree that consensual child-adult sex is perfectly acceptable, there are problems with legalising it. Legally speaking, how do you differentiate between the child lovers and the child abusers? Sure, child sex can be judged on a case to case basis but there still must be a definite objective law which the participants either are or are not in breach of. I honestly can't see a way of incorporating child sex into an objective legal system without also legitimising child abuse.

That said, I am in favour of lowering the age of consent. I don't think anyone can convincingly argue that a teenager is unable to give consent, so lowering it to thirteen seems like a good idea to me. Of course this age is as arbitrary as the current one, but you have to draw the line somewhere.

[talinh]

that is true i dont real find anyone under ten able to give consent.. haveing looked up laws around the world and lookin at how that effects their society...
in most with a younger aoc their is not really any rape case's and if their is its not with children... i hate sayin it but as with any other group their is the small fact that with any main group comes the swingers and others... but their is a big different's between just sex and child molesters use force and even surrogate (that is, the child is regarded as a surrogate object for a preferred, non-available adult object) and are sadistic

as most people who fear their kids growing up... we are makein it harder on them they watch their parents get beaten and learn that thats ok i started out havening a relationship's at the age of 7 and yes they where adult relationships my first one was really abusive for the both of us i learned that
that is not what loves about... in fact it made me a better man.. i am not just saying this because my aoa i am saying this because if we keep going down the road we are on their will be a rise in crime and i am not just saying crime with child molesters or child lovers involved i am also talkin about kids made to beleave that you should not ever touch some one you care about... like a teacher.... even though i am talkin about the child love who just goes to court
expecting to die in jail and dose not because the child that he or she loves will not speak agents him/her... so that kid is thrown in jail...what are we teachin that kid if you dont do what the government says your gonna end up in jail....
if you love who you want to love then he will end up in jail.. unless you dont tell them then its you who ends up in jail...

i am not only talkin about small crime either i am talkin about government crimes two
if kids are tough to follow a government blindly then that government has power over the people... when we show kids that whatever the government says has to be followed we are teachin them to depend on a controlling power we are teachin them that its not ok to be different and those who are different end up fighting and livin their life out in jail

why did i bring this subject up here because when their are case's of children raping children its going to far i use to be an anti child lover like most of you
whale i was out bashing child lovers i took the time to read what they where saying... i took the time to look at court case's that ied hate my kids to have to endure as i started changing i talked to some of them and to my suprize i found out that their most cherish times where not sex with a kid most the time its was just havein the child around.. or a time that kid cared...

last but not lest by makeing it a taboo you are defeating you propose with any taboo it make people wonder and more people start doing it
my fears are not base for child lovers alone by doing this their will be more molesters and child loves comming out because they want to be the bad boy cause they want to stained agents the government.. or just because their parents sed they could never do that... i dont expect any of you to understand the complexity of all this but i would like you to look into it rather then going about it with ignorance...because i know all of you are brilliant people

[jose]

If you love children, bring some into this world, and defend them against sexual predetors, if my daughter ( 11) wants to play around with her age group friends thats OK but if some guy ten years or more here age wants to play i say he has serious problems

[Occam]

I was watching a TV program, Boston Legal, a few days ago. They had a case involving an anorexic sixteen year old girl. As I watched, a question occurred to me.

Anorexics are usually young women who reduce their calorie intake so they undergo extreme weight loss. We have to ask what motivates them to adopt this apparently self-destructive behavior? Consider the physical changes that occur as a result of anorexia. Menstruation stops, breasts and buttocks shrink so that the woman is flat-chested and has a very flat rear end, arm and leg diameters decrease severely. The anorexic sees all of these as very physically attractive. A question is, to whom are they attractive?

Consider that these characteristics are also found in prepubescent girls. It would seem that males who find these qualities attractive are pedophiles. Is it possible that young women anorexics are trying to make themselves appealing to pedophiles? If this is the case we may want to examine the history of anorexic girls to see if they had one or more positive sexual experiences with an adult male when they were children, and they are trying to attract similar males by making themselves look more like preteens.

Occam

[talinh]

good point occam
i have talked to most of these child lovers and i have found that all the one i have talked to are willing to stay with the girl they love even when they grow up to most true girl lovers it is not about their age its about the person

now as for Anorexics a lot of those people where pushed in to modeling and tough that any fat is bad because in this society fat is very wrong even though most of us are fat.. its part of the view t.v. puts out to the people

how many good child lover movies have you seen? how many ware their is a child molester?
by usein this image to depict child lovers they are gonna start to think if you love a kid the only right thing to do is kidnap them and rape them
is i right to put out a false view of child lovers at what cost will we realize that even though their is a bad side to child love their is a good side.


and this is for kids yes kids jose you sed if your 11 year old girl was playin with a 10 year older or more man but what about if your 27 year old girl was fallin in love with a kid i am not sayin this because i dont think you have a right to want the best for your kid... i am sayin this because if she found out that she loved some one so young she would be devastated... not only that but then she would think that just because she is different and all the laws are agents her she has nothing to lose and yes jose their is a large part of the child love group that is lady's not only that i talked to a 15 year old who was a girl and she was a girl love her age range was let me see 7-13 because she felt like this she felt the need to cut herself and alot of the time i spinet talkin her out of killin herself now put your kid in her place...

and yes the father is agents child love when he found out it made it worst...
just so you know their is no cure you have to except that you love kids and you will never be able to express it.. that is all they do for you unless you act on it then you could spend the rest of you life in jail... so even though it may not be your kid think of the others is it right to do this to our youth its their life let them love who they want to love and if the relationship is a bad one tell them about it dont just say you can or cant do something its not you life its hers and even if you tell her it is wrong she may do it anyways

by the way that 15 year old girl would face a charge of child rape and have a sentace of min 10 max life if she did anything if your girl 11 had sex she would face the same charges even if the kid was in the same age range
and sex play is common with children

[talinh]

i would like to hear some really good reason why child love shouldent be allowed
by the way i have read in parenting books that after ten years old children dont take advice from their parents anymore they already have the ideals that will forever be a part of them so let hear from other parents and from non parents

do you think just because a child lover has a kid he or she will end up haveing sex with them?

let discuss this

[talinh]

childlove movement - Anarchopedia

their are studies in those other sites too if you read this you could understaind and this is from a third party that try's to be indifferent

[Jason]

Notice: Volconvo does not condone pedophilia. The opinions expressed here belong to their respective posters. Illegal behavior is often discussed in our forums without issue, but such socially unacceptable and cruel behavior is an exception from the norm.

I will allow this conversation to continue so long as it remains constructive. At the point where this thread includes any material that may assist an individual in carrying out actions related to pedophilia, it will be immediate closed and removed.

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[talinh]

thank you sir and i under stain that this is one of the most controversial subjects out their i have no intent of makin this thread have any real life experiences

[The Bacon Guy]

Talinh,

I'm all for consensual child-adult sex, but I still don't see how it could be legalised while keeping the protection given by the current laws prohibiting sex with minors. So, could you give an outline of a practical law which would legalise consensual child-adult sex, and still protect children from being taken advantage of, i.e raped or tricked into sex by an adult?

Quote by: Jason Volconvo does not condone pedophilia.

What's wrong with paedophilia?

[another day]

Quote by: The Bacon Guy Talinh, I'm all for consensual child-adult sex, but I still don't see how it could be legalised while keeping the protection given by the current laws prohibiting sex with minors. So, could you give an outline of a practical law which would legalise consensual child-adult sex, and still protect children from being taken advantage of, i.e raped or tricked into sex by an adult? What's wrong with paedophilia?

Bacon guy, don't be a fool.

There is no such thing as consensual child-adult sex because of the inheherant differences in the nature of both participants. One is a weak, undeveloped, emotionally and mentally immature CHILD, the other is a fully grown, developed, mature adult with a full understanding of the world and a full development of his personality and character. The child has not developed his mind fully and is extremely malleble to outside influence. He does not know what is best for him. I didn't know what was best for me in my life until I was about 17 or 18. BUT I ALWAYS THOUGHT I DID. THAT IS THE KEY. No step along the way did I doubt my intellectual integrity. I thought the decisions I was making were the right ones, and only in hindsight did I realize I was being a fool. So just because a child says it was consensual, means nothing. If you get to a child at a young age you can brainwash them into liking anything. It's a coping mechanism. The child will not like being molested and touched but as a survival coping mechanism, will learn to enjoy those things so as to not suffer.

for instance, WHO DO YOU THINK INITIATED THE SEXUAL CONTACT? I can assure you it is NEVER the child, but always the ADULT. And just like the kidnapped person who begins to sympathize with the abductor, the child will soon accept it, see it as normal, and possibly even grow to like it. Does that make it ok, no! What you are doing is manipulating and molding a vulnerable and suggestible child into being your lover.

And talin, if you profess such extreme support for this issue, please be a man and admit that you are a pedophile (or "child lover" as you put it) and are not talking about "child lovers you know" or whatever. It's clear as day.

And it's really sick how you equate molesting children as "feeding them"...Yes a child around 13 and 14 will start wanting sex, but they should get that sex through their OWN EXPLORATION, THEIR OWN ENDEAVOURS. And that is the point can assure that ALL child-adult relationships are STARTED BY THE ADULT, because it is the ADULT who is a pedophile, and the child would rather be with someone closer to their own age and maturity. (To make things clear, I will say a child is someone 13 years or younger...14 year olds and above can most certainly seek older men, but if it was my daughter I would never let her see any man more then 5 years older. The age of consent in my country (canada) is 14 which I believe is fair. And you state 10 is too young? 11, 12, 13, all too young as well) When you open the door to relationships between the very young and the old, you are opening up a door to manipulation of these young people.

[The Bacon Guy]

Quote by: another day The child has not developed his mind fully and is extremely malleble to outside influence. He does not know what is best for him. I didn't know what was best for me in my life until I was about 17 or 18.

There are some eighteen year olds who are not mature enough to know what is best for them sexually, just as there are some 14 year olds who are mature enough. There is overlap either side of the age of consent, which is why I don't discount the idea of consensual child-adult sex.

Quote by: another day The child will not like being molested and touched

How do you know?

Quote by: another day And that is the point can assure that ALL child-adult relationships are STARTED BY THE ADULT, because it is the ADULT who is a pedophile, and the child would rather be with someone closer to their own age and maturity.

Why are you so sure of that? If an adult can be sexually attracted to children, why can't children be sexually attracted to adults?

[Occam]

There are some eighteen year olds who are not mature enough to know what is best for them sexually, just as there are some 14 year olds who are mature enough.

I agree. Age is not too good a predictor of maturity. Possibly we should give each person a test to determine his/her level of maturity and give the person a license to participate in sexual activities only if one is sufficiently mature.

Of course, this might be a problem for some because I've met fifty year olds who couldn't pass such a test. :)

On the other side, a few years ago I was asked to give a lecture to a group of bright six to ten year olds. One little girl, eight years old, asked extremely intelligent questions, and also demonstrated that she had a broad range of understanding and a strong will. I'm sure that she would have been the one who decided if she had a sexual relationship.

Afterwards I was talking with her parents and commented on her maturity. Her mother said, "Her sister's just as bright and mature and that's a problem. She's fourteen and has a twenty-two year old graduate student as her boyfriend. She's on birth control, but still. . . ."

I believe we must protect children from negative influences - from sexual predators to evangelical churches, but we have give them as much freedom of choice as we can so they can grow up to be well adjusted, productive adults.

Occam

[another day]

There are some eighteen year olds who are not mature enough to know what is best for them sexually, just as there are some 14 year olds who are mature enough. There is overlap either side of the age of consent, which is why I don't discount the idea of consensual child-adult sex.

But you must generalize. That's the way the world has to work. You cannot look at each individual case because there is no way to determine that. And so the best indicator is age, because across the whole it IS a valid determination of maturity.

How do you know?

Maybe you should speak to the hundreds of thousands of molested children who grow up with emotional problems and are tormented by it. Or the ones who go on to molest children themselves, repeating the vicious cycle.

Why are you so sure of that? If an adult can be sexually attracted to children, why can't children be sexually attracted to adults?

Again, what is your definition of a child? I'm sure a 14 year old can be, but not an 11 year old. Why? They haven't gone through puberty.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: talinh i would like to hear some really good reason why child love shouldent be allowed by the way i have read in parenting books that after ten years old children dont take advice from their parents anymore they already have the ideals that will forever be a part of them so let hear from other parents and from non parents do you think just because a child lover has a kid he or she will end up haveing sex with them? let discuss this

The sexual choices you make will affect you for the rest of your life. Sex is a deep, powerful, emotional experience. There is simply no real benefit to a 10-year-old to have sex. It won't kill them to wait until they have a few more years' experience. Why take the chance? This is not eating ice cream, this is sex. These are choices that could affect the rest of their lives. Also, our society functions under the principle of informed consent. Given the potential emotional harm to having sex at age 10, and the lack of benefit, and the fact that a 10-year-old does not know enough to give informed consent - I see no reason to legalize it.

As a parent, I would at the very least insist that my child wait until high school. I also support age-difference laws. The potential for manipulation is too great to allow 26-year-olds to screw 13-year-olds. The punishment for such cases should be decided on a case-by-case basis, however. As inappropriate as it may be, it is not the same as doing it to a prebuscent child, who clearly cannot give informed consent.

[The Bacon Guy]

Quote by: another day But you must generalize. That's the way the world has to work. You cannot look at each individual case because there is no way to determine that. And so the best indicator is age, because across the whole it IS a valid determination of maturity.

Of course there is no way of determining sexual maturity, which is why I was interested to know how talinh would incorporate child sex into our legal system. What I disagree with is the statement that no children can be sexually mature.

Quote by: another day Maybe you should speak to the hundreds of thousands of molested children who grow up with emotional problems and are tormented by it. Or the ones who go on to molest children themselves, repeating the vicious cycle.

Does this happen in every case?

Quote by: another day Again, what is your definition of a child? I'm sure a 14 year old can be, but not an 11 year old. Why? They haven't gone through puberty.

Puberty can happen as young as nine, so if your criteria for determing whether a sex drive exists is whether the kid has gone through puberty, eleven year olds are by no means discounted.

Also, most boys start masturbating before puberty, so a sex drive must exist. I believe I owned my first porn magazine at about age nine and I would happily have screwed any of those women. Puberty is no more valid a determinant of the existence of a sex drive than age.