Should The Smallpox Virus Be Destroyed?

[ericsp23]

You know very well who I am talking about. I'm not going to play games with you, if you want to debate with me on this topic, then do it.

[tinybear]

How would I know how to read your mind?

[Pooeypants]

Can we not have it chatroom style please?

[Prometheus]

As a molecular biologist, I would hate to see smallpox destroyed. Untill we develop better means of protien engineering, we are stuck using natures library of proteins, and throwing away suck a successfull organism would be unwise.

Aside from that, it is basically impossible to destroy all of it because no scientist would let it happen. Someone would secretly keep a sample. Us biologists are packrats.

[Pooeypants]

Though to be fair, if we sequenced its genome we could rebuild the damn thing with relative ease.

[Prometheus]

Theoretically, but current methods do not allow for synthisizing sequences longer than a couple of kilobases. The smallpox genome is many times that length.

Secondarily, we may find more than the genomic cintent interesting. It has been proposed that the smallpox virus could be affectively used as a delivery vector for several gene tharapy treatments.

[Pooeypants]

Theoretically, but current methods do not allow for synthisizing sequences longer than a couple of kilobases. The smallpox genome is many times that length.

Secondarily, we may find more than the genomic content interesting. It has been proposed that the smallpox virus could be affectively used as a delivery vector for several gene therapy treatments.

We could cut it up and keep it in cosmids or some other suitable vector.

[grandpa]

That's a tough question, really. On the one hand, I understand that viruses themselves are often used to extract antidotes and for various studies. On the other, there are obvious risks involved.
So I don't think this is a "yes" or "No" question.
It's a conditional one.

Grandpa h.

[Prometheus]

We could cut it up and keep it in cosmids or some other suitable vector.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing isn't it? Yes, we could store it in cosmids, but as I said earlier we are not only interested in the sequence data, but actually using the organism itself. We have already done this with the HIV virus and the Lambda phage. As of yet, we have not developed the tecniques to create an organism from it's DNA. Thereofre, we would need to store the organism itself.

So I don't think this is a "yes" or "No" question.

I'll state the obvious here. Unfortunately it *is* a yes or no question becuse we either keep it or we don't.


And as I said earlier, even if we cold make a decision, some scientist would keep a sample. Thats just how we are.

[Pooeypants]

It's a poxvirus, big DNA and enveloped, I'm pretty sure we have plenty of others around that we could use for gene therapy. Unless you know something especially unique about it.

[Prometheus]

Other than that it is very successfull (which is why people want to use it), no, I don't kow anything especially usefull about it. That's the whole point - what we don't know. Admittedly, it's a packrat mentality, but that's how scientists are, and that's why it will never be destroyed.

[MethanalCHO]

Going through the post, I saw posts of interest, of which I am commenting on.

I think it's better to be safe than sorry. The smallpox virus is one of the most lethal organisms history has ever known. It's destructive effect is infamous. Why hasn't it been destroyed? What if it mutates into something worse?

Read more: SMALLPOX VIRUS

What do you think, folks?

The smallpox virus is kept in top-security labs. If it were to mutate, it would not affect the labs themselves, and the varicella virus would still remain within its icy prison. Also, there are several diseases with higher mortality rates than smallpox. Smallpox's mortality rate is 40% (I think, correct me if I'm wrong), while there are several viruses with higher rates, such as H5N1 at 65%, Ebola and Marburg at 90%, along with some 100% lethal viruses, like HIV.

It has great miltary potential and we may need it in future for scientific purposes (who knows at this stage). In some ways, it is a biological entity, do we have a right to eliminate such an entity and lead to its extinction?

You are right: one scientific purpose for the smallpox virus could be in genetic engineering, as a vector, with some advantages over using HIV. In the case of HIV, the GM-ed virus can mutate back to its regular form if it is exposed to pathogenic HIV viruses. However, the varicella virus (for smallpox, that is) does not exist in the wild, so reverting to its dangerous form would be very unlikely.

Of course we do. We fought it and won. It tried to destroy us and it nearly did. Letting it survive is risky and the risk outweighs any potential it may have , militarily or otherwise.

It's kept in a top-security laboratory, kept at merciless temperatures. We have no way right now of recording its genome: if we did, we could copy it (we could use the protein coating as a vector and modify its genome to be symbotic) and throw away the test subjects, but we can't do that now, so we'll have to save the virus until such is possible.

Not always. The fatality rate of Smallpox is not that great and if we consider the conditions we're in, especially in the developed nations, it isn't as big a problem as one would assume.

You're right, Pooeypants. Smallpox's mortality rate is only 40% (several diseases have more than twice that mortality rate), and we have an obviously working smallpox vaccine should an outbreak occur.

My only concern with destroying the last smallpox virus is that we cannot know for sure that it really is the last virus. We know that the Soviet Union had stockpiles of the virus, and we cannot say for sure that all of it is accounted for. There is a high likelihood that there is more out there, and it could very well end up in the hands of people who are not afraid to use it as a weapon. With that in mind, I think it is important to keep a small sample of it around so that it can be used to create a vaccine in case there ever is another outbreak.

Well, there already is a vaccine made from the still-living cowpox virus, that obviously worked against smallpox and sent it to its grave. But you are right, Ericsp, there could be unauthorized smallpox viruses in captivity, to be used as a biological weapon.

As a molecular biologist, I would hate to see smallpox destroyed. Untill we develop better means of protien engineering, we are stuck using natures library of proteins, and throwing away suck a successfull organism would be unwise.

Aside from that, it is basically impossible to destroy all of it because no scientist would let it happen. Someone would secretly keep a sample. Us biologists are packrats.

You're right: until we can find a way to artificially recreate the smallpox virus, we need to keep Nature's sample. Yeah, and even if we did destroy it, someone (biologist or otherwise) would keep it unauthorized, for good or for bad (depending on who has it).

Though to be fair, if we sequenced its genome we could rebuild the damn thing with relative ease.

followed by...

Theoretically, but current methods do not allow for synthisizing sequences longer than a couple of kilobases. The smallpox genome is many times that length.

Secondarily, we may find more than the genomic cintent interesting. It has been proposed that the smallpox virus could be effectively used as a delivery vector for several gene tharapy treatments.

Promethus, you are correct: we don't currently have the technology to recreate the smallpox genome. Once we do that, we can build the proteins ourselves, and artificially create the viruses as GM vectors. At that point, we can throw it away. But we can't recreate it now, so we shouldn't.

But the smallpox virus could successfully replace using HIV as a vector in GM therapy. If we were to find a way to artificially recreate it, we could use it as a safer way to use a viral vector than with HIV. The underlined section above explains why.

We could cut it up and keep it in cosmids or some other suitable vector.

followed by...

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing isn't it? Yes, we could store it in cosmids, but as I said earlier we are not only interested in the sequence data, but actually using the organism itself. We have already done this with the HIV virus and the Lambda phage. As of yet, we have not developed the tecniques to create an organism from it's DNA. Therefore, we would need to store the organism itself.

I'll state the obvious here. Unfortunately it *is* a yes or no question becuse we either keep it or we don't.


And as I said earlier, even if we cold make a decision, some scientist would keep a sample. Thats just how we are.

Correct: until we can recreate the entire smallpox virus artificially, we cannot throw away the natural ones we have left. But since that hasn't happened yet, we can't destroy the last of the smallpox viruses. In my eyes, smallpox is promising in genetics, so we can't shut the opportunity ourselves.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So what's my opinion? Keep smallpox alive. We could use it in genetics with great benefits, and we cannot intentionally reject the opportunity. Please reply!

R.I.P. SMALLPOX
(VARCIELLA VIRVS)
1000 BCE? - 1980 CE
Once a ravage across
the land, he never
spread, and was
destroyed.