Congratulations Governor Scott Walker of Wisconsin….

[Dodds]

Actually taxes taken are far above income tax and sales tax figures. The state takes all and more of the money from people at various tax points - wherever you buy goods or rent or whatever, you pay tax, and then they pay tax, then the next people, and so forth.

Which is why tax collected as a percentage of GDP is a much better and less misleading figure to go with. Which again shows the USA pays a lot less than other developed nations. Also if you look at the tax rates in the USA for something like a tax on petrol/gas AGAIN it is a much lower rate than other developed nations. In other words SPY007 is just whinging.

[Charlatan]

Which is why tax collected as a percentage of GDP is a much better and less misleading figure to go with. Which again shows the USA pays a lot less than other developed nations. Also if you look at the tax rates in the USA for something like a tax on petrol/gas AGAIN it is a much lower rate than other developed nations. In other words SPY007 is just whinging.

Okay, okay, i know you researched your answers... and i like socialism too.

[Dodds]

The thing that most irritates me is capital gains taxes.
The government actually loses money by charging
capital gains taxes. There was that famous interview
where Obama was asked this question.


Obama's reply was:


Did you get that, it is not fair that some people should
make more money if we can stop them, by taxing it, and
it really does not matter to me that it results in less
revenue to the government, my motive is to stop
people from succeeding so that they will be not have
more money than others, that is fair. Fairness means
no one has more than anyone else. Marxist bullshit,
from the word go, from each according to his ability
to each according to his need. Redistribute the
wealth, don't let anyone be more wealthy than
anyone else.

This guy was raised by a communist mother and
thoroughly indoctrinated, then finished raising by
his socialist/leftist grand parents, and as he stated
in his first book, his mentor as a teenager was Frank
Marshal Davis, a communist. Then as he stated in
his book, "Dreams of my Father", he went on to
college and hang out with the Marxist professors.
This guy is an open book if you just listen to him.
And the book is all leftist/Marxist crap that has led
to the down fall of every nation that prescribed to
it, like
Russia, Ukrain, Uzbek, Kazkh, Byelorussian, Azerbaijan, Georgia,
Tajik, Moldavia,Kirghtz, Lithuania, Turkmen, Armenia, Latvia,
Estonia, North Korea, Venzuela, Cuba, Poland, East Germany,
Chekoslovakia, Hungary, Romania, Communist China, Cuba.

Add to those the socialist states of Chile, Venezuela, Peru,
England, and today the failing states of Greece, Italy,
Portugal, Spain, Ireland, that are going into financial
meltdown from these large governments.

The amazing thing is that these idiots can't see all the
failures and bankruptcies of all the countries where this
big government ideology is executed. They keep trying
to do it regardless of the failures.

Yet Sweden, Norway, Germany, France, Finland, Japan, etc etc are doing just fine. Complete rewrite of history and proof positive of your ignorance on the subject of Europe. Ireland and Spain had budget surpluses before the failure of the capitalist system in 2008. It amazes me that someone could buy into this amount of propaganda and still be able to function.

[Spy_007]

Which is why tax collected as a percentage of GDP is a much better and less misleading figure to go with.

The only problem with this is that GDP does not
pay taxes. Individuals pay taxes, and nobody
else. When you take 2/3 of their money in taxes
it is a large brake on the economy.

Gross domestic product (GDP) refers to the market value of
all officially recognized final goods and services produced
within a country in a given period. Taking that as a definition,
the service part could be construed to service that government
provides. By this definition, then if you had everyone go to
work for the government helping their neighbors cut their
lawns, and water their gardens, I guess you could pay all
these government employees a 100,000 per year and they
would add to the GDP. So why don't the government just
hire everyone at that rate and solve all our problems?

Just asking, to see if you can answer. Consider this a test.

[Spy_007]

Ireland and Spain had budget surpluses before the failure of the capitalist system in 2008. It amazes me that someone could buy into this amount of propaganda and still be able to function.

Your little write up above labels the 2008 meltdown as a capitalist
failure, yet the reason for that immediate melt down was the
mortgage debt that imploded. All that debt was brought on
by government meddling in the free market. A number of capitalist
warned that the government meddling and mandating those
bad loans be made was the problem. This was a complete
government failure, not a capitalist failure.

So if government is so good why have all these
government controlled economies melted down?
Russia, Ukrain, Uzbek, Kazkh, Byelorussian, Azerbaijan, Georgia,
Tajik, Moldavia,Kirghtz, Lithuania, Turkmen, Armenia, Latvia,
Estonia, North Korea, Venzuela, Cuba, Poland, East Germany,
Chekoslovakia, Hungary, Romania, Communist China, Cuba.

Add to those the socialist states of Chile, Venezuela, Peru,
England, and today the failing states of Greece, Italy,
Portugal, Spain, Ireland, that are going into financial
meltdown from these large governments.

[Dodds]

The only problem with this is that GDP does not
pay taxes. Individuals pay taxes, and nobody
else. When you take 2/3 of their money in taxes
it is a large brake on the economy.

Gross domestic product (GDP) refers to the market value of
all officially recognized final goods and services produced
within a country in a given period. Taking that as a definition,
the service part could be construed to service that government
provides. By this definition, then if you had everyone go to
work for the government helping their neighbors cut their
lawns, and water their gardens, I guess you could pay all
these government employees a 100,000 per year and they
would add to the GDP. So why don't the government just
hire everyone at that rate and solve all our problems?

Just asking, to see if you can answer. Consider this a test.

I consider it a strawman. You obviously don't understand my political position.

However lets just take your example. Say the government did do all the hiring and firing of the populace, what is to make you think that they couldn't pay everyone $100,000 a year? The problem with your example is the value of whatever is being paid would decrease. This would be due to a massive increase in the money supply. This is known as inflation.

You understand that?

[Dodds]

Your little write up above labels the 2008 meltdown as a capitalist
failure, yet the reason for that immediate melt down was the
mortgage debt that imploded. All that debt was brought on
by government meddling in the free market.

Deregulation? Meddling in the free market? Why I think you have your terms confused.

A number of capitalist
warned that the government meddling and mandating those
bad loans be made was the problem. This was a complete
government failure, not a capitalist failure.

Same Capitalists who predicted hyperinflation for the USA no doubt. Also private debt and mortgages were a much higher percentage of the market. Again propaganda.

So if government is so good why have all these
government controlled economies melted down?
Russia, Ukrain, Uzbek, Kazkh, Byelorussian, Azerbaijan, Georgia,
Tajik, Moldavia,Kirghtz, Lithuania, Turkmen, Armenia, Latvia,
Estonia, North Korea, Venzuela, Cuba, Poland, East Germany,
Chekoslovakia, Hungary, Romania, Communist China, Cuba.

Seriously? Stop with the strawman arguments. I could argue that the fall of the USSR was because they entered the free market. But that would take too long to explain to you.

Add to those the socialist states of Chile, Venezuela, Peru,
England, and today the failing states of Greece, Italy,
Portugal, Spain, Ireland, that are going into financial
meltdown from these large governments.

Chile is socialist? Well that ones wrong. And the failing of the European states is because of the policy of austerity. Seriously where the fuck do you get your information from? It doesn't seem to be from the real world.

And oh I see you accept that Spain and Ireland had budget surpluses prior to the US capitalist crash. I also see you have stopped whinging about the USA tax burden as when it is compared to many other developed economies its tax rate is low. Thats good. I could talk about Greece too but you would get lost in the jargon. Lets just say it was not socialism that caused the failure of Greece. It needs some now.

[Spy_007]

I was referring to Chile with their last government. With
that government the economy completely collapsed.
They then reduced government spending by 95% if
you can believe that. They have done really well ever
since. You just have to think a minute before you do
those knee jerk reactions of yours. This has been a
few years, so I maybe you just don't have that much
knowledge of history. I am probably older and lived
through a lot of this.

[Spy_007]

A post or two back I mentioned how I really hated the
capital gains tax, and you know I think that is a perfect
subject to show just how stupid this democratic government
gets everything wrong. I think I will just take that on as
a project and chop that idiot Obama off at the knees and
hand him his head. That should get under the skin of all
you democrats.

[Dodds]

I was referring to Chile with their last government. With
that government the economy completely collapsed.
They then reduced government spending by 95% if
you can believe that. They have done really well ever
since.

No they haven't. Also that was in the 70s when a freely elected government was forced out of power and a fascist government was implemented by the USA and UK. Which caused their entire economy to crash causing untold human suffering, a massive increase in pollution and poverty as well as showing the entire Friedman was a sham. I see you are ignorant of that too.

You just have to think a minute before you do
those knee jerk reactions of yours. This has been a
few years, so I maybe you just don't have that much
knowledge of history. I am probably older and lived
through a lot of this.

Absolutely priceless. Trust me I know about it. Started on September 11 1974 and is misnamed the miracle of Chili. Only after increased government spending did the economy of Chili improve and make up the ground lost due to the failed Chicago boys experiment. You may have lived through it but it is clear you know nothing about it.

[ironeagle]

I agree they work for the money, whether they truley work hard is a matter of opinion, but there is little difference between welfair and working for the government, which is why I put welfair in parenthesis, and not free standing in the sentence. The government worker get their pay the same exact way welfair recipients do they get it straight from the taxpayers pockets. I also didn't say they got paid for free but clearly when they get the equivelent of welfair from the people for their jobs they do not deserve to get paid above and beyound their dues especially when the hard working people who pay their wage aren't getting squat for pay. I find any teacher who makes such a wage and whines and strikes to be a worthless money grubbing dirt bag. That wage is above and beyound anything that most tax payers get. I don't see where they get off complaining. I think most teahcer laze and fail to teach you can see that when you compare American test scores to other countries, and they often refuse to help their students, often instead they choose to ignore the student. I see no reason to highten the wages of a medocre worker class at best. Not that there aren't some good teachers left but this is just crap, it's just an excuse to squeeze the tax payers for more undeserved income.

"Welfare"??? Really?????

Teachers put hard work into their jobs. That money isn't given to them for free.

As usual, you're being a reductionist.