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Thread: In the beginning...

  1. #13
    Male Lesbian ruksak's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: AC
    ... if things continue as we think they will, nothingness is imminent.
    I have always felt the laws of nature would apply to the universe. i.e. everything has a beginning and an end.

    I have always been fascinated by theoretical astrophysics, however admittedly, I do not have the mind to absorb it's tangled nuances.

    Dear Optimist, Pessimist and Realist, while you guys were arguing about the glass of water, I drank it! ~ Sincerely, the Opportunist.

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    Lobotomized Angry Citizen's Avatar
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    I have always felt the laws of nature would apply to the universe. i.e. everything has a beginning and an end.
    Pff. Not even cause and effect applies to the world. We know that quantum mechanics is the true representation of reality, and we get some really crazy stuff happening there.

    A man said to the universe:
    "Sir, I exist!"
    "However," replied the universe,
    "The fact has not created in me
    A sense of obligation."


    -- Stephen Crane

  3. #15
    Male Lesbian ruksak's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    Pff. Not even cause and effect applies to the world. We know that quantum mechanics is the true representation of reality, and we get some really crazy stuff happening there.
    Sounds more like your area, AC. When I listen to Hawking speak (when he's not dumbing it down for the crowd) I have to take my hat off because my brain starts overheating. I'm not "equipped" to approach quantum mechanics in any other capacity than to proverbially poke it with a stick.

    Dear Optimist, Pessimist and Realist, while you guys were arguing about the glass of water, I drank it! ~ Sincerely, the Opportunist.

  4. #16
    Stephen Best barts's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Angry Citizen View Post
    ... nothingness is imminent.
    Do you have any notions about the nature of "nothingness"? And, if it has a nature is it "nothingness"? That's a challenging concept to get one's head around.

    Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd - Voltaire

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    Lobotomized Angry Citizen's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: barts View Post
    Do you have any notions about the nature of "nothingness"? And, if it has a nature is it "nothingness"? That's a challenging concept to get one's head around.
    Nothingness in this case is merely the average volume-specific temperature of the universe becoming essentially zero. In other words, a total lack of meaningful amounts of energy or matter.

    A man said to the universe:
    "Sir, I exist!"
    "However," replied the universe,
    "The fact has not created in me
    A sense of obligation."


    -- Stephen Crane

  6. #18
    dead for tax reasons Peter's Avatar
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    Isn't the total mass/energy of the universe constant? Even if the energy density of any given point in the universe becomes almost zero the energy contained in the entire universe will be unchanged. If so, how could an entire universe ever become nothing or end.

    Can the universe leak energy or does it just become cooler and cooler by spreading out? What is it spreading into?

    Why is there something instead of nothing?

    Does this hurt your head? It hurts mine.

    When we have answers to these questions will we be gods and be free to go off and create our own universes?

    Religion is poison because it asks us to give up our most precious faculty, which is that of reason, and to believe things without evidence. It then asks us to respect this, which it calls faith. - Christopher Hitchens

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    dead for tax reasons Peter's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: barts View Post
    Do you have any notions about the nature of "nothingness"? And, if it has a nature is it "nothingness"? That's a challenging concept to get one's head around.
    Nothing does not exist. That's what I think.

    Religion is poison because it asks us to give up our most precious faculty, which is that of reason, and to believe things without evidence. It then asks us to respect this, which it calls faith. - Christopher Hitchens

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    Sapere Aude Jack's Avatar
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    When we have answers to these questions will we be gods and be free to go off and create our own universes?
    Probably not. Understanding doesn't automatically result in the ability to recreate. Learning how the universe came to be likely won't give us the ability to create universes ourselves.



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  9. #21
    dead for tax reasons Peter's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    Probably not. Understanding doesn't automatically result in the ability to recreate. Learning how the universe came to be likely won't give us the ability to create universes ourselves.
    Killjoy! I want to believe that it's trivially easy to create universes once we understand and some day I'll have my own. If you're nice to me Jack I'll let you into my universe.

    Seriously, you're most likely right.

    Religion is poison because it asks us to give up our most precious faculty, which is that of reason, and to believe things without evidence. It then asks us to respect this, which it calls faith. - Christopher Hitchens

  10. #22
    Lobotomized Angry Citizen's Avatar
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    Isn't the total mass/energy of the universe constant? Even if the energy density of any given point in the universe becomes almost zero the energy contained in the entire universe will be unchanged. If so, how could an entire universe ever become nothing or end.
    Guess you have to define "nothing". Will "something" exist in the vast, dark void that will be space? Yup. Will it be able to do anything? Nope. It will be totally inconsequential. All the functions it performs now would not be performed then. If we define energy as the ability to do work, then eventually, not only will there be no more work left to perform, but there'd be nothing to perform it on anyway.

    What is it spreading into?
    Itself. Imagine a box with air in it. Seal the box so that no air can escape. Then place the box inside a bigger box, and evacuate all the air between the big box and the smaller box. Then open the first box. Air escapes and disperses, but there is more volume to occupy so the pressure decreases. Keep doing this ad infinitum with boxes the size of houses, skyscrapers, continents, planets, galaxies, and finally, the universe. Eventually you'll see that the atoms that were once so neatly packed and capable of exerting enormous forces on its container are now so utterly insignificant as to be easily ignored.

    A man said to the universe:
    "Sir, I exist!"
    "However," replied the universe,
    "The fact has not created in me
    A sense of obligation."


    -- Stephen Crane

  11. #23
    Volcanic Erupter finder's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Peter View Post
    The real challenge here is to define beginning and end.
    It pains me to say this, but I agree. We actually agree on something, eeeeek!

    Quote Quote by: BlackSheep View Post
    And you you dismiss my experiences.
    Quote Quote by: arX View Post
    Irony. You're simply divine at exhibiting it and I want to make sweet sweet love to you for it.
    "The trouble with people is not so much with their ignorance as it is with their knowing so many things that are not so." ~ William Alanson White

  12. #24
    Male Lesbian ruksak's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Peter View Post
    Nothing does not exist. That's what I think.
    lol...mind = blown

    Dear Optimist, Pessimist and Realist, while you guys were arguing about the glass of water, I drank it! ~ Sincerely, the Opportunist.

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