God doesn't want me!

[Madshadows]

If he's omnipotent he can do anything. That's the definition of omnipotent. God is god, he can do whatever he damn well likes. He doesn't have to ask your permission and he doesn't have to answer to you at all. Got a problem with that?

If he can do anything why can't he do manners?

[Peter]

So if god knows peter's motivation already, maybe that's the reason god is being so quiet and not communicating with peter. I'm just a duh and probably mistaken, but it seems to me that peter is insincere in his desire to know god, and has in fact already made up his mind that god doesn't exist. I would even say that his motivation is to mock the idea of god and anyone who believes in him. So why the surprise that god isn't interested?

So I hurt gods feelings with my mocking and he's ignoring me? Are you serious?

I'm told that the christian god loves me and wants me to be "saved". He knows exactly what it would take for me to accept him as my savior. What it would take is trivial for an omnipotent god. So why doesn't he make the effort? I assume he's revealed himself to you right? And while you're at it explain why he hasn't done this for billions of people on the planet?

[Jack]

Don't fret, Peter. There are plenty of gods out there. Perhaps one of them, in need of followers lest they fade into mythological status, will take pity on you and appear in person to recruit you to their side.

[Questatement]

Why doesn't God speak to me? He could wait until I'm alone and then in the booming voice from the 10 Commandments movie he could tell me to believe in Him and devote the rest of my life to converting people. Can't He do that? It wouldn't even have to be out loud. It could just be in my head.

Question - could you guarantee your response would be in the positive? Considering that we are talking about a complete surrender of control over your entire life... I would postulate that you would be unable to promise a response in the positive.

If that is true, just how may hoops do you expect the creator of all things to jump through for you - to only be rejected and/or mocked after? One, ten, a thousand?

Would that even be a God that you could respect in the long run?

[Peter]

Question - could you guarantee your response would be in the positive? Considering that we are talking about a complete surrender of control over your entire life... I would postulate that you would be unable to promise a response in the positive.

You mean god only reveals himself to the people he knows will fall to their knees and blow him, figuratively of course? Why did he create all the billions of people that apparently he never intends to reveal to because he knows they'll tell him to get stuffed?

If that is true, just how may hoops do you expect the creator of all things to jump through for you - to only be rejected and/or mocked after? One, ten, a thousand?

If god loves everyone and is omnipotent I don't expect he has a problem with hoops at all. Are you telling us that god gets put out by getting stood up?

Would that even be a God that you could respect in the long run?

If god revealed himself unequivocally he would immediately jump up about ten notches on my respect meter. Of course there's no place for him to go but up on my meter.

[Peter]

Don't fret, Peter. There are plenty of gods out there. Perhaps one of them, in need of followers lest they fade into mythological status, will take pity on you and appear in person to recruit you to their side.

Thanks Jack you're a real friend. I'm kinda hoping for one of the Norse gods to take a shine to me but I'd even settle for one of the greek gods.

[Questatement]

If god loves everyone and is omnipotent I don't expect he has a problem with hoops at all. Are you telling us that god gets put out by getting stood up?

Only a self-abusing person wouldn't get offended.

[Peter]

Only a self-abusing person wouldn't get offended.

First, we're talking about a friggin GOD here not a person.

Second, your christian god is certainly self abusing. He knowingly created a world where most of the inhabitants reject him! How self abusing is that?!

Third, there is no way he could possible get offended when he knowingly created every single offense. He's omniscient remember?

[highfidelity]

[QUOTE]

How about the non-anthropomorphic "it"?

Sure, if that what you prefer.

Why would a god defined as "omnipotent" be restrained by logic? Any possibility, no matter how illogical or impossible to imagine, should be allowed.

OK. So what is there to discuss?

How does what humans do negate its desire to be worshiped?

Why do you think it desires to be worshipped? Why make this assumption?

[highfidelity]

Because "must" negates concious free will and absolute. Who or what can command a free and absolute god to "must" anything?

You misunderstood my post. I wasn't saying that he had to do anything. I was saying logically speaking we must conclude this.

If he can do anything why can't he do manners?

What makes you think he can't?

[highfidelity]

[QUOTE]

So I hurt gods feelings with my mocking and he's ignoring me? Are you serious?

That's not what I said. I said you are insincere. You don't actually want to know god. Do you deny this?

I'm told that the christian god loves me and wants me to be "saved". He knows exactly what it would take for me to accept him as my savior. What it would take is trivial for an omnipotent god. So why doesn't he make the effort? I assume he's revealed himself to you right? And while you're at it explain why he hasn't done this for billions of people on the planet?

Not make the effort? Why are all these theists here talking to you, answering all your sincere questions? Why are there so many holy books detailing his nature and the method needed to see him?

Have you read any holy books or seriously investigated any religions? Or do you just want to have a personal interview with him so you can tell him what a $@*! he is and you are surprised that he didn't show up and conform to all your demands?

[Peter]

That's not what I said. I said you are insincere. You don't actually want to know god. Do you deny this?

In effect it's what you said. God is pouting because I'm not sincere. What kind of a god can't take a little mocking? I want to know the truth and so should you.

Not make the effort? Why are all these theists here talking to you, answering all your sincere questions? Why are there so many holy books detailing his nature and the method needed to see him?

Sue me, I'm skeptical. I generally don't follow the crowd like a lemming. I'm not convinced by sheer numbers of believers or the ancient writing of ignorant humans. I see exactly how and why mankind has invented thousands of religions down through the ages and christianity is just one of the latest in vogue today. It's not even the most popular.

Have you read any holy books or seriously investigated any religions? Or do you just want to have a personal interview with him so you can tell him what a $@*! he is and you are surprised that he didn't show up and conform to all your demands?

I'm familiar with the mainstream world religions. I would love a personal interview with any of the current gods or even a debate between them if such a thing could be arranged. My demands? I'll repeat again. I'm told, by people who claim to know, that the christian god created me, loves me as his child and has even sacrificed a human to take the blame for my sins so that I can live eternally in His shining light. After all that it seems like such a trivial thing for an omniscient, omnipotent, human sacrificing god to actually let me know he's real so that I can exercise my god given free will as to whether I want to follow him or not.

The way it's set up now it appears he only wants the lemmings, the ignorant, the gullible, the needy and the hopeless. I'm sorry it upsets you but that's the way I see it.