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RickSp · Nov 18, 2005, 12:10 pm

At the risk of dragging out a seriously dead horse for further beating, I recently came across an interview regarding the collapse of the World Trade Towers that was particularly good. It includes several animations which show how the structure of the WTC towers was very different from typical sky scrapers and the presumed mode of failure of the connecting clips that led to the progressive collapse of floors and the buildings themselves.

I am confident that the conspiracy types will not read it. That is fine. If anyone with an open mind wants to gain a better understanding of how and why the towers are believed to have fallen, it is well worth reading. The author is Thomas Eagar. He is neither theologan, economist nor physics professor. He is the Thomas Lord Professor of Materials Engineering and Engineering Systems at MIT.

The Collapse: An Engineer's Perspective

On the general topic of buildings falling down, I find the story of the Citicorp Center in New York to be fascinating. On September 1, 1978, the City of New York was on the verge of evacuating 156 city blocks of mid-town Manhattan as Hurricane Ella approached the city. A design flaw had been identified in the building, open now for over a year, that could have caused it to topple in hurricane force winds. Repairs had progressed in secret to correct the structural flaw but were not finished as the hurricane approached.

Fortunately for the city, the hurricane jogged east and missed Manhattan completely. Within a month the repairs were completed. The entire affair stayed a secret for years. When in the middle 1990's word got out, a short paaper describing the mistakes made was published called "Project SERENE". SERENE was an acronym for "Special Engineering Review of Events Nobody Envisioned."

What does the Citicorp Center have to do with the World Trade Towers? Both were subject to "Events that Nobody Envisioned." No one had envisioned the scope of the fire from a 757 flying into the WTC towers. The buildings were strong enough to take the impact and the buildings could react to typical office fires but the combination of both impact and the widely dispersed fire was beyond what anyone envisioned.

Citicorp Center (short summary)
THE FIFTY-NINE-STORY CRISIS (Full article)

Kite · Nov 18, 2005, 12:47 pm

Why is the reason the towers fell even an issue? They still fell, nothing you can say or do can change that.

RickSp · Nov 18, 2005, 01:08 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Kite

Why is the reason the towers fell even an issue? They still fell, nothing you can say or do can change that.

Read any of the conspiracy sites. (Do a google seach. They are legion.) The theories are all wild and wooley.

Kite · Nov 18, 2005, 01:16 pm

Yeah I've seen them. I've seen the flash movie about the pentagon (and I rather enjoyed it) and heard about the bombs in the WTC and all that. It still doesnt change that it happend. I'm just wondering why its so important to some people, I really dont understand.

Son of Belial · Nov 18, 2005, 01:44 pm

Kite, let's put aside the argument for the moment and assume the conspiracy is true. Let's assume the government planted bombs in the WTC. You don't see why that would be "so important to some people?"

Nono · Nov 18, 2005, 01:45 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Quoted by Rick

The World Trade Center was mostly air. It looked like a huge building if you walked inside, but it was just like this room we're in. The walls are a very small fraction of the total room. The World Trade Center collapse proved that with a 110-story building, if 95 percent of it's air, as was the case here, you're only going to have about five stories of rubble at the bottom after it falls.

A similar phenomenon explains the unreal sight of a large airplane disappearing into the side of WTC2 -- such aircraft are much less massive than they look.

Walmas · Nov 18, 2005, 04:24 pm

We all know that it is very unlikely that the government planted bombs in the world trade center. If they wanted to blow somewhere up the bush administration wouldnt have chosen the financial district but mabye somewhere more symbolic ie the empire building. But many people who believe seriously in conspiracy theorys have problems and wont listen to you. I still love reading them but they just get more and more strange.

Nov 18, 2005, 12:10 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
RickSp Volcanic Erupter Posts: 9,589	The World Trade Towers and the Citicorp Center At the risk of dragging out a seriously dead horse for further beating, I recently came across an interview regarding the collapse of the World Trade Towers that was particularly good. It includes several animations which show how the structure of the WTC towers was very different from typical sky scrapers and the presumed mode of failure of the connecting clips that led to the progressive collapse of floors and the buildings themselves. I am confident that the conspiracy types will not read it. That is fine. If anyone with an open mind wants to gain a better understanding of how and why the towers are believed to have fallen, it is well worth reading. The author is Thomas Eagar. He is neither theologan, economist nor physics professor. He is the Thomas Lord Professor of Materials Engineering and Engineering Systems at MIT. The Collapse: An Engineer's Perspective On the general topic of buildings falling down, I find the story of the Citicorp Center in New York to be fascinating. On September 1, 1978, the City of New York was on the verge of evacuating 156 city blocks of mid-town Manhattan as Hurricane Ella approached the city. A design flaw had been identified in the building, open now for over a year, that could have caused it to topple in hurricane force winds. Repairs had progressed in secret to correct the structural flaw but were not finished as the hurricane approached. Fortunately for the city, the hurricane jogged east and missed Manhattan completely. Within a month the repairs were completed. The entire affair stayed a secret for years. When in the middle 1990's word got out, a short paaper describing the mistakes made was published called "Project SERENE". SERENE was an acronym for "Special Engineering Review of Events Nobody Envisioned." What does the Citicorp Center have to do with the World Trade Towers? Both were subject to "Events that Nobody Envisioned." No one had envisioned the scope of the fire from a 757 flying into the WTC towers. The buildings were strong enough to take the impact and the buildings could react to typical office fires but the combination of both impact and the widely dispersed fire was beyond what anyone envisioned. Citicorp Center (short summary) THE FIFTY-NINE-STORY CRISIS (Full article) Rick "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." Sinclair Lewis

Nov 18, 2005, 12:47 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
Kite Evil Overlord Location: A Geofront, somewhere in Antarctica Posts: 938	Why is the reason the towers fell even an issue? They still fell, nothing you can say or do can change that. I know your type. You think, "I'll just get me a costume, rip off the neighborhood kids." Next thing you know, you've got a jet shaped like a skull with lasers on the front! -The Monarch

Nov 18, 2005, 01:16 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
Kite Evil Overlord Location: A Geofront, somewhere in Antarctica Posts: 938	Yeah I've seen them. I've seen the flash movie about the pentagon (and I rather enjoyed it) and heard about the bombs in the WTC and all that. It still doesnt change that it happend. I'm just wondering why its so important to some people, I really dont understand. I know your type. You think, "I'll just get me a costume, rip off the neighborhood kids." Next thing you know, you've got a jet shaped like a skull with lasers on the front! -The Monarch

Nov 18, 2005, 04:24 pm	#7 (permalink) (top)
Walmas Igneous Magma Posts: 349	We all know that it is very unlikely that the government planted bombs in the world trade center. If they wanted to blow somewhere up the bush administration wouldnt have chosen the financial district but mabye somewhere more symbolic ie the empire building. But many people who believe seriously in conspiracy theorys have problems and wont listen to you. I still love reading them but they just get more and more strange. Dont pray in my school and i wont think in your church.

Nov 18, 2005, 01:44 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
Son of Belial BANNED: Requested ban Location: Acheron 27 Posts: 1,461	Kite, let's put aside the argument for the moment and assume the conspiracy is true. Let's assume the government planted bombs in the WTC. You don't see why that would be "so important to some people?"