Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

Paavo · Feb 3, 2004, 12:53 pm

I think this has been a topic before, but couldn't find it.
Also, if this is the wrong section, a moderator can probably move it?

Anyway,

What do you think? Do you believe that there is a chance of life outside our own rock?

My own view is the classic "well it'd be a hell of a lot of wasted space in case there didn't exist any". And beside that close-to-naive way of thinking, I think we haven't explored (or even mapped for that matter) enough of the universe to be able to give a firm "nope" on the issue. Just the fact that there could've been some traces of water found on a planet as close to us as Mars, tells something, doesn't it? I just think the universe is much too large not to leave the possibility (And IMO even a probability) open for guessing instead of just saying that it's impossible.
That, and I'm a huge fan of science fiction, so...

So, what do you think?

mihai · Feb 3, 2004, 01:10 pm

I think there is life out there for sure!... I would give an arm to see a real alien (oh well maybe not an entire arm but a finger for sure).
I am an ardent believer and I think people don't pay enough attention to stuff like this...maybe it's because of stupid sites like this one. They look at that sort of crap and laugh and then when you tell them you believe there's aliens out there somewhere they connect you to that kind of thing and laugh in your face.

A true sci-fi fan/alien believer is the most skeptical subspecies:) If you would take one to touch a landed UFO he would bang on it and prod it and look underneath for a "made in Taiwan" tag.... and even then he wouldn't be fully convinced...

Plaything48 · Feb 3, 2004, 02:26 pm

when you say alien, are you talking about intelligent aliens or just an alien.

**Pooeypants** · Feb 3, 2004, 08:23 pm

Probability is too high to reject the possibility.

Impenitent · Feb 3, 2004, 08:30 pm

billions and billions and billions of galaxies... wait... extraterrestrial? not from/on earth... god would fall in this category...

IWantToBelieve · Feb 3, 2004, 08:56 pm

I remember reading a book on SETI. I can't fully remember the particular chain of logic/statistics presented in the argument for the case, but it goes something like...

Estimating that there are 100 billion stars in just this galaxy, and assuming that the universe is x billion years old, and that the creation of Earth and it's life forms took X+2 to 4 billion years, then the chance that there are sentient extra-terrestrial life forms of equal/greater technological achievement out there increases dramatically.

Also, conservatively estimating that 1/100,000 star systems support suitable planets for rearing life, then that would mean there could be another 10,000 sentient alien 'races' out there.

So given the math, I'd put money on it!

Plaything48 · Feb 4, 2004, 08:01 am

But you're basing it on the fact that organisms on other planets would have developed an organ similar to the functions of the brain. Although large organisms will need this, what's the probability of it actually happening.

castille · Feb 5, 2004, 10:37 am

I figure we'll make good slaves for some alien race.

Lev · Feb 10, 2004, 05:12 am

There literally has to be, when you look at the scale.

I remember reading about five years ago that humans had found a lump of metal somewhere that was without question machined into formation, and was categorically stated as being "something which we humans cannot create, cannot replicate, and cannot be made from anything on this planet" (or words to that effect).

Samildanach · Feb 10, 2004, 07:37 am

Initial thought on this subjects are 1) there are probably other alien lifeforms out there unless this universe has been made specifically for us.
Even if we dont find any aliens lifeforms out there we are on the verge of being able to create some anyway. So does it really matter if there are is the question. For example you travel to another planet and meet an alien analogue of a mouse. Sure its organs might be in different places but basically its a mouse. Big Deal.
The only time aliens get interesting is when we assume them to be intelligent and have wondrous technology light years ahead of our own in which case we would be pretty uninteresting to them unless they had some ulterior motive. The only time they will reveal them selves to us is if we suddenly develop decent space travel capabilities and we begin to 'invade' there borders in some fashion ie make a nuisance of ourselves. Up until that point they would do exactly what the rest of us humans would do monitor and try to sabotage any inventions that would lead to that happening.

Feb 10, 2004, 07:40 am

Beam me up Scotty.. their's no intelligent life down here.. in case any other planets have the internet.. lol

**Pooeypants** · Feb 10, 2004, 11:55 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Samildanach,)
Initial thought on this subjects are 1) there are probably other alien lifeforms out there unless this universe has been made specifically for us.
Even if we dont find any aliens lifeforms out there we are on the verge of being able to create some anyway. So does it really matter if there are is the question. For example you travel to another planet and meet an alien analogue of a mouse. Sure its organs might be in different places but basically its a mouse. Big Deal.
The only time aliens get interesting is when we assume them to be intelligent and have wondrous technology light years ahead of our own in which case we would be pretty uninteresting to them unless they had some ulterior motive. The only time they will reveal them selves to us is if we suddenly develop decent space travel capabilities and we begin to 'invade' there borders in some fashion ie make a nuisance of ourselves. Up until that point they would do exactly what the rest of us humans would do monitor and try to sabotage any inventions that would lead to that happening.<hr size="1" /></blockquote>
What if this rodent equivalent was a silicon based lifeform? Wouldn't that in itself be interesting?

Samildanach · Feb 10, 2004, 12:21 pm

Not particularly....if I remember correctly we already have silicon based lifeforms however they have to live deep within the ocean where the pressure shortens the si-si bond length to something approximating the c-c bond length ; )

NotScientific · Feb 14, 2004, 12:58 am

I guess they exist. The universe is just too big to support only 1 'life' - humans!

**Pooeypants** · Feb 14, 2004, 06:36 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Samildanach,)
Not particularly....if I remember correctly we already have silicon based lifeforms however they have to live deep within the ocean where the pressure shortens the si-si bond length to something approximating the c-c bond length ; )<hr size="1" /></blockquote>
I'm afraid that there aren't such organisms, you got confused, it's lot's of sulphide bonds they have, not silicon. Unless you've got data to prove otherwise ofc.

Scribbler1 · May 31, 2004, 08:41 pm

This is not about alien invaders or anything like it, but SETI has a website where you can download a program which analyses the data from the Aricebo radio telescope. It's a great setup called SETI@HOME which lets you use your computer's down time to analyse these signals (almost entirely radio noise at this point). The idea is to send packets of data to about 3 million computers therby forming in effect a supercomputer. As my machines are always on, I have done about 600 hours of computing for them.

Hey, it doesn't cost anything and who knows...

The link is:

SETI @ HOME

Milton Bradley · Jun 1, 2004, 02:36 pm

I tend to agree therehas to be life out there somewhere.

I am of the camp that hopes we don't find it/them.

We can't even talk to whales, or dolphins, which we know to be intelligent, and have their own language, which are also similar to us in other ways.

I don't think we will be ready to welcome anything other than ourselves for many years.

We can't even coexist with Islam yet... Let alone ET's.

Scribbler1 · Jun 1, 2004, 09:38 pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Milton Bradley,
I tend to agree therehas to be life out there somewhere.

I am of the camp that hopes we don't find it/them.

We can't even talk to whales, or dolphins, which we know to be intelligent, and have their own language, which are also similar to us in other ways.

I don't think we will be ready to welcome anything other than ourselves for many years.

We can't even coexist with Islam yet... Let alone ET's.

Excellent point, but one of the rare qualities the human animal has that is actually positive is curiosity. That plus the feeling I have that if we "discover" intelligent life out there, it will have already discovered US a long time ago, but didn't want to waste their time with this planet of fools. Of course, we could be killed, enslaved or even eaten right after first contact, but I like to think a really advanced race would take us by the hand, like a retarded brother, and teach us a few things. But maybe not.

And whales and dolphins are one thing, but I don't think ANYONE can coexist with Islam, as they can't even coexist with themselves.

ruiner · Jun 1, 2004, 11:22 pm

Quote:

but I like to think a really advanced race would take us by the hand, like a retarded brother, and teach us a few things

More like a man teaching a dog I would think.

Jun 2, 2004, 12:45 am

You guys don't have very high regards for your own species. The cup is half FULL. Despite all the crap that goes on in the world, humans are still a marvel to behold. We are a collection of inanimate matter that has come together and formed an intelligence unique to our planet. We are the universe trying to understand itself. Why would you waste your intelligence dwelling on the negative?
An advanced alien race would most likely have the same experiences we've had. Why assume they would be paragons of virture to our vice? Also, why assume their technology would be so far advanced over ours? Sure it's possible but is ite really likely considering the time it took for live to advance to our level here, why would it take less time elsewhere?
Think Positive guys.

Feb 3, 2004, 02:26 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
Plaything48 Igneous Magma Location: London baby, yeah! Posts: 198	when you say alien, are you talking about intelligent aliens or just an alien. A man has two reasons for doing anything --- a good reason and the real reason. Let us be thankful for the fools. But for them the rest of us could not succeed In spite of the cost of living, it's still popular.

Feb 3, 2004, 08:23 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,470	Probability is too high to reject the possibility. War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

Feb 3, 2004, 08:30 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
Impenitent Hot Lava Posts: 1,859	billions and billions and billions of galaxies... wait... extraterrestrial? not from/on earth... god would fall in this category... "I really like this jacket, but the sleeves are much too long..." insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results...

Feb 3, 2004, 08:56 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
IWantToBelieve Sedimentary Rock Posts: 4	I remember reading a book on SETI. I can't fully remember the particular chain of logic/statistics presented in the argument for the case, but it goes something like... Estimating that there are 100 billion stars in just this galaxy, and assuming that the universe is x billion years old, and that the creation of Earth and it's life forms took X+2 to 4 billion years, then the chance that there are sentient extra-terrestrial life forms of equal/greater technological achievement out there increases dramatically. Also, conservatively estimating that 1/100,000 star systems support suitable planets for rearing life, then that would mean there could be another 10,000 sentient alien 'races' out there. So given the math, I'd put money on it! Your political compass Economic Left/Right: -6.63 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.26

Feb 4, 2004, 08:01 am	#7 (permalink) (top)
Plaything48 Igneous Magma Location: London baby, yeah! Posts: 198	But you're basing it on the fact that organisms on other planets would have developed an organ similar to the functions of the brain. Although large organisms will need this, what's the probability of it actually happening. A man has two reasons for doing anything --- a good reason and the real reason. Let us be thankful for the fools. But for them the rest of us could not succeed In spite of the cost of living, it's still popular.

Feb 3, 2004, 12:53 pm	#1 (permalink) (top)
Paavo Location: Finland Posts: 712	I think this has been a topic before, but couldn't find it. Also, if this is the wrong section, a moderator can probably move it? Anyway, What do you think? Do you believe that there is a chance of life outside our own rock? My own view is the classic "well it'd be a hell of a lot of wasted space in case there didn't exist any". And beside that close-to-naive way of thinking, I think we haven't explored (or even mapped for that matter) enough of the universe to be able to give a firm "nope" on the issue. Just the fact that there could've been some traces of water found on a planet as close to us as Mars, tells something, doesn't it? I just think the universe is much too large not to leave the possibility (And IMO even a probability) open for guessing instead of just saying that it's impossible. That, and I'm a huge fan of science fiction, so... So, what do you think?

Feb 3, 2004, 01:10 pm	#2 (permalink) (top)
mihai Sedimentary Rock Posts: 1	I think there is life out there for sure!... I would give an arm to see a real alien (oh well maybe not an entire arm but a finger for sure). I am an ardent believer and I think people don't pay enough attention to stuff like this...maybe it's because of stupid sites like this one. They look at that sort of crap and laugh and then when you tell them you believe there's aliens out there somewhere they connect you to that kind of thing and laugh in your face. A true sci-fi fan/alien believer is the most skeptical subspecies:) If you would take one to touch a landed UFO he would bang on it and prod it and look underneath for a "made in Taiwan" tag.... and even then he wouldn't be fully convinced...

Feb 5, 2004, 10:37 am	#8 (permalink) (top)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	I figure we'll make good slaves for some alien race. Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

Feb 10, 2004, 05:12 am	#9 (permalink) (top)
Lev Sedimentary Rock Location: Glawwwsta, UK Posts: 9	There literally has to be, when you look at the scale. I remember reading about five years ago that humans had found a lump of metal somewhere that was without question machined into formation, and was categorically stated as being "something which we humans cannot create, cannot replicate, and cannot be made from anything on this planet" (or words to that effect). <span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%'><span style='color:blue'>o the things that people say you cannot:</span></span>

Feb 10, 2004, 07:37 am	#10 (permalink) (top)
Samildanach Pragmatist Location: UK London Posts: 1,979	Initial thought on this subjects are 1) there are probably other alien lifeforms out there unless this universe has been made specifically for us. Even if we dont find any aliens lifeforms out there we are on the verge of being able to create some anyway. So does it really matter if there are is the question. For example you travel to another planet and meet an alien analogue of a mouse. Sure its organs might be in different places but basically its a mouse. Big Deal. The only time aliens get interesting is when we assume them to be intelligent and have wondrous technology light years ahead of our own in which case we would be pretty uninteresting to them unless they had some ulterior motive. The only time they will reveal them selves to us is if we suddenly develop decent space travel capabilities and we begin to 'invade' there borders in some fashion ie make a nuisance of ourselves. Up until that point they would do exactly what the rest of us humans would do monitor and try to sabotage any inventions that would lead to that happening. I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs and insanity for everyone, but its always worked for me. Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime." (Ernest Hemingway)

Feb 10, 2004, 07:40 am	#11 (permalink) (top)
CitizenCOP Guest Posts: n/a	Beam me up Scotty.. their's no intelligent life down here.. in case any other planets have the internet.. lol

Feb 10, 2004, 11:55 am	#12 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,470	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Samildanach,) Initial thought on this subjects are 1) there are probably other alien lifeforms out there unless this universe has been made specifically for us. Even if we dont find any aliens lifeforms out there we are on the verge of being able to create some anyway. So does it really matter if there are is the question. For example you travel to another planet and meet an alien analogue of a mouse. Sure its organs might be in different places but basically its a mouse. Big Deal. The only time aliens get interesting is when we assume them to be intelligent and have wondrous technology light years ahead of our own in which case we would be pretty uninteresting to them unless they had some ulterior motive. The only time they will reveal them selves to us is if we suddenly develop decent space travel capabilities and we begin to 'invade' there borders in some fashion ie make a nuisance of ourselves. Up until that point they would do exactly what the rest of us humans would do monitor and try to sabotage any inventions that would lead to that happening.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> What if this rodent equivalent was a silicon based lifeform? Wouldn't that in itself be interesting? War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

Feb 10, 2004, 12:21 pm	#13 (permalink) (top)
Samildanach Pragmatist Location: UK London Posts: 1,979	Not particularly....if I remember correctly we already have silicon based lifeforms however they have to live deep within the ocean where the pressure shortens the si-si bond length to something approximating the c-c bond length ; ) I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs and insanity for everyone, but its always worked for me. Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime." (Ernest Hemingway)

Feb 14, 2004, 12:58 am	#14 (permalink) (top)
NotScientific Molten Ash Location: Mauritius Posts: 35	I guess they exist. The universe is just too big to support only 1 'life' - humans! I'm Columnist here at Volconvo.com and also at BackWash.com. Check my columns in the Science forum then.

Feb 14, 2004, 06:36 am	#15 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,470	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Samildanach,) Not particularly....if I remember correctly we already have silicon based lifeforms however they have to live deep within the ocean where the pressure shortens the si-si bond length to something approximating the c-c bond length ; )<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> I'm afraid that there aren't such organisms, you got confused, it's lot's of sulphide bonds they have, not silicon. Unless you've got data to prove otherwise ofc. War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

May 31, 2004, 08:41 pm	#16 (permalink) (top)
Scribbler1 Skeptical Patriot Posts: 7,746	This is not about alien invaders or anything like it, but SETI has a website where you can download a program which analyses the data from the Aricebo radio telescope. It's a great setup called SETI@HOME which lets you use your computer's down time to analyse these signals (almost entirely radio noise at this point). The idea is to send packets of data to about 3 million computers therby forming in effect a supercomputer. As my machines are always on, I have done about 600 hours of computing for them. Hey, it doesn't cost anything and who knows... The link is: SETI @ HOME Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

Jun 1, 2004, 02:36 pm	#17 (permalink) (top)
Milton Bradley Not Machine Washable Location: Ohio Province, Rep. of Comerica Posts: 7,092	I tend to agree therehas to be life out there somewhere. I am of the camp that hopes we don't find it/them. We can't even talk to whales, or dolphins, which we know to be intelligent, and have their own language, which are also similar to us in other ways. I don't think we will be ready to welcome anything other than ourselves for many years. We can't even coexist with Islam yet... Let alone ET's. Liberalism - The philosophy for the person only a Nanny State could love. Economic -5.25 Libertarian/Authoritarian -3.90

Jun 2, 2004, 12:45 am	#20 (permalink) (top)
dave654 Guest Posts: n/a	You guys don't have very high regards for your own species. The cup is half FULL. Despite all the crap that goes on in the world, humans are still a marvel to behold. We are a collection of inanimate matter that has come together and formed an intelligence unique to our planet. We are the universe trying to understand itself. Why would you waste your intelligence dwelling on the negative? An advanced alien race would most likely have the same experiences we've had. Why assume they would be paragons of virture to our vice? Also, why assume their technology would be so far advanced over ours? Sure it's possible but is ite really likely considering the time it took for live to advance to our level here, why would it take less time elsewhere? Think Positive guys.