Black hole bomb-easier to make than you might think?

[Yarn]

Black holes in space are produced by supercompression of matter, with the compression mechanism being gravity. There isn't enough matter on Earth to produce enough gravity to make one that way.

But what about other means of supercompression?

What if per instance you made a bomb that used H bombs to supercompress elements that are too heavy to fuse and which would therefore not produce an explosion to resist the compresion? Could it create a black hole?

No sane person would do this, but is it possible?

[Angry Citizen]

Even if you could, it wouldn't do much. The event horizon of a black hole with the mass of a car would be much smaller than a proton, and it would possess the same amount of gravity that a car would produce at any meaningful distance. In short, pointless as well as impossible for a number of reasons.

[Yarn]

The impossibility apparently depends on which, if any, existing theory of everything is true. More specifically, it has to do with the number of dimensions there are:

However, in some scenarios involving extra dimensions of space, the Planck mass can be as low as the TeV range. The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) has a design energy of 14 TeV for proton-proton collisions and 1150 TeV for Pb-Pb collisions. It was argued in 2001 that in these circumstances black hole production could be an important and observable effect at the LHC[2][3][4][5][16] or future higher-energy colliders. Such quantum black holes should decay emitting sprays of particles that could be seen by detectors at these facilities.[2][3] A paper by Choptuik and Pretorius, published on March 17, 2010 in Physical Review Letters, presented a computer-generated proof that micro black holes must form from two colliding particles with sufficient energy, which might be allowable at the energies of the LHC if additional dimensions are present other than the customary four (three space, one time).[17][18]

[edit] Safety arguments

Main article: Safety of particle collisions at the Large Hadron Collider

Hawking's calculation[6] and more general quantum mechanical arguments predict that micro black holes evaporate almost instantaneously. Additional safety arguments beyond those based on Hawking radiation were given in the paper,[19][20] which showed that in hypothetical scenarios with stable black holes that could damage Earth, such black holes would have been produced by cosmic rays and would have already destroyed known astronomical objects such as the Earth, Sun, neutron stars, or white dwarfs.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micro_black_hole

And there is some weird thing that I don't understand that may or may not overthrow the above analysis:

A black hole bomb is the name given to a physical effect utilizing how a bosonic field impinging on a rotating black hole can be amplified through superradiant scattering. An additional condition which must be met is that the field must have a rest mass different than zero. The scattered wave will then be reflected back and forth between the mass term and the black hole becoming amplified on each reflection. The growth of the field is asserted to be exponential and unstable. The mechanism by which the black hole bomb functions is called superradiant instability.

The first analytical study of this effect was published in the journal Physical Review in March 2010,[1] however, the mechanism was already described in 1972.[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_hole_bomb

[Thanatos]

Hardly pointless - small black holes, if caged, would make handy ways to do reasonably efficient mass-energy conversion. Harvesting the energy released when matter falls in would allow for a lot of power. In a natural setting it's about 1/3 efficient... while disposing of garbage. This would be a major step in the history of humanity.

My intuition says nukes wouldn't come close to making such a toy, but I'm too drunk and lazy to try to do the math. I have no ideas on how to create one but obviously it's possible.

[Charlatan]

What about what i have proposed here?

http://www.volconvo.com/forums/scien...ace-ships.html

[Angry Citizen]

Hardly pointless - small black holes, if caged, would make handy ways to do reasonably efficient mass-energy conversion. Harvesting the energy released when matter falls in would allow for a lot of power. In a natural setting it's about 1/3 efficient... while disposing of garbage. This would be a major step in the history of humanity.

My intuition says nukes wouldn't come close to making such a toy, but I'm too drunk and lazy to try to do the math. I have no ideas on how to create one but obviously it's possible.

Again, you can't cram matter into a black hole whose event horizon is smaller than matter itself. Can't be done.

[Yarn]

Well, electrons have mass and are perhaps as smale as the attometer scale. How small a black hole are we talking about?

Albiet, you'd have to capture it somehow first. And the majority opinion seems to be it is just going to evaporate right away anyway.

[Thanatos]

Well, electrons have mass and are perhaps as smale as the attometer scale. How small a black hole are we talking about?

Albiet, you'd have to capture it somehow first. And the majority opinion seems to be it is just going to evaporate right away anyway.

Containing it would not be very difficult compared to creating it. Black holes are allowed to have electric charges and magnetic fields, which means you can use those fields to hold your pet hole on a leash, especially if it is housed in orbit.

As AC points out, care and feeding of your new pet will be much easier if it starts life well above the minimum mass. This is not technically impossible but is unlikely to be achieved any time even remotely soon.

[xx_mortekai_xx]

Hardly pointless - small black holes, if caged, would make handy ways to do reasonably efficient mass-energy conversion. Harvesting the energy released when matter falls in would allow for a lot of power. In a natural setting it's about 1/3 efficient... while disposing of garbage. This would be a major step in the history of humanity.

My intuition says nukes wouldn't come close to making such a toy, but I'm too drunk and lazy to try to do the math. I have no ideas on how to create one but obviously it's possible.

How do you peopose feeding the black hole to convert the matter into energy? The mass of a black hole in the range we are talking has far less of a gravitational pull than would be useful for tje task, and as ac pointed out, the hole itself would be far too small to feed anything but immensely small amounts of matter to it at any one time, only allowing for small amounts of energy to be usable at any one time. Any hole massive enough to be of any real use would also have enogh mass that we wouldn't want to keep it anywhere near the planet.

[Charlatan]

It is possible, seeing as how stars may be very small, the black holes resulting from them could also be very small.

Of course i think since there are no small enough stars, there won't be small enough black holes...

[Yarn]

@Charlatan A blackhole's size is proportionate to its mass, and stars are very massive.

[Senor Hoint]

I believe the minimum threshold for a stellar-mass black hole is a star with about three solar masses. The very massive black holes at the centers of galaxies can be anywhere from millions to billions of solar masses.