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TheColdTruth · Feb 17, 2004, 04:30 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by
There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD.

I loved this bit:

"If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them."

Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from!

Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote>

Uh. Well get this: I never, ever buy cd's unless I REALLY, REALLY like the artist. A lot. I have probobly 300 or so cd's. Maybe 8 I have bought. Without downloading, I simply wouldn't be able to listen to music that I just like so-so, and don't consider worht buying. But hey. me listening to that music I don't absolutely LOVE but don't hate either gets my friends to listen to it, and so on, which, in the end, will get the artist more cd's purchased than he would have at all. I think I'm not alone in saying if you REALLY like someone's music, you'll put some money into them one way or another. Stealing music? Are you serious? When I walk through a park and smell a flower and plant it later because I like the scent, am I stealing the scent, and making life worse for the flower in general? What kind of idiot are you?

**Pooeypants** · Feb 17, 2004, 06:43 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (StoneWT,)
There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD.

I loved this bit:

"If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them."

Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from!

Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote>
It's a way to make their conscience feel better. Well, whatever floats their boat...

**Pooeypants** · Feb 17, 2004, 06:44 pm

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (TheColdTruth,)

Uh. Well get this: I never, ever buy cd's unless I REALLY, REALLY like the artist. A lot. I have probobly 300 or so cd's. Maybe 8 I have bought. Without downloading, I simply wouldn't be able to listen to music that I just like so-so, and don't consider worht buying. But hey. me listening to that music I don't absolutely LOVE but don't hate either gets my friends to listen to it, and so on, which, in the end, will get the artist more cd's purchased than he would have at all. I think I'm not alone in saying if you REALLY like someone's music, you'll put some money into them one way or another. Stealing music? Are you serious? When I walk through a park and smell a flower and plant it later because I like the scent, am I stealing the scent, and making life worse for the flower in general? What kind of idiot are you?<hr size="1" /></blockquote>
Absymal analogy, the scent of wild flowers are not copyrighted.

Feb 18, 2004, 01:35 am

Yea, that was a terrible analogy. God, Mother Nature, whatever hasn't put a stamp of ownership on flowers yet, the music industry has. These artists worked on their music, and did it for a profit. If you get around this, and get what they've made for free, you're stealing.

I don't see how this can be debated. I mean I'll admit the ride was fun (the whole kazaa thing), but I never thought it was right-only legal.

RebelWithanAK · Feb 18, 2004, 03:43 am

<blockquote>Quote:<hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (StoneWT,)
There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD.

I loved this bit:

"If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them."

Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from!

Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote>Did you notice that the economy is down? How do you expect anybody to buy the music industry's bullshit about how filesharing is the sole cause of the decline in CD album sales when we're in a fuckin' recession? Charging $18.99 a CD simply isn't good business sense, and that's certainly evident right now. Ask Tower Records, which is bankrupt. Bankrupted by Walmart and Best Buy, who ARE selling popular CDs for $10-12 dollars. Surprise!

Remember Metallica? Where did they get their start? It wasn't CD sales, because nobody knew who the fuck they were. (I wonder why, RIAA? Didn't marketing see that one coming?) It was bootlegs, and through the bootlegs they got people to attend their concerts, and it's through concerts that they and just about every other living artist makes their bread and butter.

Now, you may not view culture as important, but it means a damned lot to me when all I see are the same six bands over and over and over again when there's one hell of a lot of shit out there. Why are record companies so abysmal at advertising their own artists? Not that I'd ever want to just experiment and pick out a random CD when it costs a fuckin' Jackson every time, but one reason filesharing's so god damned popular is because it doesn't hurt to go looking for some new shit, and following a lead. Considering that the only leads the RIAA give tend to rest on bullshit bands filled with bullshit artists who are sadly interchangable and painfully mediocre, I don't feel the least bit sad I didn't give my hard-earned cash to the media machine this week.

For that matter, you want to know what really hurts artists? When they lease the rights to their music to the big 5 corporations in exchange for having it produced. Then the company gets the vast majority of the money made off of the artist, and the artist can't even print their own CDs because they'd be in breach of contract - even if the company decided not to produce the music anyway. Ain't that some shit. The actions of us consumers pale in comparison to the "legal" theft that the industry's built on, not the least of which is copyright laws. You wanna know why all the artists never innovate? Because if they did, they'd get sued by those very same corporations who own the copyrights to just about 90% of all recorded music in the last 70 years. Nobody lives in a bubble - all work is derivative work. Gustav Mahler mooched off of Hans Rott and Rott stole from Austrian folk tunes, and god knows how many artists today keep 'sampling' Gustav Mahler. 'Course, god forbid you try that with a Beatles tune, lest Michael Jackson be knocking on your door within the day...

tman_ndsu08 · Feb 18, 2004, 12:23 pm

The music industry is going to go through a major overhaul now that digital distribution is a reality.

No longer will musicians need labels to make their cd's and publicize them.

All they have to do now is record their songs on a computer, upload them to KaZaa (or whatever), and bam... millions have their music.

And if they want to turn a profit, they can upload to a service like iTunes, which charges a dollar for a song.

However, i think this will probably be unneccicary because the new model for music will be more along the lines of getting your recorded music out to people in an attempt to gain popularity. This will make people want to come to the concerts that the musicians will hold. Concerts will be the main profit making jobs for the musicians, just as they are now. Very few bands make any money off their albums. Most of their profits come from tours.

Feb 17, 2004, 04:30 pm	#41 (permalink) (top)
TheColdTruth Alive Location: Sandusky, Ohio Posts: 100	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD. I loved this bit: "If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them." Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from! Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> Uh. Well get this: I never, ever buy cd's unless I REALLY, REALLY like the artist. A lot. I have probobly 300 or so cd's. Maybe 8 I have bought. Without downloading, I simply wouldn't be able to listen to music that I just like so-so, and don't consider worht buying. But hey. me listening to that music I don't absolutely LOVE but don't hate either gets my friends to listen to it, and so on, which, in the end, will get the artist more cd's purchased than he would have at all. I think I'm not alone in saying if you REALLY like someone's music, you'll put some money into them one way or another. Stealing music? Are you serious? When I walk through a park and smell a flower and plant it later because I like the scent, am I stealing the scent, and making life worse for the flower in general? What kind of idiot are you? If it works, and it's stupid, it's not stupid.

Feb 17, 2004, 06:43 pm	#42 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,602	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (StoneWT,) There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD. I loved this bit: "If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them." Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from! Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> It's a way to make their conscience feel better. Well, whatever floats their boat... War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

Feb 17, 2004, 06:44 pm	#43 (permalink) (top)
Pooeypants Neo Moderator Location: England Posts: 5,602	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (TheColdTruth,) Uh. Well get this: I never, ever buy cd's unless I REALLY, REALLY like the artist. A lot. I have probobly 300 or so cd's. Maybe 8 I have bought. Without downloading, I simply wouldn't be able to listen to music that I just like so-so, and don't consider worht buying. But hey. me listening to that music I don't absolutely LOVE but don't hate either gets my friends to listen to it, and so on, which, in the end, will get the artist more cd's purchased than he would have at all. I think I'm not alone in saying if you REALLY like someone's music, you'll put some money into them one way or another. Stealing music? Are you serious? When I walk through a park and smell a flower and plant it later because I like the scent, am I stealing the scent, and making life worse for the flower in general? What kind of idiot are you?<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> Absymal analogy, the scent of wild flowers are not copyrighted. War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is strength Harness the power of Ingsoc, then you can capture someone killed the year before

Feb 18, 2004, 03:43 am	#45 (permalink) (top)
RebelWithanAK Igneous Magma Location: New York City Posts: 739	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (StoneWT,) There isn't a 'need' to download (steal) music. You not wanting to pay X dollars for a CD does not entitle you to that CD. I loved this bit: "If the record companies would charge less, I'd stop stealing from them." Good lord, you're admitting to being a thief and blaming the people you're stealing from! Have the guts to say that you like stealing music. Stop trying to dress it up as some sort of Universe-endowed right.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>Did you notice that the economy is down? How do you expect anybody to buy the music industry's bullshit about how filesharing is the sole cause of the decline in CD album sales when we're in a fuckin' recession? Charging $18.99 a CD simply isn't good business sense, and that's certainly evident right now. Ask Tower Records, which is bankrupt. Bankrupted by Walmart and Best Buy, who ARE selling popular CDs for $10-12 dollars. Surprise! Remember Metallica? Where did they get their start? It wasn't CD sales, because nobody knew who the fuck they were. (I wonder why, RIAA? Didn't marketing see that one coming?) It was bootlegs, and through the bootlegs they got people to attend their concerts, and it's through concerts that they and just about every other living artist makes their bread and butter. Now, you may not view culture as important, but it means a damned lot to me when all I see are the same six bands over and over and over again when there's one hell of a lot of shit out there. Why are record companies so abysmal at advertising their own artists? Not that I'd ever want to just experiment and pick out a random CD when it costs a fuckin' Jackson every time, but one reason filesharing's so god damned popular is because it doesn't hurt to go looking for some new shit, and following a lead. Considering that the only leads the RIAA give tend to rest on bullshit bands filled with bullshit artists who are sadly interchangable and painfully mediocre, I don't feel the least bit sad I didn't give my hard-earned cash to the media machine this week. For that matter, you want to know what really hurts artists? When they lease the rights to their music to the big 5 corporations in exchange for having it produced. Then the company gets the vast majority of the money made off of the artist, and the artist can't even print their own CDs because they'd be in breach of contract - even if the company decided not to produce the music anyway. Ain't that some shit. The actions of us consumers pale in comparison to the "legal" theft that the industry's built on, not the least of which is copyright laws. You wanna know why all the artists never innovate? Because if they did, they'd get sued by those very same corporations who own the copyrights to just about 90% of all recorded music in the last 70 years. Nobody lives in a bubble - all work is derivative work. Gustav Mahler mooched off of Hans Rott and Rott stole from Austrian folk tunes, and god knows how many artists today keep 'sampling' Gustav Mahler. 'Course, god forbid you try that with a Beatles tune, lest Michael Jackson be knocking on your door within the day... . . . whenever any government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such forms as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

Feb 18, 2004, 01:35 am	#44 (permalink) (top)
dotComa Guest Posts: n/a	Yea, that was a terrible analogy. God, Mother Nature, whatever hasn't put a stamp of ownership on flowers yet, the music industry has. These artists worked on their music, and did it for a profit. If you get around this, and get what they've made for free, you're stealing. I don't see how this can be debated. I mean I'll admit the ride was fun (the whole kazaa thing), but I never thought it was right-only legal.

Feb 18, 2004, 12:23 pm	#46 (permalink) (top)
tman_ndsu08 BANNED Posts: 5,021	The music industry is going to go through a major overhaul now that digital distribution is a reality. No longer will musicians need labels to make their cd's and publicize them. All they have to do now is record their songs on a computer, upload them to KaZaa (or whatever), and bam... millions have their music. And if they want to turn a profit, they can upload to a service like iTunes, which charges a dollar for a song. However, i think this will probably be unneccicary because the new model for music will be more along the lines of getting your recorded music out to people in an attempt to gain popularity. This will make people want to come to the concerts that the musicians will hold. Concerts will be the main profit making jobs for the musicians, just as they are now. Very few bands make any money off their albums. Most of their profits come from tours.