The “Alternative Medicine” scam

[shawmutt]

One of my pet peeves involves pseudoscience and the scams perpetuated by the quacks that try to pass it off as real science. The most heinous of these scams involves “natural” or “alternative” medicine. Some of these frauds are chiropractory, homeopathy, acupuncture, faith healing, the supplement industry—basically anything that tries to pass as a legitimate medicine without actually having any scientific studies to back them up. I am all for finding new medicines and methods for improving our lives and making us healthier. Ideally what I would like to see is "alternative medicine" follow the scientific method and set up rigorous studies to prove their efficacy. To be sure, there are a few studies here and there, but they can hardly be called scientific. At best they are preliminary studies.

When the further studies are done, tightening the controls of the previous studies, perceived results disappear. One study that I would like to submit compares "real" acupuncture to "fake" acupuncture--both were shown to have the same effect. However, instead of admitting defeat, the alternative medicine frauds simply rely on the older, less controlled studies--or worse, create their own pseudoscientific studies.

While discussing this issue with a friend he brought up the placebo effect. If folks think the alternative medicine is working, and therefore it does work, what’s the harm? That’s a very common sentiment—what’s the harm? I believe there is a lot of harm in apathy of alternative medicine, and was delighted to learn about a website that shared my belief.

I offer the website as substantial evidence for my premise:

What's The Harm?

[Hurt]

Dang, I was just contemplating the exact some concept of the placebo effect earlier yesterday. I'll make a response tomorrow, about to sleep, now. Very complicated for me to make a strong position on either side.. and I'm usually decisive! :/

[jose]

Since most illness is made better or worse by our own thoughts, if you think something is going to make you better, it probably will, and vice versa

[grandpa]

Since most illness is made better or worse by our
own thoughts, if you think something is going to make
you better, it probably will, and vice versa

I hear rat poison can cure the common cold.

Anyway, there is some truth to what you say. But it's also true that some things are just dangerous. As for the validity of "alternative medicine," that ultimately depends on what it is being discussed, how it is used, and who is using it.

Grandpa h.

[LazyGun]

I would, broadly speaking agree with you Shawmutt, and that is an interesting link you have provided. One should, however, never underestimate the power of the placebo effect in the healing process, and I recently rewatched an interesting discussion between Richard Dawkins and Nicholas Humphreys on this very topic, which you may find of interest if you have not already seen it.

Richard Dawkins interviews Nicholas Humphrey | Smashing Telly - A hand picked TV channel

[commonsense]

¡Saludos José!
¡Que bien a tener la oportunidad a escribir en español! Soy estadounidense.
Estudie en España brevemente y he viajado un poco allá pero no conosco el sud. Asistí a la exclusiva Universidad de Cantabria. ¿De donde vienes tú?
Me siento que lo estoy perdiendo mi español porque nunca lo practico.
Me gustaria mucho escribirte mas si quieres. Cuando estuve alla, me quedaba con una mujer y me preparo "cangrejo de lunas de miel". Ella hirvio el cangrejo, saco la carne de la pinzas y puso vino blanco y un huevo y agrego todo dentro del carapazon y creo una mixtura, pero se me olvidio como ella preparo el huevo... no recuerdo si lo hirvio antes de agregarlo o si lo puso crudo dentro de la mixtura tibia despues. ?Te gusta cocinar? Me encanto mucho el jamon y los fiambres alla. !tambien el gazpacho!

Anyway, back to the topic...
I checked the site provided and I think one's guide should be common sense !
I am one to be very suspicious of commercial drug preparations and invasive treatments where benign natural methods should first be given the chance to work.
Case in point:
I went to the emergency room with bloody urine and a feverish feeling. A cat scan identified a kidney stone supposedly of a size, dimension and location that, according to a urologist, was nigh impossible to pass on its own. They recommended a shock wave treatment to break the stone. I investigated and found that the Mayo clinic reports adverse effects of this shock wave (extracorporeal lithotripsy) to the nearby more sensitive pancreas. It seems patients having received this treatment exhibit much higher incidence of pancreatic cancer and diminished insulin production.

I was told I had a month or so to schedule the treatment before the backup caused by the blockage of the stone would injure the kidney. I researched natural methods online and began self treatment ingesting frequent swigs of organic apple cider vinegar, doses of olive oil and constant lemon water.
I realize that medically, it is not believed that this high dose of acidity translates to an acidic condition downstream of the kidney sufficient to alter a calcyoxylate stone, but however it happened, this medically-determined overly large, naturally impassable stone emerged intact on its own in less than two weeks with absolutely no discomfort! Later sonogram confirmed everything was back to normal. I had avoided a potentially harmful radical treatment that had the stone not passed on its own I would have reluctantly submitted to.

I am usually very dilligent about starting my day with large amonts of water and drink plenty throughout the day, but that particular summer I traveled a lot and interrupted my usual preventative irrigation routine. Its funny how things work because I had no reason to believe that I was susceptible to them, even previously thinking to myself "well, at least thats one ailment I wont have to worry about because I drink so much water". I watch many travel documentaries about various underdeveloped countries, and its funny how often the local people seem so preoccupied with the kidneys with their preventative herbal remedies. Maybe b/c access to clean water is more difficult through the course of a day they are more common...

Also, I believe in vitamin therapy, within reason, and subscribe to the theories of many "alternative doctors" here in the U.S. (more accurately called "complementary physicians) who are trained conventional western allopaths who eschew many of the chemical-based treatments proffered by drug companies in favor of vitamins and herbs. Of course, they believe that both have their place and will use conventional methods where superior.
As far as "scientific evidence" goes, one (in my opinion isolated) positive aspect of socialized medicine in europe is that a practical approach is used regarding complementary medicine because vitamin therapy is cheaper than drugs and since they have epidemiological control over large populations they can accurately track their effectiveness and employ the ones that work.
Im pretty sure that certain fairly high doses of certain vitamins and minerals like C and zinc and many others are confirmed as reliable preventative methods for common illness and there are some confirmed therapeutic doses of vitamins as well.
Also, in cases of congenital spine deformities like scoliosis, I think constant manipulations from birth are helpful... but sudden chiropractic treatments can strain "weak points" in particular individuals that might never have become strokes, or small abcesses etc that might never have ruptured causing spinal meningitis as a result of chiropractic adjustments. These are just bad luck or shoddy pre-treatment screening.

[ikillu]

All science is real science. It just depends on where that science is in its stage of development. I'm sure, 70 years ago, had such a debate forum existed, someone would have posted something very similar to your post only where you put "alternative medicine", they would have put "psychology". Now, a hundred years later, psychology has earned more respect because the structure of the scientific method has been more aptly applied.

The same is the case with alternative medicine. There is a good article that addresses the limitations that current scientific study of alternative medicine faces, mostly regarding structure of definitions and studies. I think once these details are hammered out, the study of alternative medicine will take off, hopefully in a positive direction. I'd post it, but since this is my first post, it won't let me. I'll post the link in a second post.

Shawmutt, I am confused by the logic of parts of your post You say:

One of my pet peeves involves pseudoscience and the scams perpetuated by the quacks that try to pass it off as real science.

I am all for finding new medicines and methods for improving our lives and making us healthier. Ideally what I would like to see is "alternative medicine" follow the scientific method and set up rigorous studies to prove their efficacy.

Can we really call alternative medicine a sham and scam and the people who support it "quacks" when admittedly it is simply lacking scientific structure. At this moment, the facts are that if the studies done on BOTH sides of the fence had proper method and structure, we could determine a lot more regarding the efficacy of alternative medicine therapies.

Until then, we can only believe it works or does not work. We can't even begin to start pointing fingers at placebo effect or cooky folks yet.

[ikillu]

Here's that link:

Massage Therapy Articles || Bioenergy Research: The Capacity to Heal

[Chaossaber314]

One of my pet peeves involves pseudoscience and the scams perpetuated by the quacks that try to pass it off as real science. The most heinous of these scams involves “natural” or “alternative” medicine. Some of these frauds are chiropractory, homeopathy, acupuncture, faith healing, the supplement industry—basically anything that tries to pass as a legitimate medicine without actually having any scientific studies to back them up. I am all for finding new medicines and methods for improving our lives and making us healthier. Ideally what I would like to see is "alternative medicine" follow the scientific method and set up rigorous studies to prove their efficacy. To be sure, there are a few studies here and there, but they can hardly be called scientific. At best they are preliminary studies.

When the further studies are done, tightening the controls of the previous studies, perceived results disappear. One study that I would like to submit compares "real" acupuncture to "fake" acupuncture--both were shown to have the same effect. However, instead of admitting defeat, the alternative medicine frauds simply rely on the older, less controlled studies--or worse, create their own pseudoscientific studies.

While discussing this issue with a friend he brought up the placebo effect. If folks think the alternative medicine is working, and therefore it does work, what’s the harm? That’s a very common sentiment—what’s the harm? I believe there is a lot of harm in apathy of alternative medicine, and was delighted to learn about a website that shared my belief.

I offer the website as substantial evidence for my premise:

What's The Harm?

I tend to agree in premise, but some things, like supplements for instance, many of which go through clinical trials. A great deal do not, but a great deal of "legitimate" medications do not as well.

[Charlatan]

And why have these alternative medicines not been tested? Because they don't make the industry money. If they were supposed to work like they are, then they would have surely been tested now, but, seeing as how doctors don't reccommend them all that often, instead adivising of other more 'tested' methods, they are clearly out to supply more expensive treatments, often using technology they have developed.

At the dawn of medicine they should have tested these methods, as they were the quickest to test. Why then did they go for more involved methods? Maybe it was because they didn't believe in 'old wives tales' and preferred to start with something complex. Maybe it was because they were not into treating normal conditions, but rather more disasterous ailments, using their own brand of chemicals. Maybe it was because they didn't see the point in testing what was readily available. But the fact that they still have not tested it, even at highschool level, means that they are now realising that they can treat it in some way with other more expesive means.

I suggest charities do some cheap testing on people, but then they might not treat it in time, and the now established methods are probably going to work, so why take the chance of testing on someone afflicted with said disease. If the charities use some of their big payments to do some remedial testing on people they might be able to find an affordable cure, meaning that they could save on their funds. Think of a charity that doesn't have enough for medicines, and people come in still needing medicine. They could test it on peopl e that they cannot afford to give things out to.

Under universal health care though this will not be possible, and if universal health care comes in people will be able to get their medicines they need. But, seeing as how that is not used in the States, then I suggest that they take some time out of their busy schedule and test on people that they cannot treat conventionally and catalogue their results for the sake of cheap affordable medicine.

[Dadoo]

As a professional patient, I have been offered many alternative medicines and techniques to reinforce the standard western approach. The main difference I find, aside from techniques is that Eastern medicine is generally ongoing and proactive, with an accent on prevention. Western meds tend to approach illness in a reactive way, with an accent on protocol adherence, based on a Doctor's (or more) opinion and subsequent diagnosis.
Both work for certain ailments. I've not had a bad acupuncture session nor a bad radiation session, ever.
I believe, and subsequently find to be true, that belief systems and intention of the patient will most surely affect the efficacy of any form of healthcare.
My wife is Asian, and used accupuncture and pressure to assuage a Bell's palsy attack. It worked in 2 days, perfectly. Conversely, she had employed 10mg prednisone x7 days, prior, with minimal effect.
If you believe in a system, it will work more efficiently. If you do not, don't utilize that plan. There are charlatans and quacks in all medical/ healthcare circles. I've met my share.

You Heal thy self,
Dadoo

[Cruella]

This is an excellent website on the matter of "bad" science and the media reporting thereof: Bad Science » Ben Goldacre’s Bad Science column from the Guardian and more….

Incidentally, in a scientific study, anecdotes are not evidence.