stem cells don't mean dead babies

stem cells can be obtained from places other than developing embryos. they can be taken from the spinal column, from placenta, and maybe even from fat. it is therefore hogwash to resist stem cell research. the benefits are too great to ignore, and the costs are now inconsequential.

laura bush, you're a stupid, stupid woman, and you've bungled an opportunity for science to advance the field of medicine. STUPID WOMAN!!

[Pooeypants]

Don't be so sad, it just means the UK will have to lead the way for the breakthroughs.

[Scribbler1]

It is only the usual governmental attempt to thread a needle with a sledgehammer. There is a good supply of stem cells to be harvested from umbilical cords alone, but Bush et al has somehow managed to tie stem cell research in with abortion and has inflamed the sheep into supporting a ban against very likely lifesaving research. Idiots.

You got it backwards, it's the rabid religious right that heard stem cell and fetus in the same sentence, had their collective knee jerk and infanticide popped into their heads. Since then, they've been running around in their gland induced frenzy, picture left wing nuts, demanding the end of stem cell research. Bush is pandering to these idiots since they're part of the Republican party and need appeasing. I'm sure W. realizes what's going on but has to bow to political pressure.

I dont think we should worry about it-- the Europeans can do it even if those religious/weird guys hold the americans back. Then if you need to have your cancer cured, you can just go to Germany or Switzerland to have it done .

We'll eventually get it done.

There is plenty of stem cell research going on in the US. Only the acquisition of new stem cells has been curtailed in labs funded by Uncle Sam.

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by dave654, There is plenty of stem cell research going on in the US. Only the acquisition of new stem cells has been curtailed in labs funded by Uncle Sam.

Slight disadvantage in that matter isn't it for US scientists?

[Mia]

Originally posted by dave654, You got it backwards, it's the rabid religious right that heard stem cell and fetus in the same sentence, had their collective knee jerk and infanticide popped into their heads. Since then, they've been running around in their gland induced frenzy, picture left wing nuts, demanding the end of stem cell research. Bush is pandering to these idiots since they're part of the Republican party and need appeasing. I'm sure W. realizes what's going on but has to bow to political pressure.

Why does right-wing nutzo behavior have to be compared to left wing. Your statement made it sound like there's so little craziness on the right, we have to analogous the left to picture it.

There are nuts on both sides, so saying these fundamentalists are nuts is easily understandable.

2) He HAS to? Please prove he HAS to! I call bullshit.

[Mia]

The whole thing is crazy. I didn't even realize the President COULD halt scientific research. His religious beliefs are not supposed to translate into policy.

[PatrickHenry]

The President is the Emperor. You didn't know?

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Mia, The whole thing is crazy. I didn't even realize the President COULD halt scientific research. His religious beliefs are not supposed to translate into policy.

By passing laws to ban the practice, any powerful leader could. I just hope the UN doesn't succumb to the madness.

Originally posted by Mia,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mia,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-dave654, You got it backwards, it's the rabid religious right that heard stem cell and fetus in the same sentence, had their collective knee jerk and infanticide popped into their heads.  Since then, they've been running around in their gland induced frenzy, picture left wing nuts, demanding the end of stem cell research.  Bush is pandering to these idiots since they're part of the Republican party and need appeasing.  I'm sure W. realizes what's going on but has to bow to political pressure.

Why does right-wing nutzo behavior have to be compared to left wing. Your statement made it sound like there's so little craziness on the right, we have to analogous the left to picture it.

There are nuts on both sides, so saying these fundamentalists are nuts is easily understandable.

2) He HAS to? Please prove he HAS to! I call bullshit.[/b][/quote]

I say W. has to bow to the religious right because they comprise a large part of his political base. I agree there is crazy behavior at both ends of the political spectrum. Quantifying which side is worse would be difficult. Both groups have people who think emotionally rather than intillectually. However, I think the far right has been more marginalized than the far left over the past few decades. Now if we could shut down the far left as effectively the country would be better off.
Before you start yelling at me again, I really despise both camps who have usurped reasonable political discourse.

[LogicaLunatic]

Dave,

I'm not being confrontational. But, if you would, please describe the far right and the far left as you see them...

LL

Okay. This will be an incomplete list since I'm probably not aware of all groups that would fit into these camps.
I see the far right as MOSTLY the religious right/social conservative crowd. Largely these people have been marginalized since few people take seriously anyone who claims something should or should not be because god said so. Social conservatism without the religious aspect tends to support morality issues usually involving stricter rules for behavior. These people have their god based ideologies, or codes of conduct, that the rest of us should live by. I don't really see too much attempt by this crowd to force their agendas down anyone's throught via government, however, I believe some of them would if they could. I see this group as having been marginalized over the past thirty years, since the counter culture revolution of the late sixties. I think these people would prefer living in the Ozzie and Harriet world of the 1950s.
The far right seems to be populated with Socialists, greens, communists and anyone else who thinks they know how the rest of us should live. Government is the major vehicle through which their particular agenda should be forced upon all of us less enlightened folks. This group has been gaining is strength sinc the counter culture revolution of the 1960s. They are more accepted by the mainstream and hence a more potent force, and more dangerous, than the far right crowd. They're also a more disperate group. Not at all homogeneous.
Obviously, I could write much more on this rather broad topic. I hope you get the picture.

[Mia]

Originally posted by Pooeypants,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Pooeypants,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-Mia, The whole thing is crazy.  I didn't even realize the President COULD halt scientific research.  His religious beliefs are not supposed to translate into policy.

By passing laws to ban the practice, any powerful leader could. I just hope the UN doesn't succumb to the madness.[/b][/quote]
By signing laws that Congress passes, our 'leader' can. Did Congress create and pass a bill on this, or did W do it on his own?

From my reading, it looks like he did it on his own, which I don't understand.

On the "not halting research, just halting new stem cells to research on". Uh... won't that mean a de-facto halt to research when the current cells run out?

So that's not really a valid point.

Plus, as was mentioned, they can be obtained from sources other that fetuses for the people against that part. I personally don't see the use in throwing aborted fetuses away instead of using them to save lives. It doesn't curb abortion to not use them. People don't have abortions to donate fetuses for research!

[LogicaLunatic]

Thanks,

But, do you mean the "far left" here?...

"The far right seems to be populated with Socialists, greens, communists and anyone else who thinks they know how the rest of us should live."

yes sorry. That's the far left.

[Mia]

I thought I had lured my conservative friend in here, but he sent me an email with his thoughts instead:

If you want my opinion on stem-cell research, I think that the advancement of science should be limited by government only in isolated situations, which is pretty much how I feel about governments involvement in regulating business and commerce.

I don't think that Bush has put the temporary freeze on because of extreme religious views, but rather I think that something that advanced, with the potential for insidious abuse simply freaks the guy out, as it does me. I believe that his concern is how to police something that could be terribly misused. He can't just give a open door to every nutty, mad scientist out there. It's a slippery slope.

Furthermore, I don't think that the Pres. is trying to lump this in with abortion nor appease the religious right. And for the record I'm pro-choice, as I believe most Republicans are, however I did agree with the ban on late term/partial birth abortion because when trying to decide when a life is a life, it can be pretty grey, but in partial birth abortions the procedure truly sickens me, and if that is not a life, then I don't know what is.

[prettyredhead]

I am all for killing babies in the sake of living children.
It isnt a baby anyway if it isnt born.

[Mia]

Alrighty then. (shakes head in disgust)