Non-organic Oil? 100 times est. oil reserves left

[Mr.Vicchio]

Currently there are somewhere in the neighborhood of 680 billion barrels of Middle East reserve oil.

Creating that much oil would take a big pile of dead dinosaurs and fermenting prehistoric plants. Could there be another source for crude oil?

An intriguing theory now permeating oil company research staffs suggests that crude oil may actually be a natural inorganic product, not a stepchild of unfathomable time and organic degradation. The theory suggests there may be huge, yet-to-be-discovered reserves of oil at depths that dwarf current world estimates.

The theory is simple: Crude oil forms as a natural inorganic process which occurs between the mantle and the crust, somewhere between 5 and 20 miles deep. The proposed mechanism is as follows:



Methane (CH4) is a common molecule found in quantity throughout our solar system – huge concentrations exist at great depth in the Earth.

At the mantle-crust interface, roughly 20,000 feet beneath the surface, rapidly rising streams of compressed methane-based gasses hit pockets of high temperature causing the condensation of heavier hydrocarbons. The product of this condensation is commonly known as crude oil.

Some compressed methane-based gasses migrate into pockets and reservoirs we extract as "natural gas."

In the geologically "cooler," more tectonically stable regions around the globe, the crude oil pools into reservoirs.

In the "hotter," more volcanic and tectonically active areas, the oil and natural gas continue to condense and eventually to oxidize, producing carbon dioxide and steam, which exits from active volcanoes.

Periodically, depending on variations of geology and Earth movement, oil seeps to the surface in quantity, creating the vast oil-sand deposits of Canada and Venezuela, or the continual seeps found beneath the Gulf of Mexico and Uzbekistan.

Periodically, depending on variations of geology, the vast, deep pools of oil break free and replenish existing known reserves of oil.

There are a number of observations across the oil-producing regions of the globe that support this theory, and the list of proponents begins with Mendelev (who created the periodic table of elements) and includes Dr.Thomas Gold (founding director of Cornell University Center for Radiophysics and Space Research) and Dr. J.F. Kenney of Gas Resources Corporations, Houston, Texas.

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38645

Do read the whole article, and while yes it IS WND and YES I know they tend to post the outlandish, sometimes they hit the spot. If this theory though is correct.. there the oil reserves are off by an oreder of 100.... thats a lot of freaking oil.

Be intersting to learn as this pans out.

[Plaything48]

I don't understand how this makes oil inorganic. Organic chemicals are made up mainly of carbon and hydrogen, so it seems that whatever the theory, the oil is still organic.

[Pooeypants]

Wishful thinking, unfortunately from that article, only two academics appear to give it any real consideration.

[Catch 22]

Even if we have plenty of oil there's not many reasons to stick with it. The stuff burns dirty, costs tons to refine and takes even longer to get to market. How about we just put up some windmills and grow some hemp so we won't have to deal with that?

[ruiner]

"How about we just put up some windmills and grow some hemp"

And plant little flowers and all hold hands and sing?

[Scribbler1]

Originally posted by Plaything48, I don't understand how this makes oil inorganic. Organic chemicals are made up mainly of carbon and hydrogen, so it seems that whatever the theory, the oil is still organic.

Also, methane is a byrpoduct of the decomposition of organic matter, just ask a cow. I don't see where the science adds up.

Also, since most of the things we use today, plastics, fabrics, inks, dyes, and pharmaceuticals are petroleum based, if we don't slack off the burning of it we may find opurselves in deep doo if the chemical industry isn't able to produce a larger quantity of plant based replacements.

Do a Google for "Thermal Depolymerization" for some interesting news regarding conversion of ANYTHING organic to oil.

[Mr.Vicchio]

If you read the whole article, it explains a lot.

There is nothing wrong with using oil based power.

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, If you read the whole article, it explains a lot.  There is nothing wrong with using oil based power.

Apart from the carcinogens and carbon dioxide generate during the combustion?

Also, although the article explains the model behind this idea, there is little empirical evidence to back, reminds me of cold fusion...

[Mr.Vicchio]

You being an expert on the issue I am sure we can put this to rest.

Carinogens, CO2? What about them? Do you know where most of the CO2 in the world is stored?

[PatrickHenry]

Here's some thoughts on abiogenic petroleum from another board:
http://www.utterspeculation.com/archives/000416.html
These guys seem to support the theory:
http://www.enviroliteracy.org/article.php/1130.html

Interesting line of inquiry. Thanks for posting this V

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, You being an expert on the issue I am sure we can put this to rest. Carinogens, CO2? What about them? Do you know where most of the CO2 in the world is stored?

As you well know, incomplete combustion always occurs when burning hydrocarbon, complete combustion where only carbon dioxide and water is produced is theoretical.

Here is a summary of atmospheric pollutants, a lot of which has the internal combustion engine to thank for. This isn't propaganda, it's just chemistry.

[Catch 22]

Originally posted by ruiner, "How about we just put up some windmills and grow some hemp" And plant little flowers and all hold hands and sing?

Wind power and ethanol are the two most plausible replacements for crude oil energy right now. Perhaps you don't know but wind power is increasingly becoming cheap and efficient while hemp can produce more convertible cellulose than a corn stalk ever could.

Humankind will NEVER run out of oil. There is enough oil to last thousands of years at current consumption rates. Oil drilling has only taped a small fraction of even the current oil fields.
New drilling technologies will make heretofore unaccessable sources of oil available NOW.
In addition, and more importantly, Oil recycling and The Thermal Depolymerization Process will enable the current supply, with new oil sources last literally FOREVER.
Happily this will not be necessary since improvements in hybrid fueled and H2 fueled vehicles will eventually lessen our need for oil consumption.
Solar, wind, geothermal and tidal energy production will also help reduce oil consumption.
These technologies are here NOW. I don't understand why conservationists are not yelling about them more and less about shutting down those dasterdly, evil oil companies and trying to cram us into Matchbox cars and mass transit. Can anyone explain this phenomenon to me?

[sixmillman]

Can anybody show me the exact math to these questions?

Using only the currently available products of proven technology:

How many kilowatts of electricity are required to move a reasonably sized vehicle 20,000 miles. (use pure electric not hybrid )?
How many windmills in optimum locations are required to generate that much electricity?
Multiply the number of windmills needed by the number of registered vehicles.
How many acres of land covered with windmills would be required.

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by dave654, Humankind will NEVER run out of oil. There is enough oil to last thousands of years at current consumption rates. Oil drilling has only taped a small fraction of even the current oil fields. New drilling technologies will make heretofore unaccessable sources of oil available NOW. In addition, and more importantly, Oil recycling and The Thermal Depolymerization Process will enable the current supply, with new oil sources last literally FOREVER. Happily this will not be necessary since improvements in hybrid fueled and H2 fueled vehicles will eventually lessen our need for oil consumption. Solar, wind, geothermal and tidal energy production will also help reduce oil consumption. These technologies are here NOW. I don't understand why conservationists are not yelling about them more and less about shutting down those dasterdly, evil oil companies and trying to cram us into Matchbox cars and mass transit. Can anyone explain this phenomenon to me?

I would like to see qualified sources to back your claims.

Specifically, for which part of my skreed do you want verification?

[Scribbler1]

Originally posted by dave654, These technologies are here NOW. I don't understand why conservationists are not yelling about them more and less about shutting down those dasterdly, evil oil companies and trying to cram us into Matchbox cars and mass transit. Can anyone explain this phenomenon to me?

They DO yell about these new technologies, but the tiny cars are not on the road as the result of environmentalist pressure. Its the free market again. People want little cars and they are buying them.

I suppose there is also the element of bragging rights too when they see a Hummer owner growing faint at a gas station, they have the option to gloat.
(damn, and I WANTED to get one of those in a year or 2)

[Charcoal]

I think this topic is going to/should stray to alternate energy sources. Oil is a "fossil fuel" no matter how you look at it, shouldn't we move on as a civilization to more efficent and plentiful resources, and keep leftover oil for emergency and novelty.

On another note, it would cost about $16 a gallon to run a car on Dasani water I read in a magazine (very sorry for not having the source). I wonder if there has been a thread on fuel cells?

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Charcoal, I think this topic is going to/should stray to alternate energy sources. Oil is a "fossil fuel" no matter how you look at it, shouldn't we move on as a civilization to more efficent and plentiful resources, and keep leftover oil for emergency and novelty. On another note, it would cost about $16 a gallon to run a car on Dasani water I read in a magazine (very sorry for not having the source). I wonder if there has been a thread on fuel cells?

Old threads about hybrid cars and alternate energy.

[giuliano]

FACTS AND MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT OIL:

Myth: "we're running out of oil"
Fact: there are 2 types of oil: proven oil reserves, and unproven oil reserves. canada actually has one of the biggest oil reserves in the world. why isn't bush demanding they prove they don't have any WMD then? (couldn't resist) and why aren't they drilling furiously. because it's in tar sands. these are known as unprovable oil reserves: ie because they are either not accessible with current technology, or only able to be extracted at a cost higher than the sale price. ever heard of a not-for-profit oil company?

Myth: "vegetable oil/ethanol/jim beam burns cleaner that petroleum and is the future"
Fact: the issue is not primarily environmental air quality, but volume of supply. you'd have to cover half of the US to cultivate enough ethanol-producing crops to feed its hunger for fuel. not doable. oil otoh, is in relatively abundant supply in volumes large enough to satisfy our lust for energy consumption.

Fact: the whole issue is not about how much oil is left, but its supply and cost. as supply is squeezed and the price of oil goes up, this hits the economy hard. the key is maintaining supply and production volumes.

of course in today's PC world, you can't just invade and colonise arab countries anymore. you have to be a bit more subtle than that. but the objective remains the same.