A practical electric car, and the end of Islamic terrorism

[Captain Chaos]

Hey guys,

Please check out:

http://www.teslamotors.com



It is a practical electric car. Far far superior to gas cars. It is also proof of concept. Since this vehicle is now taking off - it will spearhead the way for a large variety of similar vehicles. In 20 years, we will all be drving Li-ion electric vehicles (EVs).

The advent of EVs means the end of using gas for your car. This will spell doom for OPEC, and thus the end of funding for terrorist organizations.

The future looks bright!


Yeah - I know, I am a maniacal optimist.

[The Second Law]

Because gasoline is the only use for oil, right?

I'll counter your optimism with unflattering realism: This car won't be mass produced, just like every other concept car wasn't...

--Second

[Captain Chaos]

They are going to start production in less than a year. It'll get there.

As the price of Lithium-ion batteries comes down, similar electric cars will get cheaper and cheaper.



Many other advanced batteries are being developed as well.

[The Second Law]

I suppose we can all hope, but I'm not rushing to get one.

To be perfectly honest, it seems too good to be true, and I really don't think the company's front website is the best place to get information about it. I remember hybrid cars which were advertised to get seventy miles per gallon but realistically only got around thirty-five. I was even at Shakespeare-in-the-Park last night where there was a 100% pollution-free, cheaper than TXU tent set up that suggested no drawbacks.

Nothing's free, so please excuse me for having my skeptic senses turned on right now. I'd rather see data on the car and perhaps independent studies done on it before I throw my faith in its driver's seat.

--Second

[Captain Chaos]

Nothing's free, so please excuse me for having my skeptic senses turned on right now. I'd rather see data on the car and perhaps independent studies done on it before I throw my faith in its driver's seat.

Absolutely.

Skepticism is necessary to our survival as a species.



But - I bet you 10 bucks that this car makes it to production within 2007, and that the customers are quite satisfied with its performance.

[The Second Law]

Production on what scale, though? Most every concept car design gets produced in some numbers and there will always be people to snatch them up and love them, yet they never get to a mass-produced level, sometimes because of a supply constraint, other times due to low demand.

If they were going for a widespread production, I find it strange that their first model is in the form of a roadster, which isn't exactly the apex of practicality.

--Second

[Captain Chaos]

If they were going for a widespread production, I find it strange that their first model is in the form of a roadster, which isn't exactly the apex of practicality.

I want one.

It is a sports car. High price. That will pay for production.

Lets set a scale - 300 cars sold in 2008.


Technology always starts out expensive, and then the price comes down. Lithium Ion batteries will get cheaper and cheaper.

[The Second Law]

It either gets cheaper or stops being made. I don't see any guarantee of the former.

--Second

[Fonceai]

Because you live in America.

Check out SMART cars in Europe.

Yes, there is more for oil than gasoline... but alleviating the need for gasoline will be a big burden lifted for the average joe.

But to completely dismiss this is a little silly.

[The Second Law]

It's true, I do live in America, so I'm really just speaking on behalf of what I expect here.

I'm not completely dismissing it, though. It's more of an I'll-believe-it-when-I-see-it stance, and I'm not holding out to see it soon.

--Second

[Kuroko]

o.0

I'm bound by copy right laws and a contract which says I can't talk about the alternative fuel method I REALLY want to. but bassically the conversion of normal combustion engines is in order to accomodate an already well based fuel easily obtained.. and shazam! I'm off again!

[Sonart]

.

I listened to an interview with the CEO of Teslamotors on NPR last night, and the Tesla Roadster is coming out as a production model, for around $80,000, about the same as a hi-end Porsche.

He explained his plan thusly... because the common view of an electric car has traditionally been that of a stodgy putt-putt, he decided to come out first with a glamorous, sexy, hi-end, hi-performance sports car that would get hi-profile buzz. Orders are coming in already from green-leaning movies stars, etc.

The release of the Roadster, if all goes well, will be followed by the release of a Tesla 4-door family sedan, for around $40,000.

Quote by: Captain Chaoes Skepticism is necessary to our survival as a species.

So is a move to this sort of technology.


.

[CliveStaples]

Oil is used for much, MUCH more than gasoline. OPEC won't go out of business. It won't even come close. It'll just make fewer billions of dollars.

[Fonceai]

First of all, OPEC is a representative entity. Not a business.

Secondly, http://www.eia.doe.gov/neic/infoshee...umproducts.htm
And...

Fuel products account for nearly 9 out of every 10 barrels of petroleum used in the United States. The leading fuel, motor gasoline, consistently accounts for the largest share of petroleum demand. Demand for motor gasoline alone accounts for more than 44 percent of the total demand for petroleum products. Other petroleum fuels include distillate fuel oil (diesel fuel and heating oil), liquefied petroleum gases (LPG's) (including propane and butane), jet fuel, residual fuel oil, kerosene, aviation gasoline, and petroleum coke.

And...

Nonfuel use of petroleum is small compared with fuel use, but petroleum products account for about 89 percent of the Nation's total energy consumption for nonfuel uses. There are many nonfuel uses for petroleum, including various specialized products for use in the textile, metallurgical, electrical, and other industries. A partial list of nonfuel uses for petroleum includes: • Solvents such as those used in paints, lacquers, and printing inks • Lubricating oils and greases for automobile engines and other machinery • Petroleum (or paraffin) wax used in candy making, packaging, candles, matches, and polishes • Petrolatum (petroleum jelly) sometimes blended with paraffin wax in medical products and toiletries • Asphalt used to pave roads and airfields, to surface canals and reservoirs, and to make roofing materials and floor coverings • Petroleum coke used as a raw material for many carbon and graphite products, including furnace electrodes and liners, and the anodes used in the production of aluminum. • Petroleum Feedstocks used as chemical feedstock derived from petroleum principally for the manufacture of chemicals, synthetic rubber, and a variety of plastics.

And the majority of the non-fuel uses of petroleum also have alternatives.

9 out of 10 barrels of oil from fuel uses. When total conversion is accomplished, the oil industry will be making 1/10th what they were before.

Before you drop big statements with absolutes in them, do some research.

[CliveStaples]

Quote by: Foc Before you drop big statements with absolutes in them, do some research.

...and getting rid of the demand for motor gasoline for civilians' cars gets rid of--if your numbers are correct, and I will assume arguendo that they are--what, 44%? That's a significant reduction, to be sure, but not a closing-doors-tomorrow one.

[Captain Chaos]

Ah...

But we can supply our remaining fuel needs internally. Most of it, anyway.

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: The Second Law Nothing's free, so please excuse me for having my skeptic senses turned on right now. I'd rather see data on the car and perhaps independent studies done on it before I throw my faith in its driver's seat. --Second

Most people who advocate such technologies seem oblivious to the obvious "costs" of transitioning to new technologies. My main concern with electric vehicles is battery disposal. I don't know a single person who disposes of the small convenience batteries we already use correctly, and I shudder to think of these same people being trusted to dispose of industrial sized batteries in the proper manor. It wouldn't take a large segment of the population disregarding battery disposal "recommendations" to create a really ugly problem with the water supply. Problems like heavy metals, and PCB contamination are very costly to clean, if they can be cleaned at all.


I'm not a big fan of battery technology as a solution to the oil crisis. Particulaly when you realize what they're burning to produce the electricity you will ultimately be using to supplement your oil consumption.

[Captain Chaos]

Quote by: Milton I'm not a big fan of battery technology as a solution to the oil crisis. Particulaly when you realize what they're burning to produce the electricity you will ultimately be using to supplement your oil consumption.

Lithion Ion batteries are not environmentally threatening. They are quite different from lead acid, and the like.

Plus, they are recycleable. And they will be. Why? because the consumer wont be part of that process. In an EV, when your Li-ion battery needs to be replaced, you will get it done professionally. It is a major part of the car - not just a small thing like the battery is in a regular car.

[Captain Chaos]

Also...

Check out this article on Lithium Polymer batteries. The latest types of these batteries will make EV vehicles even more practical:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium...olymer_battery

[Autolykos]

Captain,

I checked out that link. Great stuff! I'd love to get one of those cars, if and when I have the money.

The only problem I see with it is its effective range. While 250 miles is a great improvement over 60, I still think there's a disadvantage compared to gas-powered cars. See, when a gas-powered car runs out of gas, you can just fill her up again and she's ready to go. But the Tesla car takes 3.5 hours to recharge. Granted, that's at full capacity, but basically it would take a lot longer to make any sort of long-distance trip in the Tesla car than in a gas-powered car. For someone who enjoys driving long distances at times, this is a distinct disadvantage.

What would be really nice is if, somehow, charging circuitry could be embedded in roads, so when electric cars travel over them, their batteries are recharged. That would also mean the cars would have to have some kind of device to draw power from that embedded circuitry. Such a system would also closely approach personal rapid transit. Is this the wave of the future I see?

- Rob