Does size matter? Smart car challenge to US gas guzzlers

[PatrickHenry]

http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1808341,00.html

Can anything persuade American motorists that size is not important? DaimlerChrysler is hoping to smash received wisdom in the motor industry by unleashing its tiny Smart car on the world's biggest auto market.

[tinybear]

It matters if you're on the Interstate freeways and a huge container truck drives past you.

[Matt W]

I wish them luck. I think that small cars, sufficiently 'iconic', can make a limited impact on the US car market. If memory serves, the new Minis are proving quite popular. If the Smart cars are going to get anywhere, their best bet is to target cities first - they are really useful in traffic jams & the like.

[RickSp]

So far Daimler has been anything but smart in how they marketed the "Smart Car." They have been losing money on the car in Europe where conditions in many cities are perfect for the design. It will be very interesting to see how well or poorly they do in the US. The sticker price at around $15,000 still seems a touch high and the announced setting up of a new dealer network seems to play against Daimler's strengths. There is an obvious irony in a company that seems to be too stupid to effectively market a "Smart Car."

[Milton Bradley]

I am fairly comfortable in smaller vehicles, and I grew up on a motorcycle, so I can not be labaled as the typical American big car lover. ( Though I subscibe to that philosophy to a certain extent as well. All my favorite cars are HUGE. )


However, as Tiny points out, as long as the vast majority of other people are driving these enormous SUV's around, I will not be inclined to make the first move to the smallest thing on the road. Too dangerous in the early days of cell phones in the car.


As soon as the rest of you are ready to give up those monster trucks, I think ideas like this would work. ( That styling on that new miniature sucks though, gotta work on that a bit. )


Let me put it this way, I would be far more inclined to give up the big cars, and retain my personal freedom driving a personal car, rather than take to the trains.


I think the transition to a European style system of commuter trains is doomed in the US due to suburbia. I certainly don't think trains could work in the Toledo Metro area short of a $500 Billion dollar investment. ( Of course with the Bush administration conditioning us to these types of investments in Iraq, that might work toward making things of that nature a reality. )

[Autolykos]

It's not a question of size so much as it's a question of mass. Currently, the larger a car is, the more massive it is, thus the more fuel it takes to move it.

- Rob

[tivodan1116]

$15K seems pretty steep for something that won't carry too much other than myself.

For me, not worth it. I place a higher premium on comfort and performance than i do on fuel efficiency. Even if i doubled my overall fuel efficiency (which would be to about 50mpg) I would only save about $1500 a year, and I am an extremely high mileage driver.

Quote by: Autolykos It's not a question of size so much as it's a question of mass. Currently, the larger a car is, the more massive it is, thus the more fuel it takes to move it.

Well, partially, but this is an oversimplification. There are many, many factors in a vehicle's fuel consumption.

Quote by: Milton Bradley However, as Tiny points out, as long as the vast majority of other people are driving these enormous SUV's around, I will not be inclined to make the first move to the smallest thing on the road. Too dangerous in the early days of cell phones in the car.

While at this extreme size certainly makes a difference, it's not the only factor. Medium-sized cars test much better in crash safety than SUVs and trucks, especially when it comes to one-vehicle accidents (the most common kind) against an immovable object such as a bridge abuttment.

[deedee]

Quote by: PatrickHenry http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1808341,00.html

Hi Patrick!

Heck yeah.....any car that will prevent and reduce the Americans from depending upon foreign oil will help! Heck yeah!

[RickSp]

Quote by: tivodan1116 $15K seems pretty steep for something that won't carry too much other than myself. For me, not worth it. I place a higher premium on comfort and performance than i do on fuel efficiency. Even if i doubled my overall fuel efficiency (which would be to about 50mpg) I would only save about $1500 a year, and I am an extremely high mileage driver.

I am a city dweller with a family of four, so our min-van works well for us. I park on the street so the small size of the Smart Car does have a certain appeal. The gas mileage issue is less of a concern because I don't drive my car every day. I often walk or use mass transit. When I do need my car it is to load up on groceries or carry around kids, both of which a "Smart Car" can't handle.

[underbear1]

Does size matter?

As it turns out, it does.

I don't know nuthin' about cars.

[brien]

Quote by: PatrickHenry http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1808341,00.html

As many of you know, I am in the "big bad" trucking industry. These little smart cars maybe good for the cities, but I wouldn't recommend them to mix it up on the interstate and state highways with 18 wheelers whose GVW is 80,000 lbs moving at even 50 mph.
They will crush them like a tin can being run over in the roadway.

But hey, if people want to buy them, I say great. Keep in mind that most tractor trailer accidents involving four wheelers are usually the fault of the automobile, not the professional driver.

See this link:http://refrigeratedtrans.com/mag/tra...ers/index.html

From the link:

Tractor-trailer drivers with a Class A license were deemed to be driving properly-or not at fault-in 71.6 percent of the fatal accidents in which they were involved. By comparison, automobile drivers involved in fatal collisions with trucks were found to be driving properly in 45.4 percent of accidents. Truck drivers continue to be the least likely to be drinking and driving. While 24 percent of automobile drivers involved in fatal accidents with tractor-trailers had been drinking, alcohol was a factor for 1 percent of truck drivers.

Even though the above is taken from a Canadian study, it no doubt would be mirrored here in the US. I can't coun't the many times I have heard that the 4 wheeler was in the right because it had the right of way. Great, the driver was right, dead right.

That not withstanding, inattentive drivers make some mighty strange moves on the highways around the "big rigs."

See this link on inattentiveness:http://www.yourlawyer.com/articles/t...iler_accidents

From this link:

According to the report by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) and the Virginia Tech Transportation Institute, 80% of collisions and 65% of near-collisions occur within three seconds of some type of distraction.

The study recorded some 2 million miles of driving during which 82 collisions and 761 near-collisions occurred. Inattention occasioned by reading, dialing a hand-held device, or applying makeup tripled the risk of an accident or near-accident while reaching for a moving object increased that risk by 900%. Drowsiness had been thought o be a factor in 10% of collisions or near-collisions. The study revealed the risk to be far higher, at 22% (400% increased risk). Cell phone use was the most frequent distraction observed.

The researchers expressed concern over the fact that activities like eating, drinking, and retrieving objects were more risky than previously believed as well as the fact that the presence of new technologies has further compromised driver attention.
Even the shortest period of inattention or distraction can have serious consequences. Thus, the NHTSA emphasizes the need for drivers to remain alert at all times.

Young drivers (18 to 20) were found to be 400% more likely to be involved in attention-related accidents or near accidents as drivers over 35. They were also found to be more likely to use poor judgment, drive aggressively, or engage in distracted behavior in high-risk situations.

So I would suggest: Caveat emptor. If one chooses to buy one of these little tin cans, then use it cautiously and wisely.

[tivodan1116]

Quote by: RickSp I am a city dweller with a family of four, so our min-van works well for us. I park on the street so the small size of the Smart Car does have a certain appeal. The gas mileage issue is less of a concern because I don't drive my car every day. I often walk or use mass transit. When I do need my car it is to load up on groceries or carry around kids, both of which a "Smart Car" can't handle.

That works for you then. I am completely in favor of car manufacturers offering whatever customers want to buy. If Daimler thinks there is a market for this car here, by all means, go for it. As i have said before, the free market deserves a whack at fixing every problem before government steps in - the example i have used before is McDonalds selling salads.

My family are "village dwellers" - we live in a small village about 20 miles west of a major city, separated by a good bit of rural space but connected via a limited access highway. We can walk to most of the services our village offers, including my son's daycare and my wife's job, which are right next to each other about 5 blocks from our house. However, my work is in the city, 25 miles away, and my school in in Buffalo (well, Amherst), almost exactly 60 miles door-to-door.

Our family plan has worked well to have a large family vehicle (which gets hardly any miles) to use on road trips and other excursions out of the village, which generally happens once a week as a family. Currently that's a Saturn VUE. Then we have a "highway star" - basically a comfortable car that can take a pounding on mileage for all of my commuting. Right now, that's an Olds Intrigue with 120,000 miles on it. Still runs great. When I finish school our strategy will probably stay the same because my wife will be a stay-at-home mom and there aren't many law jobs in our village, although eventually i'd like to set up a practice there.

[RickSp]

Quote by: underbear1 Does size matter? As it turns out, it does. I don't know nuthin' about cars.

And my guess is that you are talking about a whole 'nother type of parking space, so to speak.

[brien]

Quote by: RickSp And my guess is that you are talking about a whole 'nother type of parking space, so to speak.

My guess is that you are correct Ric. Guess it always comes down to sex and drugs and rock and roll.

[Rave7pt0]

I have 2 teenagers, an 11 year old, and a 7 year old, plus my wife and myself. Small cars just aren't practical for me.

[Apeman81]

Land of the Free....

Drive whatever the hell you want! Who needs to convince us silly Americans anything? We're doing just fine, thank you.

[PatrickHenry]

Funny... this little car can actually be thought of as a motorbike for two with safety features. Ease of parking, fuel economy, cargo capacity, vulnerability to aggression or inattentiveness by others...

There ARE larger, more extended villages where walking is impractical, tivodan. The roof and wipers makes it better'n a moped...

[gallo]

Parallel parking in Rome.

[rez]

Quote by: gallo Parallel parking in Rome.

this are the same people that

work an average of 36 hours a week. Long lunch breaks are common. Shops and offices may close between 1 and 4 p.m. Workers take a break when the heat is most intense and enjoy a leisurely meal. It is not uncommon to take a short nap, called la pennichella, after the noon meal. Government offices and services close early in the afternoon but stores stay open late into the evening.

America can not have this type of attitude (i hope you recognize my sarcasm)

[tman_ndsu08]

Two problems.

I want it to be fully electric. No combustion engine, please.


The price is too high.
15k is not going to do it for me.

8k sounds better to me.