What will it take to prove religion?

[SoccerfreakAB2]

How did God make Earth?
How did God make water? both of these have the same answer, stated in Genesis one
How did God create himself/Who created God? God is infinite, the Alpha, the Omega, the Beginning and the End... he has no beginning and no end, he doesnt need them.
How/when will the universe end?the universe is not going to end, just the earth at the end of the tribulation and the millenial reign he will destroy it with fire
How is God perfect, yet always jealous of people?????? i answered this already and dont need to reiterate it, read back and find out.
Why was it necessary for Jesus to die for our sins? "for there is none righteous, no not one". Romans 3:10
since none is righteous, then that leaves that none are perfect and that all have sinned: "For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" Romans 3:23
that means: "Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned" Romans 5:12
"For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord" the answer in the Bible
If any other wise person claimed to have died for us, should we make a religion for him? no, cause he was not perfect, Jesus never sinned, he was the completely spotless Lamb of God.
Why does God allow you to sin all you want, then you still get the chance to be redeemed and go to heaven? think i know? cause i dont. if i were God i would have zapped Adam and started over again. all i can say is he is a loving God, oh, and you just tied your words into knots for me. didnt you ask me how God can be a loving God? you just answered yourself for me, hee hee.
Even traveling at the speed of light for multiple human lifetimes, we could reach less than 5% the known universe...why make the rest? why do artists paint? why do people write novels and then publish them through non paying publishers? you think i know? hes just creative! our God is a creative God. the only plausible answer is the previous answers
Why not just have our solar system if Earth won't be destroyed until judgment day?

Sure you can have your own creative, very imaginative answers, but there is only one answer to these questions. I think or believe won't work too well.

You have to be joking me!

Genesis 1: "And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so."

Ohhh, now I get it..."let it appear"? What a crappy answer. Can you explain this?

What makes you so sure the universe will not end? ONLY because the bible tells you so? Any evidence otherwise? Probaby not...so not a valid answer.

Read back and find out to see why God is always jealous and yet perfect? You never even answered myu question in the first place. You found like 500 reasons why God is loving and perfect, then a bunch more of why he is jealous. None of them had a relation to the other. So my question remains without an answer....

"for there is none righteous, no not one". Romans 3:10...Explain how this answers:

Why is it necessary for Jesus to die for our sins? All you said was that sin is committed by EVERY man, and Jesus was a man coming into the world, which means he sinned, which means he is not perfect. But then you say this:

"no, cause he was not perfect, Jesus never sinned, he was the completely spotless Lamb of God."

Is Jesus representative of sin or something? That completely makes no sense, because that would make him sin, but he's perfect...or not...too much contradiction.

"didnt you ask me how God can be a loving God? you just answered yourself for me, hee hee."

No, I asked why is God perfect if he's jealous...teeheehee

Creative? Or obsessive-compulsive? Out of the 70,000,000,000,000,000,000 planets, only 1 contains life. Hmm...something's fishy...

[dthmstr254]

You have to be joking me!

Genesis 1: "And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so."

Ohhh, now I get it..."let it appear"? What a crappy answer. Can you explain this? my big bang theory: God said it, bang it was there. He is God, why would he need to do anything to make the worlds.

What makes you so sure the universe will not end? ONLY because the bible tells you so? Any evidence otherwise? Probaby not...so not a valid answer. well, is there any other possible way to know the universe will not end, wellll, for us christians, it wont end. you will probably think it has if you dont pray for salvation. and if you dont, your blood will not be on my hands, as i have shown you clearly as i could the way.

Read back and find out to see why God is always jealous and yet perfect? You never even answered myu question in the first place. You found like 500 reasons why God is loving and perfect, then a bunch more of why he is jealous. None of them had a relation to the other. So my question remains without an answer.... if you cant put a finger on it then you have not translated it correctly. here is a little experiment for you. if you spent years working up to the moment of proposal to your future wife, and she told you that she wouldnt accept it if you were the last man on earth, tell me how you would feel. he created and raised us to be in his image. and we tell him basically the same thing through our actions. he died on the cross for us, yet we throw his gift of salvation in his face. he holds out in love, but he wont hold out much longer, cause the rapture could happen as i am typing the next post, shoot, it might have happened during this post, and someone was just polite enough to post this, thinking that i would want it posted if they got on and logged me off

"for there is none righteous, no not one". Romans 3:10...Explain how this answers:

Why is it necessary for Jesus to die for our sins? All you said was that sin is committed by EVERY man, and Jesus was a man coming into the world, which means he sinned, which means he is not perfect. But then you say this:

"no, cause he was not perfect, Jesus never sinned, He was the completely spotless Lamb of God."
the first he was reffering to a different person, the wise person mentioned in the sentence prior to your quote: "If any other wise person claimed to have died for us, should we make a religion for him?"

Is Jesus representative of sin or something? That completely makes no sense, because that would make him sin, but he's perfect...or not...too much contradiction. you took me out of context there sonny. no problem with what i said, cause i was answering your question

"didnt you ask me how God can be a loving God? you just answered yourself for me, hee hee."

No, I asked why is God perfect if he's jealous...teeheehee
"Why does God allow you to sin all you want, then you still get the chance to be redeemed and go to heaven? think i know? cause i dont. if i were God i would have zapped Adam and started over again. all i can say is he is a loving God, oh, and you just tied your words into knots for me. didnt you ask me how God can be a loving God? you just answered yourself for me, hee hee."
here is the quote from you in its context

Creative? Or obsessive-compulsive? Out of the 70,000,000,000,000,000,000 planets, only 1 contains life. Hmm...something's fishy...
i like that better! AMEN!!!!! you just gave me a shouting fit. "obsessive-compulsive!" i have reason to think that God just reached through that last post and touched me to my soul. he is obsessed. why? he made everything here, dont you think that you would be a bit obsessive if you made this whole universe? What a God He is!

[SoccerfreakAB2]

i like that better! AMEN!!!!! you just gave me a shouting fit. "obsessive-compulsive!" i have reason to think that God just reached through that last post and touched me to my soul. he is obsessed. why? he made everything here, dont you think that you would be a bit obsessive if you made this whole universe? What a God He is!

Not surprisingly, you confuse obsessive with obsessive compulsive.

What's also not surprising is that you refuse to refute my arguments. Poor theist.

[dthmstr254]

Not surprisingly, you confuse obsessive with obsessive compulsive.

What's also not surprising is that you refuse to refute my arguments. Poor theist.

i just gave you a 500 word answer to your arguments and you take one phrase out of its context and decide that i am not refuting your arguments. this is showing me that you have a lacking ability in the area of critical thinking. poor atheist :(

[SoccerfreakAB2]

i just gave you a 500 word answer to your arguments and you take one phrase out of its context and decide that i am not refuting your arguments. this is showing me that you have a lacking ability in the area of critical thinking. poor atheist :(

I refuted you in one sentence, that's how bad your 500 word answer sucked. Try again please. Next time, don't use a 100% biased source. Use your reason and truthful knowledge. You said God was loving a lot and that God gets angry with people a lot and will destroy them if he has to? But I thought he was merciful? You didn't even refute my refutations of your argument yet!

[dthmstr254]

I refuted you in one sentence, that's how bad your 500 word answer sucked. Try again please. Next time, don't use a 100% biased source. Use your reason and truthful knowledge. You said God was loving a lot and that God gets angry with people a lot and will destroy them if he has to? But I thought he was merciful? You didn't even refute my refutations of your argument yet!

not merciful, an unmerciful God would not have come down to earth to die for our sins. he is also a holy God and cannot mingle with sin, so he cannot allow those who do not accept the gift of salvation. if you think he just judges those who are not saved, then tell that to the people who are saved. if you are saved the number one way to know this is that when you sin, God chastises you. i have seen Christians backslide into sin and die as the consequences caught up to them. just read this from revelation 3:14-22
14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

[dthmstr254]

not merciful, an unmerciful God would not have come down to earth to die for our sins. he is also a holy God and cannot mingle with sin, so he cannot allow those who do not accept the gift of salvation. if you think he just judges those who are not saved, then tell that to the people who are saved. if you are saved the number one way to know this is that when you sin, God chastises you. i have seen Christians backslide into sin and die as the consequences caught up to them. just read this from revelation 3:14-22
14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

this church was a church of saved people but they had grown lukewarm. have you ever drank lukewarm water. it doesnt taste too good

[SoccerfreakAB2]

not merciful, an unmerciful God would not have come down to earth to die for our sins. he is also a holy God and cannot mingle with sin, so he cannot allow those who do not accept the gift of salvation. if you think he just judges those who are not saved, then tell that to the people who are saved. if you are saved the number one way to know this is that when you sin, God chastises you. i have seen Christians backslide into sin and die as the consequences caught up to them. just read this from revelation 3:14-22
14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Uh, well you still haven't refuted my arguments yet, but that doesn't surprise me. Anyways, what's so merciful about a God (omnipotent, omniscient, etc.) coming down from such a sweet place to live, then dying again, and going back up there? What was the point of that?!? So he claimed to die for our sins? Who cares? We still sin. What he did affected nothing besides the people who fell for his wisdom. He just died and went back up to a place that for the next 2000 years will remain a mystery to everyone else. Why? Because it's fake and not real. He lived, he was wise, he died.

[Athena]

Soccer pretty much hit the nail on the head. I also see that even though the probability is low, it makes sense that our circumstances would eventually arise. But I mean think of how the correct situation would have to remain for our lives to reach this point. With all the things that could have happened to destry our species, planet, or Universe, we keep on. My astronomy teacher talked about how close our Universe came to collapsing back in on itself when it was formed. I don't recall the details, but he said that most astronomers don't feel this is coincidence. There seems to be a greater hand in all of this.


What gets me is, why does a sentient species even exist? Animals do fine without the level of thought that we have. Why would such an intelligent group arise? Maybe evolution could explain that, but it seems unecessary.

A God seems like the best answer. I keep learning to find out more about our world, nature, people, and everything else that interests me, but I try to learn of God too. I don't see how it is possible for things to come together the way they have without some guidance.

As Soccer pointed out, many people don't agree with this, but it seems like the best explanation to me.

A God could be the answer, and I am okay with that. The God of Abraham however, is not a believable God to people who just read the bible and haven't learned all the ways Christians twist things to make sense out of what the bible says. For example- the God who walks in Eden with Adam and Eve, is nothing like the God in a burning bush that Mose speaks with, and these God images are different from the one in the ark, and very different from the God Jesus tells us about. Christians have learned to rationalize all this so it makes sense. Someone just reading the bible who hasn't learned to rationalize the bible stories, finds a lot of fault with literal interpretations, as opposed to interpreting it abstractly. Fables with a moral, but not literally how things happened.

Adam and Eve is a myth/fable, not to be taken literally. It is a Hebrew translation of a Sumerian story about many Gods, that was changed in the process of translation. It seems ridiculous to me that people can take this story literally! No where does the bible say God dictated the story to Moses. It all happened long before Moses, so who was there to report what happened? The story is not presented as God telling us the story.
It isn't Adam or Eve telling the story. Who do you think witnessed the event and told the story? Why does the story read as though it were written by an objective observer who could not have existed at the time?

[Athena]

not merciful, an unmerciful God would not have come down to earth to die for our sins. he is also a holy God and cannot mingle with sin, so he cannot allow those who do not accept the gift of salvation. if you think he just judges those who are not saved, then tell that to the people who are saved. if you are saved the number one way to know this is that when you sin, God chastises you. i have seen Christians backslide into sin and die as the consequences caught up to them. just read this from revelation 3:14-22
14And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

15I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

16So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

17Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

18I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

19As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

20Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

21To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

22He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Okay what is Amen doing here? Amenhotep IV built the Temple of Amen. This is a Egyptian God. The bible story of creation is also an ancient Egyptian story of creation, up to Adam and Eve which is Sumerian. Do you realize Amen is Egyptian?

[dthmstr254]

Okay what is Amen doing here? Amenhotep IV built the Temple of Amen. This is a Egyptian God. The bible story of creation is also an ancient Egyptian story of creation, up to Adam and Eve which is Sumerian. Do you realize Amen is Egyptian?

The Amen refers to another of God's names, eg Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Prince of Peace, etc.

[dthmstr254]

A God could be the answer, and I am okay with that. The God of Abraham however, is not a believable God to people who just read the bible and haven't learned all the ways Christians twist things to make sense out of what the bible says. For example- the God who walks in Eden with Adam and Eve, is nothing like the God in a burning bush that Mose speaks with, and these God images are different from the one in the ark, and very different from the God Jesus tells us about. Christians have learned to rationalize all this so it makes sense. Someone just reading the bible who hasn't learned to rationalize the bible stories, finds a lot of fault with literal interpretations, as opposed to interpreting it abstractly. Fables with a moral, but not literally how things happened.

Adam and Eve is a myth/fable, not to be taken literally. It is a Hebrew translation of a Sumerian story about many Gods, that was changed in the process of translation. It seems ridiculous to me that people can take this story literally! No where does the bible say God dictated the story to Moses. It all happened long before Moses, so who was there to report what happened? The story is not presented as God telling us the story.
It isn't Adam or Eve telling the story. Who do you think witnessed the event and told the story? Why does the story read as though it were written by an objective observer who could not have existed at the time?

oh my, my my. looks more like you have done the twisting here. the Sumerians were not around to tell Moses that story! he was at the River Jordan, come from Egypt, he was buried in Israel, north of where Jericho used to be. how could the ancient Sumerians even know of Moses? and why would they tell him? and the Bible refers to Moses as the author many times. i will have Dr Kemp give me these verses tomorrow so i will not falter in my knowledge, him being much more versed in the Bible than i am. and it would read as if an objective writer was writing it if moses had written it. the Bible refers to itself as, roughly translated, "God-Breathed" in several places. here is a list of the several names of God in their original Hebrew:
GOD'S NAMES:
Jehovah, has been transliterated from the Masoretic Hebrew text from the consonants JHVH or JHWH, merged with the vowels of a separate word, Adonai [Lord], since the name YHWH was so sacred as to be unspeakable.

Jehovah or Yahweh - His majesty. "I am the LORD, that is My Name; I will not give to another, or My Praise to idols." (Isaiah 42:8)
Jehovah Tsidkenu or Yahweh Tsidkenu - our righteousness. "In his days Judah will be saved and Israel will live in safety. This is the Name by which He will be called: The LORD Our Righteousness." (Jeremiah 23:6)
Jehovah Mekaddsh or Yahweh Mekaddsh - He sanctifies. "Keep My decrees and follow them. I am the LORD, who makes you holy." (Leviticus 20:8)
Jehovah Shalom or Yahweh Shalom - He is peace. "So Gideon built an altar to the LORD there and called it The LORD is Peace." (Judges 6:24)
Jehovah Shammah or Yahweh Shammah - He is there. "And the name of the city from that time on will be: The LORD is There." (Ezekiel 48:35)
Jehovah Rophe or Yahweh Rophe - He heals. "If you listen carefully to the voice of the LORD your God and do what is right in His eyes, if you pay attention to His commands and keep all His decrees, I will not bring on you any of the diseases I brought on the Egyptians, for I am the LORD, who heals you." (Exodus 15:26)
Jehovah Jireh or Yahweh Jireh - He provides. "Abraham looked up and there in a thicket he saw a ram caught by its horns. He went over and took the ram and sacrificed it as a burnt offering instead of his son. So Abraham called that place The LORD will Provide. And to this day it is said, 'On the mountain of the LORD it will be provided." (Genesis 22:13-14)
"And my God will meet all your needs according to His glorious riches in Christ Jesus." (Philippians 4:19)
Jehovah Nissi or Yahweh Nissi - my banner. "Moses built an altar and called it The LORD is my Banner." (Exodus 17:15)
Jehovah Rhoi or Yahweh Rhoi - my shepherd. "The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not be in want." (Psalms 23:1)
El Is Generic For God; Adding A Predicate, We Get God Almighty's Name.
(El is combined with other word portions to make Israel, Daniel, Joel, others)

El Shaddai - the Almighty. "I am the LORD. I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob as God Almighty…" (Exodus 6:3)
"I am God Almighty, walk before me and be blameless." (Genesis 17:1)
"Holy, holy, holy is the LORD Almighty; the whole earth [inserted, the whole universe] is full of His glory." (Isaiah 6:3)
El Elyon - the Most High God, the Exalted One. "Blessed be Abram by God Most High, Creator of heaven and earth. And blessed be God Most High, who delivered your enemies into your hand." (Genesis 14:19-20)
El Olam - God of eternity, God the everlasting One. "Abraham planted a tamarisk tree in Beersheba, and there he called upon the name of the LORD, the Eternal God." (Genesis 21:33)
"Trust in the LORD forever, for the LORD, the LORD, is the Rock eternal." Isaiah 26:4)
"Before the mountains were born or you brought forth the earth and the world, from everlasting to everlasting you are God." (Psalms 90:2)
El Berith - God of the covenant. "I will make you into a great nation and I will bless; I will make your name great, and you will be a blessing. I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you I will curse; and all peoples on earth will be blessed through you." (Genesis 12:2-3)
"I will confirm my covenant between Me and you and will greatly increase your numbers." (Genesis 17:2)
El Roi - God who sees. "You are the God who sees me." (Genesis 16:13)
El Hoseem - God who creates. "I am the LORD, who has made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by myself." (Isaiah 44:24)