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Thread: Death and the Present Moment

  1. #1
    Sapere Aude Jack's Avatar
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    Death and the Present Moment

    While atheism does not have any doctrine of its own, it's simply the lack of a belief in gods, there are doctrine-like philosophical consequences of not having a belief in gods.

    Perhaps the primary consequence of not believing in gods, and the one that theists find the most repugnant, is the conclusion that there is nothing after death; no everlasting life (up above or down below), no karma, no reincarnation. To not believe in gods and the religious beliefs associated with the various systems of faith means that we therefor believe that there's nothing after this life, nothing. Our cells quit functioning along with our internal organs, synapsis stop firing in the brain and our flesh begins to loose coherence and starts to decompose. We cease to be. We return to a non-existence as real as the non-existence that was our state before our conception.

    Beliefs in an afterlife offers consolation and comfort to those who have lost loved ones and assurance to those who fear the finality of death. But like the belief in god, the desire or need to believe in life after death does not mean that such a thing has to exist.

    Atheists and others who accept that there's no credible evidence that anything exists beyond death that we'll be able to appreciate or comprehend are left having to conclude that this life is all we get, a one-shot deal. No matter how long or short, no matter how happy or sad, no matter how profitable or misspent, this life is the only life we'll have.

    There are many lessons I learned as a theist years ago that stay with me, that still have relevance to my current non-believing life. One of them is what Jesus is reported to have said in Matthew 6:34, "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."

    For the non-believer, each day, every hour, each moment, is a gift from the universe. We will never have another chance to live this minute, to experience this moment. Worrying about the future or the past, while inevitable for most humans, is also a waste of time, the most precious thing we all posses. We understand that we may never have another moment to express our love for someone, we may never get another chance to show mercy or perform an act of kindness. Most of us will never know exactly when this life will come to an end. It may be years from now, after you've lived a full and gratifying life, had children and grandchildren, achieved the majority of goals you set for yourself. Or it may come to an end in the next hour, the next minute. An organ may fail or a car crash into yours. Your life could end before you ever have a chance to mend a broken relationship, to experience something you've longed to do for years. Acknowledging that fact should compel you to treat every moment as if it was your last, to try and squeeze the most enjoyment, the greatest good, the most benefit from every second of your life. No little bit of awareness should pass unnoticed, no moment of consciousness pass unappreciated.

    If this is the only chance we'll ever get to experience this thing we call life we cannot justify wasting any second of it. If death is the final act in this play of life then we cannot justify missing a moment of this life distracted by the unlikely possibility of a life to come after we die.





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    World Hack Affluence's Avatar
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    Your post is good. Live every day as if it was your last. It doesn't actually conflict with God. And Sam Harris presents very well.

    Where you say " life is a gift from the universe " We Theists simply replace universe with God and it then fits our beliefs.

    Peace, Affluence.


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    Hot Lava crimethinker's Avatar
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    Atheism doesn't equate to lack of belief in an after-life. There are secular theories of the after-life, as I state in this thread. The main source is here. Yes, it's "unproven" and probably false, but it's not a foregone conclusion that there is no after-life.

    For a void without a question is just perverse.

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    Intellectual truthreality's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    While atheism does not have any doctrine of its own, it's simply the lack of a belief in gods, there are doctrine-like philosophical consequences of not having a belief in gods.

    Perhaps the primary consequence of not believing in gods, and the one that theists find the most repugnant, is the conclusion that there is nothing after death; no everlasting life (up above or down below), no karma, no reincarnation. To not believe in gods and the religious beliefs associated with the various systems of faith means that we therefor believe that there's nothing after this life, nothing. Our cells quit functioning along with our internal organs, synapsis stop firing in the brain and our flesh begins to loose coherence and starts to decompose. We cease to be. We return to a non-existence as real as the non-existence that was our state before our conception.

    Beliefs in an afterlife offers consolation and comfort to those who have lost loved ones and assurance to those who fear the finality of death. But like the belief in god, the desire or need to believe in life after death does not mean that such a thing has to exist.

    Atheists and others who accept that there's no credible evidence that anything exists beyond death that we'll be able to appreciate or comprehend are left having to conclude that this life is all we get, a one-shot deal. No matter how long or short, no matter how happy or sad, no matter how profitable or misspent, this life is the only life we'll have.

    There are many lessons I learned as a theist years ago that stay with me, that still have relevance to my current non-believing life. One of them is what Jesus is reported to have said in Matthew 6:34, "Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."

    For the non-believer, each day, every hour, each moment, is a gift from the universe. We will never have another chance to live this minute, to experience this moment. Worrying about the future or the past, while inevitable for most humans, is also a waste of time, the most precious thing we all posses. We understand that we may never have another moment to express our love for someone, we may never get another chance to show mercy or perform an act of kindness. Most of us will never know exactly when this life will come to an end. It may be years from now, after you've lived a full and gratifying life, had children and grandchildren, achieved the majority of goals you set for yourself. Or it may come to an end in the next hour, the next minute. An organ may fail or a car crash into yours. Your life could end before you ever have a chance to mend a broken relationship, to experience something you've longed to do for years. Acknowledging that fact should compel you to treat every moment as if it was your last, to try and squeeze the most enjoyment, the greatest good, the most benefit from every second of your life. No little bit of awareness should pass unnoticed, no moment of consciousness pass unappreciated.

    If this is the only chance we'll ever get to experience this thing we call life we cannot justify wasting any second of it. If death is the final act in this play of life then we cannot justify missing a moment of this life distracted by the unlikely possibility of a life to come after we die.

    Accepting death and living in the present moment...Great. Let me know when you discover insight that hasn't already been put forth by eastern religions.


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    Hot Lava Dave In Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: truthreality View Post
    Accepting death and living in the present moment...Great. Let me know when you discover insight that hasn't already been put forth by eastern religions.
    If you knew anything about Sam Harris you would know that Eastern spiritualism has been an influence on his life. I don't think Jack was informing us that this is something new, I believe that he was passing on this insight to give us something to chew on. Unfortunately, many people (myself included) here in North America are pretty ignorant of Eastern spiritualism and Eastern religions.


  6. #6
    Intellectual truthreality's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Dave In Canada View Post
    If you knew anything about Sam Harris you would know that Eastern spiritualism has been an influence on his life. I don't think Jack was informing us that this is something new, I believe that he was passing on the insight for some of us to chew on.

    The fact is that many people here in North America are pretty ignorant of Eastern spiritualism and Eastern religions.
    I know that Sam Harris has been influenced by eastern spiritualism. I am aware that he wants to incorporate meditation and yoga into society for personal well being.

    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    While atheism does not have any doctrine of its own, it's simply the lack of a belief in gods, there are doctrine-like philosophical consequences of not having a belief in gods.
    Acceptance of death and living in the present are not philosophical consequences of atheism. Both concepts exist in eastern religions. Jack was not passing on insight for us to chew on. He was trying to make the argument that somehow both of these concepts are the result of atheistic philosophy. This is false. Both concepts existed in eastern religions well before atheism became a fad. Let's not high jack philosophies from religion and give credence to non religion.


  7. #7
    Volcanic Erupter
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    Quote Quote by: Jack View Post
    While atheism does not have any doctrine of its own, it's simply the lack of a belief in gods, there are doctrine-like philosophical consequences of not having a belief in gods.
    Do you really believe that you live your life so much differently than anyone else does, theist or not??

    I upped my income, up yours.

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    Hot Lava Dave In Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Zeebadee View Post
    Do you really believe that you live your life so much differently than anyone else does, theist or not??
    In my opinion Jack was trying to point out that theists often have the fallacious belief that atheists lack of a belief in a God means that we lack morality which leads to hedonism. I also believe that Jack was trying to point out that this fallacy couldn't be further from the truth.

    I don't think that Jack worries near as much as theists about what everybody else is doing in the privacy of their own homes, nor is he damning others who do not share his beliefs much like theists tend to do.


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    Hot Lava Dave In Canada's Avatar
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    Let's not high jack philosophies from religion and give credence to non religion.
    If you understand atheism I think that these concepts are a natural fit. Let's not forget that those philosophies were well thought out personal beliefs held by an individual. Let's not let religions and Gods hijack human concepts.


  10. #10
    Intellectual truthreality's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Dave In Canada View Post
    If you understand atheism I think that these concepts are a natural fit.
    These concepts are natural fits for both atheists and theists. These are concepts that benefit humans in general. This separation between theism and atheism is unwarranted.


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    Hot Lava Dave In Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: truthreality View Post
    These concepts are natural fits for both atheists and theists. These are concepts that benefit humans in general. This separation between theism and atheism is unwarranted.
    My bad, I didn't realize that theists didn't believe in an afterlife. That is where the seperation lies isn't it?


  12. #12
    Intellectual truthreality's Avatar
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    Quote Quote by: Dave In Canada View Post
    My bad, I didn't realize that theists didn't believe in an afterlife. That is where the seperation lies isn't it?
    First belief in an afterlife has absolutely no bearing on living in the present moment and acceptance of death. Second many atheists do not live in the present and worry about the future and fear death. What is your point?

    Here is a book about living in the present moment by a theist:

    The Power of Now: A Guide to Spiritual Enlightenment


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