(FOREWORD: I feel the need to talk frankly about this. I may say some things that appear offensive so it is important for me to say beforehand that I think racism is a morally and intellectually bankrupt institution with no legs left to stand on.)

I have heard talk from both left and right about a coming race war in America.

Is it inevitable? Maybe. I have black friends who tell me that sometimes, whenever they visit a big city, white people will cross the street to avoid them. While it seems alien to me (since I live in a small, rural-ish, folksy kind of town where there's virtually no crime), I can see why the big city type do it -- statistics show that blacks make up a disproportionate amount of crimes committed in America, especially in urban settings.

This is leading, conversely, to a rise in the "angry white man" phenomenon. These are people who, out of fear for their family or just plain paranoia, go out and buy home security systems, guard dogs, or (if their city permits such an act) guns. They get frustrated when they hear statistics about Chicago's annual 600+ murders and think, as racist as the thought may be, "God d*** it, why can't you people just stop killing?!"

This phenomenon eventually leads to a counter-rise in those, especially liberal university professorial types, who glorify race riots, like the one in Los Angeles after the Rodney King beating. Whites were dragged from their cars and beaten, homes were robbed, stores were looted, buildings were burned down. Similar incidents have happened in major cities all throughout the country. Pictures of these riots bring back unhappy memories of the revolt against Apartheid.

So, is a race war coming? And if so, what can we do about it?

Please cite sources on the comment that blacks commit a disproportionate amount of crime, if you would.

There already is a race war, just like there is a class war. Look at the number of black men and hispanic men especially that are on parole, in prison, jail, or on probation.

Will non-whites rise up and start killing white people? I sincerely doubt there will be that kind of war in the U.S. anytime soon. I would assume that deep poverty will be more of any kind of a motivator for extreme violence rather than race, although race could be a part of it.

Ooh, sorry, I guess I should:

The CIA World Factbook lists the projected US population in 2004 as 293,027,571. It also lists that whites make up 77.1% of the population, compared to blacks' 12.9%. This means whites outnumber blacks, on average, about 6-1. (SOURCE: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbo...us.html#People)

The FBI Uniform Crime Reports for 2002, which is the most recent year for which such statistics are available (population demographics might have changed slightly from 2002 to 2003, but I believe they are similar enough that it would not significantly influence the outcome of this either way), whites commited 6,923,390 of America's total crimes (from murder all the way down to runaways and curfew violations), compared to blacks' 2,633,632. (SOURCE: http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_02/html/web/ar...4-table43.html) This means that whites' collective crime rate outnumbers blacks' by a little over 2.6-1.

This means that there is about one crime commited by a white person for every 32.6 white people, whereas there is one crime committed by a black person for every 14.4 black people. Altogher, this means that if there were exactly as many blacks as whites, crimes committed by blacks would outnumber those by whites by a margin of 2.3-to-1.

(NOTE: On second inspection, I actually found that the heading on the FBI UCR02 was "People Arrested." This means that blacks arrested for crimes outnumber whites. Still, it is unreasonable to believe that blacks are being arrested in such disproportion that it creates a false illusion that, as a whole, they commit more crimes).

I think minorities commit more violent crimes as a percentage. That has to do with deep poverty more than race. However, other than that I don't think your idea that blacks commit more crimes than whites holds much water.



http://www.drugwarfacts.org/racepris.htm

According to the federal Household Survey, "most current illicit drug users are white. There were an estimated 9.9 million whites (72 percent of all users), 2.0 million blacks (15 percent), and 1.4 million Hispanics (10 percent) who were current illicit drug users in 1998." And yet, blacks constitute 36.8% of those arrested for drug violations, over 42% of those in federal prisons for drug violations. African-Americans comprise almost 58% of those in state prisons for drug felonies; Hispanics account for 20.7%.
Source: Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, National Household Survey on Drug Abuse: Summary Report 1998 (Rockville, MD: Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, 1999), p. 13; Bureau of Justice Statistics, Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics 1998 (Washington DC: US Department of Justice, August 1999), p. 343, Table 4.10, p. 435, Table 5.48, and p. 505, Table 6.52; Beck, Allen J., Ph.D. and Mumola, Christopher J., Bureau of Justice Statistics, Prisoners in 1998 (Washington DC: US Department of Justice, August 1999), p. 10, Table 16; Beck, Allen J., PhD, and Paige M. Harrison, US Dept. of Justice, Bureau of Justice Statistics (Washington, DC: US Dept. of Justice, August 2001), p. 11, Table 16.


Among persons convicted of drug felonies in state courts, whites were less likely than African-Americans to be sent to prison. Thirty-three percent (33%) of convicted white defendants received a prison sentence, while 51% of African-American defendants received prison sentences. It should also be noted that Hispanic felons are included in both demographic groups rather than being tracked separately so no separate statistic is available.
Source: Durose, Matthew R., and Langan, Patrick A., Bureau of Justice Statistics, State Court Sentencing of Convicted Felons, 1998 Statistical Tables (Washington DC: US Department of Justice, December 2001), Table 25, available on the web at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/abstract/scsc98st.htm, last accessed December 21, 2001.


See also:
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http://www.sentencingproject.org/pdfs/5022.pdf

I'm not disputing that fact. Actually, the vast majority of crimes committed in America have been found to be against other criminals -- i.e., gang-related (gang shootouts, etc.). The result is that you can dramatically reduce your chances of being victimized by making a few simple lifestyle changes, like not dealing drugs.

I could probably account for this, because I have several white drug-using friends who live here in the boonies. If most drug-using whites live in low-crime areas it is unreasonable to assume that they would be caught, since police have no particular interest in that area. If, however, you are a drug user living in a high crime area, like a large city where blacks tend to vastly outnumber whites, you are more likely to be caught because of government programs to "crack down" on drug use.

This is less explainable and probably due to the "angry white man" phenomenon that I mentioned -- they are angry and paranoid and would rather see them contained safely behind bars. The AWM phenomenon is itself a critical component of what could be a brewing race war.

I believe a race war is coming and I believe it will be a worldwide phenomenon. Zimbabwe is a good indicator, South Africa will soon follow. The pacific region is a hotbed of racial tension because of a 'white guilt' syndrome sweeping the world. Native peoples are demanding restitution for past grievances and receiving them wholesale, legislation passed into law now has references to consulation and settlment included, native language is now compulsory in schools and the media has a mandate to supply a % of native content.

All of this is fine, but where does it end. The answer is it doesn't. If you give something away it has no value. The only value is how much more you can receive. Everything from airwaves to power generation to fishing rights in sub antartica are now being claimed. Look at the world whaling body to see how this is having an affect. Small polynesioan nations whose whaling consisted of scavenging beached whales are now forcing commercial whaling back into reality because it is their native right to do so.

Australia is on the brink of new legislation that will open the floodgates for claim from the Aborigine people. This is a continuing global trend. In America you have laws priveliging black people in the hope that it will assist them in finding work, you have schoolarships for black people only, etc. In time this will engender racial disharmony from people that cannot apply. Even something as simple as a TV show such as the Cosby's reinforces racial differences. Europe is struggling with an immigrant problem that is putting strain on its resources and welfare abilities. This is causing tension and a resurgence in race based symbolism such as the swastika in France.

People are different, that is ture, and deep down I believe we are still tribal. However we now live in a global village.The only chance, I believe, to avoid a worldwide racial conflict is to stop all race based policy in governement. If you treat all people in your society the same then they will not be able to identify race as the basis for their run of bad luck or whatever they relate too.

As for black people being over represented in crime statistics, that is true globally. In NZ where 16% of the people are Maori, 67% of our prison population is Maori. It's nothing to do with a social barrier that they cannot overcome, it's more a lifestyle choice bought about by laziness. If you don't think crime is a lifestyle choice then so be it, but it is. To say that a person cannot advance through society on their own merits because of race is total hogwash with no statistical information to back it up that cannot be explained by lifestyle. I also think that it is a instinctive thing as well. White people colonised far away countries, black people conquered countries and tribes adjoining them. This forced white people to be more industrious so that they could travel further whereas a black tribe could simply walk.If numbers were against a white colonist, he had to improvise, if numbers were against a black tribe they either lost, went away and got more troops or made an alliance and became merged.

if a race war is likely, then an everyone vs. rednecks war is even more likely.

white people may be pissed off with institutionalized racism (i.e. affirmative action), but saying that there's going to be a race war because of it is a bit of a stretch.

who would initiate this hypothetical race war? blacks or whites?

I think there's a much higher probability of there being a "war" between the two sides of the political isle. Both have become extremely antagonistic towards eachother.

You're right argonak. I'll shoot the first MF that tries to take my guns away, I don't care which side of the political aisle he's on...

PH: Got yo back PH...my nizzle... :D

Seriously, I'm right there with you. Dunedan probably is too.

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I think it will be that:

1) White people once enslaved the world

2) White people are now "sorry"

3) Blacks/Asians/etc demand more than just "sorry", and are reasserting their national identities

4) Asia grows in power, giving their people more power to back their claims. Extremists can now be proud of their country (as opposed to the terrorists, whose countries aren't much to be proud of).

5) Most whites accept this

6) Some whites, seeing this, join the Nazis and demand for "White pride" (and kill blacks/Asians/Arabs/etc).

There's more likely to be a culture war brought on by religious differences in this country.

We are about to see a revolt of several parties, cultures, religions, races and ideologies in this country, because the major political parties have been hard at work driving wedges in between us all for their own benefit.

The only war that deserves recognition in this country, is the war of the citizens against the coming of the new police state, controlled elections, controlled education, controlled monies, robbery of tax payer dollars, and the unchecked power of the executive branch of our current government, that no longer resembles the American system as it was designed, intended, and SIGNED ON TO in the Constitution of the United States of America.

If you look at decades instead of calanders for your patterns you will see that racial discrimination is steadily decreasing. I do not want to get in to the argument as to whether is is felt as much but it is definately not as pronounced in its effects.

With the current minority growth numbers, the racial question is certainly not black/white. Hispanics and Asians are growing much faster than people of African ancestry.

I believe racial prejudice is slow to disintigrate but as our world gets smaller and people become more aware, and cultures mingle more, race will dissappear completely. We are talking a millinium from now true but I believe that is the direction we are taking a lot more than race wars.

Besides what are we calling "war" now? Riots? Sure they pop up every now and then. Actual military coups and an attempted government takeover? Nah.

That is because more outspoken people of all ethnicities in lower income levels are being arrested for non-violent crimes in the "War on Drugs".

It is also more than a coincidence that people of color often end up in the lower wage earning class on average. It is a deep issue, that has many levels, but most spawn from....

Government controlled and funded public education

Government controlled and funded reverse racism policies and laws.

Racial profiling

Government controlled and funded programs like HUD

Media "norm" that is created by Network News Directors


This is all my opinion, but how far off do you think I am?

I blame the NAACP, ATZLAN and the Democrats for fanning the flames of race hatred.. oh yeah and Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson.

Nothing is worse then groups of people that use Race the way these people do. Its disgusting.

Maybe if you'd cite examples that would make your statement seem more credible. Otherwise, it sounds like the usual racist nonsense.

I agree wth 4/5 of that.
<!--QuoteBegin-Mr.Vicchio,
Nothing is worse then groups of people that use Race the way these people do.[/quote]
Yep.

Hey, this whole topic goes without saying.....................
It is painfully true. In my opinion.
Mexicans have been heard saying they are here to "reconquer" their LAND. Yes, some belive this is their land, stolen by us. They dont "love" this country, rather are here to rape it of its jobs, and resources. I would like to think, though that most are here to live in peace and prosper. I hope that is the case with most.
Blacks and whites, however I think have come to an uneasy truce. We are both being outnumbered now, by another race.
There is equal opportunities now, for blacks and whites. Depending on how they present themselves......that is a big part of opportunity.

what about people who use religion as their tool of division, rather than race?