Demand your rights.

[Technosoul]

Don't you think it is about time to start to demand that we do not want to give up our rights based on the Consitution and the Bill of Rights? What the hell are people waiting for? Lets demand they alter the "emergency light" to green and lets demand that all the courts will insure that our rights are not infrenged upon in the slightest degree. Lets demand freedom over some trumped up feeling that we need supervision and inspections of our private acitivities. I am not talking about just debating it, or expressing our right not to agree with the President who will not agree with us. I am talking about the establishment of a major poltical movment towards restoring the power of having rights, which power for the everyday joe has crumbled drastically during the past 5 years.

Where is our passion - have we lost also our guts.

Or else I am going to propose we replace the bald eagle for our symbol with a duck.

[Apeman81]

I’ve been asking the government and the courts to remember that we have the “free exercise thereof” as far as religion is concerned.

And that “the rights of the people shall be infringed” when it comes to firearms.

I also remind them that since a person cannot “be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law”; they can be with due process.

I call to their attentions that “The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.” Thereby negating the courts attempts to “find” new rights in the “penumbras and emanations” of other enumerated rights.

And most importantly, “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.”

Glad to see others are ready to help bring government under control.

[Osborn F Enready]

I am ready, have been ready, and will continue to be ready, in any capacity thereof.

[Scribbler1]

I hate to tell you this, but your "rights" are an illusion. You have these "rights" as long as the government sees no harm in you having them. Before you start slapping me around for saying that, think about it for a moment.

Just a couple of points:

If we had the right of free assembly there would be no fenced cages for protesters during political conventions.
If we had the right to bear arms we could carry a pistol in our pockets legally without needing a permit.
We have the right to own property, until the city wants it so a developer can build a mall.
We have the right to free speech, until you say something that offends somebody, then you're off to court.

Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness doesn't hold up well under strong light.

The Patriot Act was passed without members of Congress actually READING it.

Government spies on it's citizens without oversight for anything it wants to.

The list goes on but I've made my point. There ARE no rights. The only ones we think we have left can (and will) be taken from us under the guise of "protecting" us and there will be a ready supply of brain-dead sheep to DEMAND that the government TAKE these rights. Of course those sheep will balk at the idea of taking away rights THEY happen to like. But that won't be a problem as there will be a DIFFERENT flock of sheep to demand those rights be eliminated.

And this will not change, ever! We are so far deep in the hole the only methods available to cause REAL change will be FAR too ugly for most americans to contemplate. Revolution will receive no support from the masses, who will prefer revolution at the ballot box. The ballot box, however, will be controlled by the very people who will go to any lengths to prevent any meaningful change they themselves do not initiate.

Have a nice day. :)

[underbear1]

I believe the symbol you want is a snake, with the caption, " Don't tread on me"

Here's a bit of "La vie boheme" from RENT

"Draw a line in the sand
then make a stand
use your camera to spar
use your guitar
when they act tough you call their bluff"

[SteveA]

I'd say more accurately that instead of demanding rights, people should simply excersize them and then defend and deter aggressions against them.

Ideally a right shouldn't be something that anyone needs to demand of others, except of course simply a respect for it. So for example, gays don't have a right to demand things from others regarding marriage except a simple respect for whatever privacy they naturally have, just as straight couples don't truly have a right to forcibly demand others treat their marriage in any way other than to not intrude into it.

I recognize this was already implicity meant but the difference between positive rights and negative rights can be subtle at times and when a right becomes something that requires/demands others to labor to provide it then it's not really a right, as it doesn't respect similar rights in others.

Though it does seem a right to demand people change their actions if those are harming you in some unjust manner.

But also something to consider is what methods of unjust coercion are simply imagined and not real, versus true threats or use or force? For example, let's say you feel a right to pay fewer taxes because you oppose funding the war in Iraq ... it might be worth a few phone calls to truly verify whether or not anyone personally is claiming that they'll use force to extract this from you. Now if you do feel there's an obvious enough threat, then yes, you should actively pursue justice in what you feel is wrong and should be free to enlist aid for this too. I recognize I do more talking than actual actions many times ... but we all have different strengths and it seems to me the root problem stems from the tangled knot of social ideas we're raised on ... simply untangling these is a great start. Having a clear picture of what's happening makes avoiding the same mistakes a lot easier. But yes, everyone truly needs to have some point at which they draw the line ... it might only be a very small circle around their core beliefs but noone should be simply chaff in the wind, it helps noone, not even themself to be a ragdoll at the mercy of others.

[underbear1]

If you have the ideal of equality of all your citizens as one of your country's founding concepts, then it does make demands on you, until ALL are treated equally.Either fight for that principal, or strike it from your constitution and bill of rights.

[Zeebadee]

Demand in one hand, crap in the other. See which one fills up first. At the present time, you have more people like Mr V., not only willing, but eager to give up their rights for their Dear Leader's promise of security, than there are people who are willing to take ALL the risks of living under the fundamental restrictions of the Constitution. The ONLY thing the people have to fight with is their vote. Once a politician has that, he couldn't give a shit less about what that citizen wants. Our career politicians count on the fact that the energy required to overcome the inertia of the people to vote them out is greater than the discomfort of the screwing they give the citizens. "If you've got nothing to hide, then you have nothing to worry about" is really not much different than "If you speak kindly of them and never object to what they are doing, they'll leave you alone". You'll never get a significant number of people to demand anything of their government..... they are much more interested in just being left alone.

[Osborn F Enready]

This is why the predictions of people like me, will eventually come true if the sheeple population continues to grow.

As we have heard before....
“Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.”
-John F. Kennedy, 1962

“America is at that awkward stage; it's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards.”
-Claire Wolfe, 1995-Nov

“This country is a one-party country. Half of it is called Republican and half is called Democrat. It doesn't make any difference. All the really good ideas belong to the Libertarians.”
-Hugh Downs, 1997

“Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And... moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.”
-Barry Goldwater, Acceptance Speech at the Republican Convention; 1964

“Reason obeys itself; and ignorance does whatever is dictated to it.”
-Thomas Paine, Rights of Man ("Conclusion")

“the individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists.”
-J. Edgar Hoover, 1956, speaking of communism

“In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
-George Orwell

“Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no Constitution, no Law, no Court can save it...Where do you stand Citizen?”
-Judge Learned Hand (1961)

“To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.”
-Thomas Jefferson

“And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the right of resistance? Let them take arms...The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.”
-Thomas Jefferson

[SteveA]

Nice quotes there, Osborn. Thanks for posting them.

[Forseti]

The federal government has gone out of control. The states have no more true rights. Corporations buy congressmen and senators. And the Tax system is far to complicated for any one, but the educated in such matters or the rich (people that can afford CPA’s and such). I believe the fact that you don’t really own your property was also brought up. The reliance on fossil fuels is a direct threat to national security.

I say more states rights. A flat consumption tax for the feds. Decrease the feds size and increase the local and state government powers. I for one like the idea of my neighbor and not some politician on the east coast determining my laws. These ideals will not come to pass unless some serious actions take place. I am joining my city council and getting involved with local matters first. Also I am going to try to put together some public speeches and forums at the local college. Also when I hear people discussing politics I get involved in the conversation. Any action small or grand will have an affect. These are suggestions that you may decide to use or not too. Whether you agree with my politics or not, just keep active whether on a personnel level with those around you or the community in which you live in. Diversity of thought is key. If enough people get involved we may have something.


Oh ya another good quote: “Those that sacrifice freedom for safety deserve neither” Benjamin Franklin or Thomas Jefferson, I believe.

[Technosoul]

Quote by: underbear1 I believe the symbol you want is a snake, with the caption, " Don't tread on me" Here's a bit of "La vie boheme" from RENT "Draw a line in the sand then make a stand use your camera to spar use your guitar when they act tough you call their bluff"

You are right, they eagle that is swooping down on the snake - not sure which one will win but treading on snake is not a good idea. I guess the new symbol will be Daffy Duck swooping down on a snail. Quack! How about that? Thanks for reminding me of the "don't tread on me" flag they used to use.

[underbear1]

The new symbol is a sheep, the Christian Reich doesn't call their followers flocks for NUTHIN' !

[Keith Hamburger]

Quote by: underbear1 I believe the symbol you want is a snake, with the caption, " Don't tread on me"

OK. I had to get me a new avatar. Had that flying on my house during the first Gulf War. I misplaced the flag. I think I need to get a new one.

When it was flying I had occaision for the police to come by a couple of times. They always sent two cars.

Keith

bwt ... It is called the Gadsden Flag.

[SteveA]

Hey, wouldn't a porcupine would be a great libertarian symbol?! ... oops, it's taken already

[Technosoul]

Quote by: underbear1 The new symbol is a sheep, the Christian Reich doesn't call their followers flocks for NUTHIN' !

Okay then a flock of seagulls swoop down on the bugs that are threatening the Mormon sheep. Nay - I think I will remian poltical on this topic - don't want to discriminate on someone for their religious titles. In the old days Moses could toss his staff down on the ground it it would turn into a deadly snake, that did not really impress the king of Eqypt much. So I doubt if such symbolism would work on our heads of state ether.

How did I get off on this road anyway?