Condoleezza Rice

[PatrickHenry]

The big fat liar is at it again:
http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/sto...&w=AFP&coview=
Claiming the US doesn't use torture or ship people off to be tortured elsewhere:

US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice insisted yet again that the United States did not use torture, but urged understanding of the methods needed to fight terrorism, calling it "a different kind of war". "We don't send people to be tortured," Rice said in an interview with Britain's Sky News television on the first full day of a European trip, during which she faces intense pressure over claims about the US treatment of terrorist suspects. Reports and rights groups have alleged that Central Intelligence Agency-chartered flights have covertly transported terror suspects around the world for interrogation, a process known as "rendition". Washington is accused of having secret detention centres in foreign countries, including in Eastern Europe, at which some suspects have been allegedly mistreated or tortured. Rice has repeatedly insisted that no suspects are mistreated, telling Sky News: "We are not using the air space or the airports of any of our partners for activities that would lead renditions to torture."

This on the very same day that Khaled al-Masri filed his lawsuit against the CIA for that very thing. http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/12/....ap/index.html And guess what? This isn't a new story!! It has been tracked by CBS 60 Minutes for over a year now.

So Condi Rice is still in the same deadly perfidious role as the Administration's paid shill of a liar. And you think the world can't see what a mockery of justice this is? Here's the US highest diplomat, representing the integrity of the US, lying through her teeth while the true stories of kidnapping and torture occupy the front page. Unbelievable!!

[shield772]

Oh and seeking money from the deep pockets of the US government couldn't possibly be a motive for lying right (noted sarcasm was intended)

[gr8fuldaniel]

They redefined "torture". Its called "Enhanced Interrogation" now. Its not torture, even though the human rights violations are the same as before, what they call it is different.

[PatrickHenry]

Quote by: shield772 Oh and seeking money from the deep pockets of the US government couldn't possibly be a motive for lying right (noted sarcasm was intended)

You talking about Al-Masri with the accusation about "seeking money", shield? You saying Al-Masri wasn't detained as he said he was?

[shield772]

Didn't say he wasn't detained.

[RickSp]

Quote by: shield772 Didn't say he wasn't detained.

So you are blaming the victim of torture? It is his fault that he was kidnapped and tortured?

That is really twisted.

[shield772]

No I'm saying maybe he wasn't tortured. He does have a monitary stake in saying he was, which I don't understand he's NOT an American Citizen. and we didn't arrest him.

Al-Masri, 42, was born in Kuwait to Lebanese parents and moved to Germany in 1985. The married father of five said that on New Year's Eve 2003 he boarded a bus in his hometown of Neu-Ulm for a holiday in Macedonia. At the border he was stopped by Macedonian authorities and his passport was confiscated. He said he was detained by local authorities for 23 days and then handed over to what he believes was a team of CIA operatives.

[PatrickHenry]

You need to cite your source for any quote, Shield.

[shield772]

I'm sorry same CNN report from above. I assumed you all had read it and knew of it's contents.

[PatrickHenry]

Cite your sources or say from the above source...That's the etiquette. So that others will know where to look for context...

[gr8fuldaniel]

This is a good read.
Robert F Kennedy Jr:

The White House's Tortured Definition of Torture The White House announced today that Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice will deliver a comprehensive address on the issues of torture on her European trip this week. But anyone interested in a glimpse of the elaborate rationale that the White House has constructed for evading application of the "t" word can review Attorney General Alberto Gonzales' speech to the Council on Foreign Relations on Thursday night. "We are not going to torture, period," said Gonzales compellingly. He claimed that the president has told him that "even in a situation where you have custody of someone who might have the launch codes of an atomic bomb that's about to go off in Washington D.C. and may kill millions of Americans and that person has the information that may save millions of lives, the president has said we're not going to torture…We don't believe in torture, and we're not going to engage in torture." Gonzales said all federal government employees were aware of the policy and he dismissed the Abu Ghraib atrocities as the acts of a handful of bad apples on the prison's night shift. "The day shift didn't engage in that kind of conduct." So far so good. But when asked by Carroll Bogert of Human Rights Watch whether the administration considered "waterboarding" to be torture, Gonzales refused to answer. "I'm not going to get into a discussion about specific methods of questioning people who have information that may save American lives." No wonder the troops are confused. If the Attorney General won't say what constitutes torture then how is the night shift at Abu Ghraib supposed to know? Gonzales added, somewhat discordantly, that although he could not share the particulars of the administration's secret definition of torture, everyone in the federal government was already thoroughly aware of those details. "I'm not going to talk about specific methods that are used by the United States government. What I can say is that everyone in the United State government understands what our legal obligations are." The Attorney General's demurral opens up a loophole large enough for Torquemada to ride through on a wagonload of Iron Maidens, breaking wheels and thumbscrews. President Bush has promised to veto the Defense Authorization Bill if it contains language submitted by Senator John McCain prohibiting "cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment of persons in the detention of the U.S. government." This language would apparently unacceptably narrow the category of behavior that the administration considers permissible under its secret definition of torture. Gonzales added that the president and Vice President Cheney, who has been leading the charge against the McCain Amendment, are in "100 percent" agreement on their objectives. In sum, the White House's policy which we can expect Condi to elaborate "comprehensively" is "we don't torture because we choose not to call it torture and we will fight all efforts to define torture according to its ordinary meaning."

[Ceyaotl]

Well I wonder how many other countries follow our lead? If they do then maybe we can capture more terrorist cells. If they (captured terrorist) give up their info from this tactic of extraction then we have accomplished the mission. American and other lives are saved. I don't care about what a terrorist feels. When we turn them over to India or others they soon understand how good they had it with us. Condi Knows what’s a stake as does the President and life or death when it comes to the life of any American soldier or civilian is worth it. Compassion be damned. I think that is why it is called "war".

[Ceyaotl]

Quote by: commonsense Dr.Rice, U.S. Secretary of State, ranks high among the most accomplished in politics today. At a time when voting for a candidate has meant choosing the lesser of two evils, Dr. Rice presents a truly principled selection. She speaks many languages and has represented the U.S. successfully in the most difficult cultural situations with universally accepted diplomacy, and worldwide acceptance, respect and popularity. Her views on the sanctity and preservation of 2nd Ammendment rights are rooted in her personal familial experience in escaping slavery via the Underground Railroad and in defending against Ku Klux Klan terrorism targeting black voters. Being a Black woman, her successful candidacy and support from principled Americans of all political persuasions, male or female, would put an end for all time the perceived injustices stemming from politicization by both sides, before or after the Civil Rights Movement; Her candidacy would dissolve the artificial and contrived divisiveness perpetuated on college campuses which only serves to benefit career politicians, bureaucrats, social engineers and so-called "educators" who are the only ones who benefit from cultivating Americans seeing themselves only as members of "groups" with their own agenda: dependent upon---or beholden to---those govt administrators who created or fomented their condition in the first place... A Condi Rice candidacy could go a long way toward forever uniting and restoring this nation under its founding principles of personal freedom, property rights, contract law and constitutionally limited government and taxation. There is a grass-roots movement afoot to draft and nominate Condi Rice without the dubiousness of big-money contributions that mark every other national campaign. Wouldn't it be truly hopeful and inspiring for the future of this country, the world's first to be united not under ethnicity, but under the shared and mutually beneficial principles of limiting the historically-proven tendency of all governments to grow and become controlling, usurping and over-reaching into its "subjects" lives? Wouldn't it be hopeful and inspiring to elect a true public servant who silently and without ego answers the call of duty once drafted into running for office out of reason and necessity, and not pursue office solely for career, or worse, out of condescending, elitist, self-serving totalitarian ideas? http://www.americansforrice.com/bumper_stickers.htm Dr. Rice does not espouse many of my political ideals, but as an American who "stereotypically" would be considered by the ignorant to automatically oppose someone like her, I feel I must not be alone in supporting this fine American for her superiority to all others who might compete with her. It may seem early to consider presidential candidates for 2008, but investigating the record and beliefs of this impressive American should cast the light of truth on all politicians, for Dr. Rice seems truly unique in her sincerity and dedication and lack of prejudice.

Nice! I read this as well and fully agree. Not one Liberal can touch her. They can not hold one candle to her. Her fresh approach to issues is a new look at a new Republican Party that could very well transpire in 2008. Liberals have no Ideas and definitely no good Idea on how to deal with Terrorism or the economy. Condi has proven she can run an operation and deal with the World.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Ceyaotl If they (captured terrorist) give up their info from this tactic of extraction then we have accomplished the mission

Even if the "info" gathered is only that they are fighting western imperialism. That they resent being occupied?

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Ceyaotl Liberals have no Ideas and definitely no good Idea on how to deal with Terrorism or the economy.

You mean how to commit terrorism and steal the national treasure?

Funny how you guys twist words around. "Torture is not torture" ----Reich-Wing Dictionary

[Ceyaotl]

Quote by: carriew i would vote for her!

YES! She is the one. Black woman, tough and conservative, single and accomplish on her own. Her resume is unbeatable by women or men. She has broken the glass ceiling and give young Black women hope and motivation. With all the lies the Liberals try to stick her with they never stick. They claim she had a spooky memo etc but they have nothing. Tinfoil is definitely in short supply as the Libs keep going with the spooky stories about her and the President.

[Boetie]

The pathetic thing about this country is that it is so oblivion to reality. Has it occurred to anyone that due to the indiscriminate bombings and shootings we do over there, it may cause someone to grief and shout out, "Now I swear, by all I hold to be sacred, to be avenged! This indignity shall be wiped out with blood!"

To which this someone attempts such avenge only to be arrested and tortured. Not because that someone is a terrorist, but rather that someone is a griefing father or son.

America is the most calloused nation. We don't consider our kills to be people, we consider them to be collateral damage, we are totally detached from reality.

[Ceyaotl]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel You mean how to commit terrorism and steal the national treasure? Funny how you guys twist words around. "Torture is not torture" ----Reich-Wing Dictionary

I never said "Torture is not torture" you did. The method of extracting information is just that, a method and if it works guess what? we use it. I know you would rather sit and reason with terrorist and try to get them to understand. You think we should try to understand "why do they hate us so much?" Well you go right ahead. I'll take extraction over kissing up any day.

So you are on record as say that Condi this President and our soldiers in harms way from the CIA to the trooper in the field are commiting terrorism and stealing from the people? Tipical Liberal and all around hater.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Ceyaotl ...Libs keep going with the spooky stories about her and the President

You mean her own words "My Husband"?

[Ceyaotl]

Quote by: Boetie The pathetic thing about this country is that it is so oblivion to reality. Has it occurred to anyone that due to the indiscriminate bombings and shootings we do over there, it may cause someone to grief and shout out, "Now I swear, by all I hold to be sacred, to be avenged! This indignity shall be wiped out with blood!" To which this someone attempts such avenge only to be arrested and tortured. Not because that someone is a terrorist, but rather that someone is a griefing father or son. America is the most calloused nation. We don't consider our kills to be people, we consider them to be collateral damage, we are totally detached from reality.

That looks like a good seen from a play and maybe it has happened but the fact of the matter is there is a mission and a method to the madness. If one can not see that the terrorist are the ones that are to blame then they are the misled and they are at fault for not seeking the entire truth of the matter. As people we make choices everyday to support this or that, we have all lost a loved one or been hurt at some point in our lives but that does not excuse poor choices.

The fact of the matter is we are not the most calloused. Every country even terrorist have the collateral damage concept it has been that way for thousands of years. You should really read more history. Why aren't you condemning the homicide bombers that have killed hundreds of Iraqi civilians, Iraqi police and soldiers? Not to mention our own soldiers. You would do well to keep those kinds of comments in perspective. The only Iraqis that don't want us there are the former Saddam supporters and thugs.