your all pinko commies

[mooseboy84]

basiclly, most americas are commies. i would be willing to bet that 90% of all americans are communist.

they love socialism. i love it. we all love it.

if we lived in utopia, capitalism would work. at least pure capitalism as explained by ludwig van mises. but, we dont and capitalism doesnt function as he invisioned it. on the flip side, if we lived in utopia, communism as described by karl marx would work, but that sure in the hell hasnt worked. since we live in a state of somewhere in between, thats what we have.

i always find it hilarious when i hear people on tv or radio say that americas becoming a socialist nation.... lol. its already is and has been one.

because of the cold war, socialism was demonized. [well what russia had going wasnt all that grand.] anyway, since then socialism has been a dirty word. if you asked most americans do they "support socialism"...... i would say at least 70-80% would say No.

however, if you asked americans should public schools be abolished as well as social security, i would venture that 90% would say NO.
the problem is not socialism, its semantics and the way ideas are portrayed. most americans realise they want plubic schools, state universitys + colleges and free hospitals. im sure the majority of americans want free healthcare for that matter, but somehow a distiction is drawn between all that stuff and evil "socialism".

i belive there is sort an an "Lafeure Curve" of socialism and a point at which a nation crosses the line from a capitalist economy, to being a totally communistic sate [minus the Totalitarinism]. america is no where near that line.

i get annoyed when i hear people on radio and tv talk about the evils of socialism and how bad it is and the ditto heads just eating up, not being able to comprehend that they are a great benifactor of socialism.

yes i belive that capitalism brings the most wealth and prosperity to the great number of people possible. i also feel that it the best economic policy because its commonsensical in its practices, but i also like those "entitlements" like public universitys and hospitals.

[RebelWithanAK]

MAN, but that's a thoroughly unresearched post. You're almost as bad as Castille and Impenitent.

[mooseboy84]

what research do i need for an anecdot? thats opinion, but it is factual. if you asked most people in the usa abstractly do they support "socialism" you would get a resounding no.

when you explain it for people too dense to comprehend the subject in terms they could understand, then you would get a yes.

the majority of people in usa want public education. they want there subsidised state colleges and univeristies. they want there county hospitals to remain open. and most [especially older people] want social secuirty, medicare and now, perscription drugs. face the facts, they want socialism. dress it up with any title you like, but thats socialism.

most republicans and certainly all democrats want socialism.

Do you think that 1 US senator or house member would run on a platform to end social security? I mean they could, but as for getting elected...... thats another issue. Can you name any member of senate that have stated they want an end to the statist social security administration? what about our good ol boy trent lott? how much farm aid is he going to send to mississippi this year?

[Mathieu]

That's social-democracy, not socialism.

[Leopard]

mooseboy,
I agree with you that we basically have alot of socialist institutions in the US and that people don't understand that.

the only difference I have with you is in this statement you make:

i get annoyed when i hear people on radio and tv talk about the evils of socialism and how bad it is and the ditto heads just eating up, not being able to comprehend that they are a great benifactor of socialism.

there are few 'benefactors of any socialistic policy, and those few will be the ones in positions of power and their friends in business...

no one benefits from the overall effects of socialism, we all suffer tremendously

[Anniee]

Yes, this country is very socialistic in its fiscal policies and so forth. Nothing to be proud of there. We daily have our money stolen to fund the machinery.

Mooseboy, Ludwig von Mises was right; and it doesn't depend, as you so ridiculously claim, on living in "utopia." What it depends on is enforcement of common law, which boils down to enforcing contracts (Do all you have agreed to do) and not encroaching upon other persons or their property. It works exactly as he said, provided common law is adhered to in order that people's genuine rights aren't trampled upon.

What you are really saying is that it depends on people being perfect and good, which clearly it does not, as already stated above. I take it that was what you were really saying about communism too - the only problem is that communism really DOES require people to be angelic and utterly unselfish - all of them - and to loathe liberty and independence. That is indeed never going to happen; socialism/communism goes against all of human nature.

Here's something to think about (I didn't read the rest of your rant since it wasn't making sense) - if people are bad (and they are) and thus can not be left to their own devices (so long as they aren't harming others) because they can not be trusted to handle their own affairs, on what POSSIBLE grounds would you believe that these SAME PEOPLE should be put in charge of the affairs of the rest?

[mooseboy84]

</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Anniee,)
Yes, this country is very socialistic in its fiscal policies and so forth. Nothing to be proud of there. We daily have our money stolen to fund the machinery.

Mooseboy, Ludwig von Mises was right; and it doesn't depend, as you so ridiculously claim, on living in "utopia." What it depends on is enforcement of common law, which boils down to enforcing contracts (Do all you have agreed to do) and not encroaching upon other persons or their property. It works exactly as he said, provided common law is adhered to in order that people's genuine rights aren't trampled upon.

What you are really saying is that it depends on people being perfect and good, which clearly it does not, as already stated above. I take it that was what you were really saying about communism too - the only problem is that communism really DOES require people to be angelic and utterly unselfish - all of them - and to loathe liberty and independence. That is indeed never going to happen; socialism/communism goes against all of human nature.

Here's something to think about (I didn't read the rest of your rant since it wasn't making sense) - if people are bad (and they are) and thus can not be left to their own devices (so long as they aren't harming others) because they can not be trusted to handle their own affairs, on what POSSIBLE grounds would you believe that these SAME PEOPLE should be put in charge of the affairs of the rest?<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>


are you telling me public education is bad? the reason usa is the nation it is, is because of public education. millions of educated people that went to schools subsidised by tax payers. those people went to state colleges that in many cases were all free 40-50 years ago. they got educations, started businesses and turned america into the advanced nation it is today.

are you telling me all those people were not helped by free education? the reason some many jobs are going to india, is because 50 years ago Nehru invest alot of money in technical schools to educate the brightest of india, in a hope they would build india into a better country.

i dont belive "socialism goes against human nature". if it did we would live in a state of perpetual anarchy and feudalism.

[mooseboy84]

for the people who dislike socialism and think its so bad, they should look at africa. many african nations are probably the only places that have pure capitalism.

lets take a country like Botswana for example. if you dont have food to eat, you die. there are no public schools and the majority of the people are illiterate. theres no widespread electricity throughout the nation and not that many paved roads. The few hospitals in the nation have no capacity to serve the people with any thing very beyond basic medical services. there are not many regulations on people that do business. Botswana is a pure capitalist nation. Would you like to live there? im sure they dont have gun control either.