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Geoff332 · Sep 17, 2003, 06:47 am

So you will die without music?

G. Adams · Sep 17, 2003, 07:03 am

No, but you may lose a reason to live.

Geoff332 · Sep 17, 2003, 07:31 am

So, if it's not a necessity, then everything you've said about capital ownership and property rights doesn't apply to things used to make music?

G. Adams · Sep 17, 2003, 10:30 am

well this was a hole I dug myself into. *coughs* maybe your right...

RebelWithanAK · Sep 17, 2003, 12:07 pm

I'd much rather a guitar in every living room and live performers in every venue than a stack of CDs from the 50 top artists of this moment, but that's just me.

G. Adams · Sep 17, 2003, 02:59 pm

I have a guitar in my living room, but I suck, as does everyone else in the house. So if your expecting me to listen to myself playing 3 chords and the opening notes of RHCP otherside, you've got another thing coming.

RebelWithanAK · Sep 17, 2003, 04:53 pm

And the reason you suck is because you never practice, and the reason you never practice is because you spent your life listening to CDs and cassettes of pop artists playing all the music you ever wanted to hear instead of making your own damned music - which was my point about commercial music taking over non-commercial music.

C'mon, G. Adams; music is the most universal aspect of all human life. Go with the flow.

G. Adams · Sep 17, 2003, 08:11 pm

Quote:

Originally posted by RebelWithanAK@09-17-2003 04:53 PM
And the reason you suck is because you never practice, and the reason you never practice is because you spent your life listening to CDs and cassettes of pop artists playing all the music you ever wanted to hear instead of making your own damned music - which was my point about commercial music taking over non-commercial music.

C'mon, G. Adams; music is the most universal aspect of all human life. Go with the flow.

The reason I don't practice is because I suck, and the cycle goes on. I have no natural talent with my guitar, and it would take a lot of practice to get at least listenable. I can play keyboard pretty good mind if I'm given enough time to practice. Hopefully they'll pair me with some mariachi at my uni.

Scribbler1 · Nov 15, 2003, 02:47 am

All I know is that this computer I use is mine. I worked for the money to buy it, and sometimes people pay me to write things with it. I use that money to get things I ordinarily couldn't build or grow. I don't know crap about Communism but I know if I exchange my time and effort for money and use that to buy a computer and occasionally make a buck with it to provide me with things I need. I own the money I worked for (after taxes) and I own the computer I bought with it, and everything I write on it belongs to me unless I say otherwise. If that's capitalism, then it works for me, and most of the rest of the world too.

If someone sells words and another sells music it belongs to them. If they want to share or give it away, the decision is up to them, no one else.
I think the focus of this discussion has shifted too far from huge corporations which make millions off others intellectual property, which is the big problem. If you don't like a book or a CD, don't buy it, that's all. I bitch about price all the time, and I'll be damned if I have to take out a second mortgage to buy a pair of Stones tickets, so some things I don't buy.

On the other hand, the RIAA is only bitching because they want to make more money while producing nothing. Screw 'em.

G. Adams · Nov 15, 2003, 12:50 pm

Communists aren't coming to take your tellies or pc's. We want the means of production shared, and democratically controlled. Thats the most premise of it.

greendeath · Dec 5, 2003, 04:42 am

Im going to disagree with GreatWyrm as I normally do.

I'm so sorry for "stealing the retirement" of someone who has accumulated millions of dollars, and decided to blow it on heroin, prostitues, a house that is too big for them, or a bunch of cars that are not even street-legal. It's not my fault most musicians are too stupid to know how to save their money for a rainy day.

castille · Dec 5, 2003, 08:57 am

Actually, have you noticed when most musicians/artists/actors/singers lose their jobs, they instantly become homeless?

Its amazing they deserve any money....they don't even know how to save it. Give some crazy movie director $100 and he'll buy drugs, give Bill Gates $100 and he'll return you $1000.

G. Adams · Dec 5, 2003, 10:04 am

</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (castille)
Give some crazy movie director $100 and he'll buy drugs, give Bill Gates $100 and he'll return you $1000. <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

And then give the money back, and get 10k. And again for 100k. And on and on till your dead. Or give that money to a burgeoning director and he may create a piece of art that will enrich your life and millions of others.

Sep 17, 2003, 07:03 am	#42 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	No, but you may lose a reason to live. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Sep 17, 2003, 10:30 am	#44 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	well this was a hole I dug myself into. coughs maybe your right... Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Sep 17, 2003, 12:07 pm	#45 (permalink) (top)
RebelWithanAK Igneous Magma Location: New York City Posts: 739	I'd much rather a guitar in every living room and live performers in every venue than a stack of CDs from the 50 top artists of this moment, but that's just me. . . . whenever any government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such forms as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

Sep 17, 2003, 02:59 pm	#46 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	I have a guitar in my living room, but I suck, as does everyone else in the house. So if your expecting me to listen to myself playing 3 chords and the opening notes of RHCP otherside, you've got another thing coming. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Sep 17, 2003, 04:53 pm	#47 (permalink) (top)
RebelWithanAK Igneous Magma Location: New York City Posts: 739	And the reason you suck is because you never practice, and the reason you never practice is because you spent your life listening to CDs and cassettes of pop artists playing all the music you ever wanted to hear instead of making your own damned music - which was my point about commercial music taking over non-commercial music. C'mon, G. Adams; music is the most universal aspect of all human life. Go with the flow. . . . whenever any government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute a new government, laying its foundations on such principles and organizing its powers in such forms as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

Sep 17, 2003, 06:47 am	#41 (permalink) (top)
Geoff332 Igneous Magma Location: New Zealand Posts: 309	So you will die without music?

Sep 17, 2003, 07:31 am	#43 (permalink) (top)
Geoff332 Igneous Magma Location: New Zealand Posts: 309	So, if it's not a necessity, then everything you've said about capital ownership and property rights doesn't apply to things used to make music?

Nov 15, 2003, 02:47 am	#49 (permalink) (top)
Scribbler1 Skeptical Patriot Posts: 7,746	All I know is that this computer I use is mine. I worked for the money to buy it, and sometimes people pay me to write things with it. I use that money to get things I ordinarily couldn't build or grow. I don't know crap about Communism but I know if I exchange my time and effort for money and use that to buy a computer and occasionally make a buck with it to provide me with things I need. I own the money I worked for (after taxes) and I own the computer I bought with it, and everything I write on it belongs to me unless I say otherwise. If that's capitalism, then it works for me, and most of the rest of the world too. If someone sells words and another sells music it belongs to them. If they want to share or give it away, the decision is up to them, no one else. I think the focus of this discussion has shifted too far from huge corporations which make millions off others intellectual property, which is the big problem. If you don't like a book or a CD, don't buy it, that's all. I bitch about price all the time, and I'll be damned if I have to take out a second mortgage to buy a pair of Stones tickets, so some things I don't buy. On the other hand, the RIAA is only bitching because they want to make more money while producing nothing. Screw 'em. Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

Nov 15, 2003, 12:50 pm	#50 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	Communists aren't coming to take your tellies or pc's. We want the means of production shared, and democratically controlled. Thats the most premise of it. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill

Dec 5, 2003, 04:42 am	#51 (permalink) (top)
greendeath Molten Ash Posts: 47	Im going to disagree with GreatWyrm as I normally do. I'm so sorry for "stealing the retirement" of someone who has accumulated millions of dollars, and decided to blow it on heroin, prostitues, a house that is too big for them, or a bunch of cars that are not even street-legal. It's not my fault most musicians are too stupid to know how to save their money for a rainy day.

Dec 5, 2003, 08:57 am	#52 (permalink) (top)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	Actually, have you noticed when most musicians/artists/actors/singers lose their jobs, they instantly become homeless? Its amazing they deserve any money....they don't even know how to save it. Give some crazy movie director $100 and he'll buy drugs, give Bill Gates $100 and he'll return you $1000. Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

Dec 5, 2003, 10:04 am	#53 (permalink) (top)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,152	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (castille) Give some crazy movie director $100 and he'll buy drugs, give Bill Gates $100 and he'll return you $1000. <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> And then give the money back, and get 10k. And again for 100k. And on and on till your dead. Or give that money to a burgeoning director and he may create a piece of art that will enrich your life and millions of others. Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery. Winston Churchill