Retaliation: Muslims Burn The US Constitution

[gr8fuldaniel]

Dont forget, Congress decided NOT to ask Bush for an exit strategy. Perpetual war is good for business. It creates an atmosphere ripe for stealing.

[rmnunez]

There are lots of unquantifiable benefits to intervention in Iraq. Obviously it indicates capability, US military power projection was amazing, all in less than 90 days. It also secured a definite beachhead smack-dab in the middle of the terrorist neighborhood, halfway between Teheran and Riyahd, Damascus and Beirut, within a military stone throw of Cairo and Aman too, this is a great advantage. Saddam was an awful tyrant no matter how you slice it. When they get done we will know hundreds of thousands were killed for ethnic reasons, we already know he dried up and scattered in destitution the Marsh Arabs and their Garden of Eden, whole Kurdish towns were routinely gassed as they were driven into the mountains. Whole families of dissidents fled to Europe, the devout in Iranian exile. The region is of vital importance due to its oil, two major oil producers in the region had been attacked by Saddam, he added instability to the region and maintained a large and well-equipped military force.

Additionally there was all this stuff with the WMDs. If it was a hoax wholly concocted by Bush we've all been taken, but if there was albeit unfounded suspicion, to do nothing about it would have been worse. In fact Saddam was interested in WMDs and spent a great deal of time, money and effort trying to improve his military arsenal. He sought nuclear, chemical and biological weapons and the technology to deliver these by missiles and aircraft over a great distance. The evidence doesn't support the magnitude of the claims, but was this known from the get go? Did Bush order troops into battle in NBC gear during the hot season across the Sumerian deserts knowing Iraq had no such weapons? Had Bush, having confronted Saddam with his suspicions, disputed Blix´s conclusions, sent Powell posing with pictures, then backed down despite still not knowing what we now do, what would you conclude -that Saddam had or didn't have WMDs? And if your conclusion would have then been as mine (that he did have some) wouldn't you read into Bushian accomodation tolerance for such an arsenal in others (for example Iran or DPRK)?

[tinybear]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel Not at this price! It could end up costing trillions of dollars and millions of lives. All for a fucking lie.

Saddam is gone not just for 'a fucking lie' as you have put it. Saddam is gone along with this tyrannical, lawless, barbaric, genocidal policies towards the Iraqis and good riddance to that!

[jose]

Quote by: tinybear Jose> Please. No fairy tale conspiracy theories, OK? :)

well here are the links again if you´d care to read them and comment on the content,and maybe post some alternative links i´ll read them too
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/hijackers.html

FBI Admits: No Evidence Links 'Hijackers' to 9-11
http://www.americanfreepress.net/05..._evidence_.html

[Matt W]

Saddam is gone along with this tyrannical, lawless, barbaric, genocidal policies towards the Iraqis and good riddance to that!

Ah, long live the US and it's vision of a 'free world'. Who's next, tb? Perhaps your allies, Uzbeckistan? Deposing 'tyrants' is all well and good - but thinking people love you for it is naiive in the extreme.

[RickSp]

Quote by: tinybear Saddam is gone not just for 'a fucking lie' as you have put it. Saddam is gone along with this tyrannical, lawless, barbaric, genocidal policies towards the Iraqis and good riddance to that!

You mean the Saddam we supported for all those years while he committed the worst of his genocide? We have booted him, so now we kill tens of thousands of civilians and destroy a country while getting tens of thousands of our troops killed or maimed. And we provide a training ground for new terrorists. The Russian invasion of Afhanistan created AlQueda. Who knows what horrors will be created by our invasion of Iraq.

The justifications for this war were all lies, regardless of whether or not the war mongers have the honesty to admit it.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: tinybear Saddam is gone not just for 'a fucking lie' as you have put it. Saddam is gone along with this tyrannical, lawless, barbaric, genocidal policies towards the Iraqis and good riddance to that!

It isnt gone, just replaced by our own "tyrannical, lawless, barbaric, genocidal policies towards the Iraqis"

[tinybear]

Oh don't be ridiculous, daniel.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: tinybear Oh don't be ridiculous, daniel.

Just the facts.

How does Condi Rice feel about our war on Islam?

SECRETARY RICE: Right. Well, I, frankly, think it's appalling that this story got out....

Not that it happened, but that it was exposed. God I hate these people. Licensed Murderers Suck

[Starboy]

Quote by: tinybear I don't expect this will provoke violent reactions from Americans though, do you?

Wouldn't it be funny if our official reaction is that we are glad to see that they at least have some form of free speech if not an extensive form of free speech.

Starboy

[tinybear]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel Just the facts. How does Condi Rice feel about our war on Islam? Not that it happened, but that it was exposed. God I hate these people. Licensed Murderers Suck

What facts are you talking about? The USA's occupation of Iraq could have been handled a lot better but we're not deliberate killers, we don't do genocide and we are faciltating a democratically elected government (hey if the sunnis don't wanna participate, it's their choice). If you can't see the difference between us and Saddam, there's something seriously wrong with your eyes. I suggest you try opening them.

[fedfem]

Quote by: tinybear What facts are you talking about? The USA's occupation of Iraq could have been handled a lot better but we're not deliberate killers, we don't do genocide and we are faciltating a democratically elected government (hey if the sunnis don't wanna participate, it's their choice). If you can't see the difference between us and Saddam, there's something seriously wrong with your eyes. I suggest you try opening them.

Who is "us"? If you mean the United States...

Some of us are indeed deliberate killers, torturers, bigots, religious fanatics.

[tinybear]

Yeah 'us'=the USA and we only deliberately kill terrorists. Don't see anything wrong with that, do you? You wanna see something wrong, look no further than the Iraqi insurgents who kill their own compatriots:

Suicide bombers target crowds of Iraqis, kill 21

By Haider Abbas
HILLA, Iraq (Reuters) - Two suicide bombers strapped with explosives blew themselves up among crowds of Iraqis in the mainly Shi'ite town of Hilla south of Baghdad Monday, killing at least 21 people and wounding 34, police said.

The first attacker detonated his bomb among Iraqis waiting at a medical center where police, army and civil service recruits get check-ups before being hired, police said.

A second bomber blew himself up shortly afterwards among a crowd of police commandos protesting to demand higher wages.

Insurgents have stepped up suicide attacks and ambushes over the past month, killing more than 700 Iraqis since a new Shi'ite-led cabinet was announced on April 28.

http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/sto...20050529BAG17D

[Matt W]

the Iraqi insurgents who kill their own compatriots:

By their logic, they're killing collaboraters. Much like every guerilla force has done since the beginning of time. Tell me, does the US have the death penalty for traitors? This is much the same...in their book!

[tinybear]

Matt, they're Sunnis killing Shiites. The Sunnis chose to boycott democratic elections to which they were NOT excluded, but instead opted to blow up those who decided that voting to chose their own leaders was a good idea. Below is an extract from the article I posted above:

"Washington has been encouraging the Shi'ite and Kurdish blocs that emerged strongest from the January polls to involve more Sunni Arabs in the drafting of a permanent constitution, the next step on Iraq's path to democracy.

Sunni Arabs dominated Iraq during Saddam's rule but won only 17 seats in Iraq's 275-member parliament because many Sunni groups boycotted the elections and violence in Sunni Arab areas meant turnout there was extremely low. "

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: tinybear What facts are you talking about? The USA's occupation of Iraq could have been handled a lot better but we're not deliberate killers,

Thats my point. Iraq should never have been "handled" to begin with. It doesnt matter how wonderfully we killed them. We are tresspassing from day one. We committed premeditated, unprovoked mass murder. No delicate way of wording it will undo our crimes against humanity.

Quote by: tinybear we don't do genocide and we are faciltating a democratically elected government (hey if the sunnis don't wanna participate, it's their choice).

We wiped out well over 100,000 innocent Iraqi CITIZENS. Bombing raids on residential areas, hospitals etc., are all gross infractions of international policies we used to love and obey, before these pirates stole our country and steered our military into wars for profit and genocide. As for democracy in the middle east, hows that really going? We dont have democracy here so how can we transmit what we dont have? Puppet regimes are not democratic, so get over it.

The difference between us and Saddam? You mean who is the best at torturing and raping the accused? I dont think Saddam signed Geneva Conventions, but we did and we should act like it. The crimes at abu Ghraib were wrong before we got there and worse after we got there. Because we pretended to be the good guys. The Iraqis couldnt really defend against us we are the wolves, they are the sheep.
If you cant see this, maybe you need to open your eyes, little bear.

[fedfem]

Quote by: tinybear Matt, they're Sunnis killing Shiites. The Sunnis chose to boycott democratic elections to which they were NOT excluded, but instead opted to blow up those who decided that voting to chose their own leaders was a good idea. Below is an extract from the article I posted above: "Washington has been encouraging the Shi'ite and Kurdish blocs that emerged strongest from the January polls to involve more Sunni Arabs in the drafting of a permanent constitution, the next step on Iraq's path to democracy. Sunni Arabs dominated Iraq during Saddam's rule but won only 17 seats in Iraq's 275-member parliament because many Sunni groups boycotted the elections and violence in Sunni Arab areas meant turnout there was extremely low. "

Do you think another country should have occupied us during or soon after the Civil War?

The insurgents are comprised of many different groups. The secularists are resisting the rising theocracies, the religious extremists are resisting what they imagine are secularists, the nationals are resisting the US and anyone that supports them and the foreign terrorists(the smallest of the group)are assisting in making sure civil war ensues. It is a mess.

I do not support us being in Iraq and my heart goes out to those who are trying to stop the madness and get the US to leave. Our military is doing exactly what Saddam did to stop the Shia uprising--any idiot that can't see that is blind.

Whether an innocent child in Iraq is murdered by an american bomb, a terrorist or an insurgent--it is our fault.

[tinybear]

You have a rather warped method of fault allocation. We got rid of a tyrant, gave ALL Iraqis a chance to elect their rulers and pledged to leave once the country became stable. Guess who's delaying our departure?

[jose]

¨Let me guess.
Adding new and larger facilities will serve as a daily reminder that Iraq is under a foreign military occupation

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinio...iraqbases.html

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: tinybear Yeah 'us'=the USA and we only deliberately kill terrorists. Don't see anything wrong with that, do you? You wanna see something wrong, look no further than the Iraqi insurgents who kill their own compatriots: Suicide bombers target crowds of Iraqis, kill 21 By Haider Abbas HILLA, Iraq (Reuters) - Two suicide bombers strapped with explosives blew themselves up among crowds of Iraqis in the mainly Shi'ite town of Hilla south of Baghdad Monday, killing at least 21 people and wounding 34, police said. The first attacker detonated his bomb among Iraqis waiting at a medical center where police, army and civil service recruits get check-ups before being hired, police said. A second bomber blew himself up shortly afterwards among a crowd of police commandos protesting to demand higher wages. Insurgents have stepped up suicide attacks and ambushes over the past month, killing more than 700 Iraqis since a new Shi'ite-led cabinet was announced on April 28. http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/sto...20050529BAG17D

It's called a civil war, and we instigated it, we facilitated it, and we can't stop it. We had no business invading Iraq, the people there should have been left to deal with saddam on their own. When they were ready for self-government, they would have overthrown him like the Romanians did with Nicolae Ceausescu. For all of the suicide bombers, roadside bombs, assassinations, kidnappings and beheadings that are now occuring daily, there was never a single serious attempt to target saddam by any group or individual, fanatic or sane. What does it say about this war when the "liberators" are considered to be worse than saddam?