Volconvo is a debate forum for the discussion of political, religious, and news-based topics.

castille · May 26, 2005, 04:24 am

I'm sick of those whiny bastards taking our money.

tinybear · May 26, 2005, 05:05 am

For once, I agree with castille. :)

allen · May 26, 2005, 10:44 am

For once, I disagree with castille. As long as US or Japan does not give up supporting Taiwan independence, China shall pay NK to make troubles. Might be expensive, but Taiwan is far more important than money.

Nono · May 26, 2005, 11:11 am

Quote:

Quote by: allen

Taiwan is far more important than moeny.

That's what the Argentinians used to say about the Falklands.
Don't you think the Taiwanese should decide the matter?

allen · May 26, 2005, 11:30 am

Quote:

Quote by: Nono

That's what the Argentinians used to say about the Falklands.
Don't you think the Taiwanese should decide the matter?

Yes I think Americans and Japanese shall stop sponsoring the separatists. Leave that issue to Taiwanese.

**Matt W** · May 26, 2005, 11:48 am

Quote:

Yes I think Americans and Japanese shall stop sponsoring the separatists.

And China should stop courting the KMT and offering pandas?

Zeebadee · May 26, 2005, 11:54 am

Quote:

Quote by: allen

Yes I think Americans and Japanese shall stop sponsoring the separatists. Leave that issue to Taiwanese.

Then you'd have no problem with letting Hawaiians decide the status of their own nation?

allen · May 26, 2005, 12:22 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Matt W

And China should stop courting the KMT and offering pandas?

To Taiwan China is not a foreign nation like Japan or US. KMT still believes China and Taiwan belong to the same nation. It went to mainland this year to talk with CCP (not government of PRC, which KMT does not recognize), This can not be said "courting". You can say two parties of China approached and hold talks.

allen · May 26, 2005, 12:32 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zeebadee

Then you'd have no problem with letting Hawaiians decide the status of their own nation?

This shall be left to Americans to decide if Hawaiians has that right. As far as I know, China is not sponsoring any independence movement there, but US is sporsoring Taiwan indpendence movement.

tinybear · May 26, 2005, 12:34 pm

Who told you US is sponsoring Taiwan independence?

**Matt W** · May 26, 2005, 12:50 pm

Quote:

You can say two parties of China approached and hold talks.

The CCP are not the 'people of Taiwan' that you wish to determine their own status. Therefore, like the US and Japan, they should leave well alone. It is hypocrisy to do otherwise.

allen · May 26, 2005, 01:10 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Matt W

The CCP are not the 'people of Taiwan' that you wish to determine their own status. Therefore, like the US and Japan, they should leave well alone. It is hypocrisy to do otherwise.

I did not say CCP are "people of Taiwan". What I said is,
1. CCP is a party in China.
2. KMT is a party in China.
3. Both parties hold talks.

allen · May 26, 2005, 01:11 pm

Quote:

Quote by: tinybear

Who told you US is sponsoring Taiwan independence?

It is very obvious. DPP dances like a puppet while US siting behind the stage.

**Matt W** · May 26, 2005, 01:16 pm

You said:

Quote:

Leave that issue to Taiwanese.

The CCP are not Taiwanese. Therefore...they should leave it to those that are.

tinybear · May 26, 2005, 01:17 pm

Quote:

Quote by: allen

It is very obvious. DPP dances like a puppet while US siting behind the stage.

What evidence supports your assertion?

Zeebadee · May 26, 2005, 01:41 pm

Quote:

Quote by: allen

This shall be left to Americans to decide if Hawaiians has that right. As far as I know, China is not sponsoring any independence movement there, but US is sporsoring Taiwan indpendence movement.

The problem with letting "Americans" decide about Hawaii's status is that the native Hawaiians have been overwhelmed by outsiders, much the same as Taiwan has been overwhelmed by mainlanders fleeing the communists. I'd venture to say that if only native Hawaiians were allowed to decide their status, the result would be entirely different than if "Americans" made that decision. What the decision would be if only native Taiwanese were allowed to decide their future is something I wonder about.

allen · May 26, 2005, 01:51 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Matt W

You said:
The CCP are not Taiwanese. Therefore...they should leave it to those that are.

Right. CCP is not Taiwanese, but Chinese. KMT is Chinese. They talked in and about China, not Taiwan.

allen · May 26, 2005, 01:55 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Zeebadee

The problem with letting "Americans" decide about Hawaii's status is that the native Hawaiians have been overwhelmed by outsiders, much the same as Taiwan has been overwhelmed by mainlanders fleeing the communists. I'd venture to say that if only native Hawaiians were allowed to decide their status, the result would be entirely different than if "Americans" made that decision. What the decision would be if only native Taiwanese were allowed to decide their future is something I wonder about.

If that is true, what can you do? If you let the natives to decide, US might have to move back to Europe. Is this likely?

**Matt W** · May 26, 2005, 01:56 pm

Theoretically, any talks the DPP have with the US are about the US and Japan.

Basically, if you want the Taiwanese to decide their own future, then all outside influence should come to an end whilst they do so. Chinese, American, and Japanese.

allen · May 26, 2005, 02:01 pm

Quote:

Quote by: Matt W

Theoretically, any talks the DPP have with the US are about the US and Japan.

DPP is not Japanese or American.

Quote:

Basically, if you want the Taiwanese to decide their own future, then all outside influence should come to an end whilst they do so. Chinese, American, and Japanese.

Japan and US both officially regard Taiwan as Chinese territory. Didn't your country talk with the party from northern ireland?

May 26, 2005, 04:24 am	#1 (permalink) (top)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	China should conquer North Korea I'm sick of those whiny bastards taking our money. Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you. Last edited by castille; May 26, 2005 at 04:27 am.

May 26, 2005, 10:44 am	#3 (permalink) (top)
allen Igneous Magma Posts: 199	For once, I disagree with castille. As long as US or Japan does not give up supporting Taiwan independence, China shall pay NK to make troubles. Might be expensive, but Taiwan is far more important than money. Last edited by allen; May 26, 2005 at 11:31 am.

May 26, 2005, 01:56 pm	#19 (permalink) (top)
Matt W Moderator Location: Reading, UK. Posts: 7,197	Theoretically, any talks the DPP have with the US are about the US and Japan. Basically, if you want the Taiwanese to decide their own future, then all outside influence should come to an end whilst they do so. Chinese, American, and Japanese. I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered. -George Best, on being asked what he did with his footballing fortunes.

May 26, 2005, 05:05 am	#2 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 7,333	For once, I agree with castille. :)

May 26, 2005, 12:34 pm	#10 (permalink) (top)
tinybear Volcanic Erupter Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 7,333	Who told you US is sponsoring Taiwan independence?