recruiting at public high schools

[rcne]

A PTA in Seattle has banned military recruiting at its high school. Not a bad idea, but if the supreme court decides that the government can withhold federal funds from colleges that ban recruitment, then they should also be able to withhold funds from the individual schools.

I'm sure the local taxpayers won't mind the additional property taxes.

Rift over recruiting at public high schools A Seattle high school bars military solicitation, touching off debate over Iraq war and free speech. By Dean Paton | Correspondent of The Christian Science Monitor SEATTLE – While most Parent Teacher Student Association meetings might center on finding funding for better math books or the best way to chaperon a school dance, a recent meeting here at Garfield High School grappled with something much larger - the war in Iraq. The school is perhaps one of the first in the nation to debate and vote against military recruiting on high school campuses - a topic already simmering at the college level. In fact, the Supreme Court recently agreed to decide whether the federal government can withhold funds from colleges that bar military recruiters. .....

http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0518/p02s01-ussc.html

[Mr.Vicchio]

Those people should be ashamed.

Period.

[Milton Bradley]

So, they want to use funding to advance their agenda. How comforting.

[RickSp]

I am not crazy about the idea of preventing access to recruiters but I do think there needs to be a balance to the lies invariably told by the recruiters. (Before anyone starts screaming, recruiters have been lying to recruits for centuries.)

Activists vs. military recruiters in schools Volunteers affiliated with peace groups urge students to think twice before signing up for a stint in uniform The soldiers serving in Operation Enduring Reality have a message for young people thinking of joining the military: "Think twice." Armed with facts and figures on war costs and casualties as well as testimony from disheartened soldiers, volunteers - most of whom are associated with other peace groups - are heading into schools throughout the Sacramento region to talk with kids about the risks of military life. Some activists call it "counter-recruiting" because they view it as an alternative perspective to a massive campaign by the military to recruit young people.

Activists vs. military recruiters in schools

[Gorgo]

Quote by: Mr.Vicchio Those people should be ashamed.

Don't blame the recruiters, 'V,' I'm sure that it's official policy to try to talk children into doing what adults wouldn't do. They're not doing it on their own.

[gr8fuldaniel]

That article is a good find, rcne.
I heard about another recent story where a student recorded a recruiter telling him to cheat and lie...... To forge a diploma. Here it is

McSwane, 17, is actually just the kind of teenager the military would like. He's a high school journalist and honor student at Arvada West High School. But McSwane decided he wanted to see "how far the Army would go during a war to get one more solider." McSwane contacted his local army recruiting office in Golden with a scenario he created. He told a recruiter that he was a dropout and didn't have a high school diploma. "No problem," the recruiter explained. He suggested that McSwane create a fake diploma from a non-existent school. McSwane recorded the recruiter saying that on the phone. "It can be like Faith Hill Baptist School or something -- whatever you choose," the recruiter said. As instructed, McSwane went on the computer to a Web site and for $200 arranged to have a phony diploma created that certified him as a graduate of Faith Hill Baptist High School, the very name the recruiter suggested. It came complete with a fake grade transcript. "What was your reaction to them encouraging you to get a phony diploma?" CBS4's Rick Sallinger asked. "I was shocked," McSwane said. "I'm sitting there looking at a poster that says 'Integrity, Honor, Respect' and he is telling me to lie." McSwane also pretended he had a drug problem when he spoke with the recruiter. The Army does not accept enlistees with drug problems. "I have a problem with drugs," McSwane said, referring to the conversation he had with the recruiter. "I can't kick the habit ... just marijuana." "[The recruiter] said 'Not a problem,' just take this detox ... he said he would pay half of it ... told me where to go." Drug testers CBS4 contacted insist it doesn't work, but the recruiter claimed in another recorded phone conversation that taking "detoxification capsules and liquid" would help McSwane pass the required test.

I remember when I almost joined up (many moons ago), I had just taken the physical and the written tests. The recruiter was asking me if I was ready jump on the bus. He told me I did so well on the written test, I could start as an officer. (LIE) He also said he would get me in as a Photographer, I didnt want to shoot people, I wanted to shoot pictures of them. But somebody told me to get any promises in writing. They guy wouldnt put it in writing, and I looked up above him at a sign warning about $10,000 fine for lying on government applications. I had some petty misdemeaners that I didnt put down. I just told him "Nope. Not ready to jump on the bus today, maybe later"
If the government were not evil at its core, maybe it would be fine to have recruiters on campus. Fact remains they lie and kill and steal and commit every manner of abomination against humanity. Fuck no I am not jumping on any bus with these demons. Not today and not ever.

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: Gorgo Don't blame the recruiters, 'V,' I'm sure that it's official policy to try to talk children into doing what adults wouldn't do. They're not doing it on their own.

Exactly. People in the military follow orders. There is little free will to do anything on ones own.


Off topic: That is why the Aby Gharib story is also a little too much to swallow.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Gorgo Don't blame the recruiters, 'V,'

Do I sense a note of sarcasm here? I think Mr V, is saying the PTA should be ashamed for kicking the recruiters out. Not that the recruiters should be ashamed.

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel Do I sense a note of sarcasm here? I think Mr V, is saying the PTA should be ashamed for kicking the recruiters out. Not that the recruiters should be ashamed.

[A large whooshing sound is heard as that attempt at sarcasm passes directly over Milton's head]


Umm ..., oh..., thanks Daniel.

[Gorgo]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel Do I sense a note of sarcasm here?

From me? I'm verklempt!

[rcne]

The choice to join or not is up to the individual, not the PTA. I enlisted and I believed most of what the recruited told me.

I would have enlisted anyway, not really much of a choice. I needed to change my ways. I figured I'd either end up dead or in jail, or both.

I gained from my service. I learned to trust myself and my abilities. And most importantly - that being a civilian is not such a bad thing.

[Inferno]

A good point i don't care if they take the recruiters OUT of the school but they should be able to leave pamphlets and such inside offices and classrooms. But if the school decides to take the recruiters out for a loss of funding that the communities choice if they want ot pay for that out of there pockets and not the state, county, or government budget thats there choice but the choice should be voted on by the community not just the Parent Teacher Student Association

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Milton Bradley Umm ..., oh..., thanks Daniel

Its OK, your previous post had a valid point anyway.

Quote by: Gorgo From me? I'm verklempt!

Im glad you used that weird word, I had to look it up and found it in this cool dictionary: Urban Dictionary, which helped me decypher Shizzle

3. shizzle Word most often abused horribly by inexperienced suburban white douche-bags who wish to give themselves some falsified counterfeit form of street-cred. Also used by the oreo cookies who stoop low enough to keep the company of these pathetic weasels. "Say, Toby, would you like to purchase that new funky fresh cd by Ruben Stoddard?" "Why sure, Justin, fo' shizzle my nizzle"

[Milton Bradley]

Quote by: gr8fuldaniel Its OK, your previous post had a valid point anyway. Im glad you used that weird word, I had to look it up and found it in this cool dictionary: Urban Dictionary, which helped me decypher Shizzle

I take it you did not need the definition of the word "nizzle"?

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: Milton Bradley I take it you did not need the definition of the word "nizzle"?

O My Gizzle, there are 49 definizzzzles fo' shizzzle thats hizzzlarious, nizzzle!

[moustache]

some army recruiters came to my school today.

banning them? isnt that a bit harsh?...all they did was pass out free pencils and keychains...

if you dont want anything to do with them, then dont talk to them.

alot of kids will do better in life because of the army/navy/marines... pay for college, keep them out of trouble...

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: moustache keep them out of trouble...

Unless they get shot up for Haliburtons gain. It would be different if they were going to defend our country. Under the Bush Crime Syndicate, Its not about Defense. Its all Imperial aggression.
Any kids who sign up for todays military are fools or murderers.

[The Analog Kid]

Why do liberals hate the military?

All public federal funding should end for any school that bans recruiters.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Quote by: The Analog Kid Why do liberals hate the military?

War should be a very last resort. Never pre-emptive. Never for Empire building. Military should never be employed against innocent civilians.
Congress should never be the lapdog of the other branches. The military should not fight an undeclared war. The military should not be used for profiteering and ethnic cleansing. The Military is not a division of Haliburton or Texaco.

Quote by: The Analog Kid All public federal funding should end for any school that bans recruiters.

How much influence do you think the military should have in our schools?
Like this?

Nazi Germany and Education Education played a very important part in Nazi Germany in trying to cultivate a loyal following for Hitler and the Nazis. The Nazis were aware that education would create loyal Nazis by the time they reached adulthood. The Hitler Youth had been created for post-school activities and schools were to play a critical part in developing a loyal following for Hitler - indoctrination and the use of propaganda were to be a common practice in Nazi schools and the education system. Enforcing a Nazi curriculum on schools depended on the teachers delivering it. All teachers had to be vetted by local Nazi officials. Any teacher considered disloyal was sacked. Many attended classes during school holidays in which the Nazi curriculum was spelled out and 97% of all teachers joined the Nazi Teachers' Association. All teachers had to be careful about what they said as children were encouraged to inform the authorities if a teacher said something that did not fit in with the Nazi's curriculum for schools. Subjects underwent a major change in schools. Some of the most affected were History and Biology. History was based on the glory of Germany - a nationalistic approach was compulsory. The German defeat in 1918 was explained as the work of Jewish and Marxist spies who had weakened the system from within; the Treaty of Versailles was the work of nations jealous of Germany's might and power; the hyperinflation of 1923 was the work of Jewish saboteurs; the national resurgence which started under the leadership of Hitler etc. Biology became a study of the different races to 'prove' that the Nazi belief in racial superiority was a sound belief. "Racial Instruction" started as the age of 6. Hitler himself had decreed that "no boy or girl should leave school without complete knowledge of the necessity and meaning of blood purity." Pupils were taught about the problems of heredity. Older pupils were taught about the importance of selecting the right "mate" when marrying and producing children. The problems of inter-racial marriage were taught with an explanation that such marriages could only lead to a decline in racial purity. Geography taught pupils about the land Germany had taken away from her in 1919 and the need for Germany to have living space - lebensraum. Science had a military-slant to it. The curriculum required that the principles of shooting be studied; military aviation science; bridge building and the impact of poisonous gasses.

More....

[gr8fuldaniel]

Anybody remember the first bombing raid in Fallujah?
The Hospital. That has to be straight out of Hitlers playbook.
That makes us the bad guys. I hate what my country is becoming at the hands of murderers in our white house.