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This topic in Politics & Government is about WHAT IS THE REAL AGENDA?.

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Old Feb 11, 2004, 09:39 pm   #1 (permalink) (top)
PeterAngelo
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I spoke to a Clearwater (Florida) Police detective today and heard some astonishing news. It seems that Florida not only has a heroin epidemic, we also have a meth-amphetamine epidemic that is being aided and abetted by the police themselves.

She told me that the police do not bust local meth labs because;

1) Under federal rules the police have to bring in OSHA experts to properly dispose of the chemicals.

2) The danger of causing an explosion when storming a meth lab located in a residential neighborhood is too great to take a chance on lawsuits and “collateral damage.”

The end result is that the combined epidemics of meth - amphetamine, and heroin are causing a lot of death and destruction. It is another effective control mechanism for a frustrated and powerless populace.

Instead of the cops actively stopping the drug trade, they are using it as a means of population control. We end up killing each other, making the courts and police stronger by helping to keep the drug culture in business.

I wrote a lot about the time I spent working at Customs Clearance and Dispatch in Miami several years ago. The customs officer in charge of “guarding” the warehouse personally handled the container of heroin that arrived every week. It is true – I was there and worked with him.

The media (local) has never even hinted at this deliberate (and suspicious) decision by law authorities to NOT bust meth – labs.

I will send this to several local print and TV personalities I know and see if the story can be made more “mainstream.”

These policies are not accidental. The drug “war” is a war against us. The deliberate criminalization of substances that frustrated, angry people use to kill their pain is a guaranteed way of building up a police state and having the “sheep” kill themselves, and each other.

It makes work for lawyers, and justifies more and more prisons to hold minorities and political prisoners.

It is a brilliant improvement in the traditional police state. Instead of police and soldiers doing the shooting and killing directly – they promote policies that lead to the people committing self-genocide.

Incredible – it really is working.
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Old Feb 11, 2004, 09:57 pm   #2 (permalink) (top)
Anarchist
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I've heard that for every meth lab busted, two more pop up elsewhere. These anti-drug politicians could make more of a difference by flushing the money directly down the toilet. It wouldn't waste so much of everyone's time. Funny how drug violence is self-justification for more drug laws, even though it's the damned Holy Crusade against drugs that generates most of the violence in the first place. Take a look at the prohibition and how it caused the creation of the mafia. Aaaaak...

But, one thing that always sets off my bullshit detector is the use of the word "epidemic." Is drinking beer an epidemic? What about watching Jerry Springer? Sounds like an emotionally charged buzzword (like, ASSAULT WEAPON!!) more than anything else.
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Old Feb 11, 2004, 10:04 pm   #3 (permalink) (top)
james?
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</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Anarchist,)
These anti-drug politicians could make more of a difference by flushing the money directly down the toilet.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

It could be observed that maybe they are striving for votes, not change.
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Old Feb 11, 2004, 10:07 pm   #4 (permalink) (top)
Anarchist
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</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (james?,)
</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Anarchist,)
These anti-drug politicians could make more of a difference by flushing the money directly down the toilet.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

It could be observed that maybe they are striving for votes, not change.
<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

Yeah. it's a propaganda effort, trolling for votes from the chumps who buy their rhetoric. Though I do think some of them are honest control freaks who think they're changing the world.
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Old Apr 27, 2004, 11:30 pm   #5 (permalink) (top)
Osborn F Enready
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Welcome to the REAL WORLD, where the big government isn't REALLY looking out for YOUR best intrests.

C.I.A. dealing drugs?

http://www.guerrillanews.com/crack/qt_hi.html

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sh...nsdrugscia.html

The only reason there are designer drugs, is because the drug laws forced the black market to get creative for profit, and trying to skirt outlawed substances. Crack, Meth-Amphetamine, Ice and all that other crap are direct relatives to your Uncle Sams anti-drug laws.
All I ask is for people to read their rights, read their history, and accept the fact that the Drug War is unconstitutional, proven faulted theory, and an economic drain. Look at the results we get from the war on drugs:

Increased Crime due to black market ability to provide needs of buyers.

Buyers are criminals under the law, so those that do wish to get treatment have to deal with the justice system too.

Prices for drugs skyrocket, as the black market tightens its hold on its markets. This causes the criminal element to look to other means to support their "habits".

Policemen are given to much power in search and seizure, and their rights to spy on private innocent citizens.

New methods for entrapment devised, often resulting in the criminals resorting to violence for fear of prosecution.

Black market suppliers, battle over territory, buyers, product, and control of their market.

This mass assault by law and fed enforcment causes the black market to organize into small cells throughout the country, unified by their want for immediate profit.

Innocent homes being raided and innocent people harmed or victimized in search of drugs on bad information, usually through illegal means.

Innocent people being assumed guilty in the workplace/courts/federal institutions until they prove innocence by complying with PROVEN faulty urine/drug testing.
http://archive.aclu.org/issues/worker/summ...esting1999.html

By feeding the black market, you do exactly what the law is supposed to fight. When the black market grows, crime grows. When crime grows, innocent people are affected more. When innocent people are affected more, they cry for more funding to the police department. The police department then becomes responsible to the Fed policy due to using so many Fed funds, and grants. The perfect plan for a continuous cycle of dependence. Crime grows, police influence and ability grows, your rights take a fall on the sideline, innocent people become suspect by the police because they realize the futility of the war on drugs. They look at everyone as possible dealers because they have nice cars, dark skin, dress strange........ IT IS AN ENDLESS CYCLE, PERPETUATED BY UNCONSTITUTIONAL LAWS, AGAINST THE INDIVIDUAL AND CIVIL LIBERTIES OF ALL MEN.

These people that constantly argue against conspiracy theorists, challenge me, and I will prove you wrong. Ask me specific questions, I will show you what I know, and all the facts from (VIEWABLE, REFERENCEABLE LINKS).


Petition of Redress of Grievances:
http://www.givemeliberty.org/default.htm

Canadian Lawsuit Against Their National Banks:
http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/


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Old Apr 28, 2004, 02:47 am   #6 (permalink) (top)
Mia
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Osborn, I only want to dispute that those who want treatment have to deal with the justice department also. Seeking treatment of any kind is confidential (well - as confidential as anything is which is not really but you know what I mean).

I would have to study countries that do not criminalize drugs before I could think about it being de-criminalized in the US.

PS - a friend of mine was pulled over and searched like you were talking about - for being Syrian in a BMW in a hick town. (He does look like an Italian mobster in that black car, though!)


"...with like-minded people one cannot discuss. With like-minded people one can only participate in a church service, and you know how I feel about church services." Ayaan Hirsi Ali
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Old Apr 28, 2004, 02:51 am   #7 (permalink) (top)
PeterWolf
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Mia,
What does an Italian mobster look like?
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Old Apr 28, 2004, 02:56 am   #8 (permalink) (top)
Mia
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I don't know - it's just something some of us say to him.

Mobsters are Italian according to movies just like terrorists are Arab according to media, you know?


"...with like-minded people one cannot discuss. With like-minded people one can only participate in a church service, and you know how I feel about church services." Ayaan Hirsi Ali
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Old Apr 28, 2004, 03:10 pm   #9 (permalink) (top)
Osborn F Enready
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Mia said: "Osborn, I only want to dispute that those who want treatment have to deal with the justice department also. Seeking treatment of any kind is confidential (well - as confidential as anything is which is not really but you know what I mean)."

I say: Well Mia, you are partially right. Those who wish to voluntarily seek rehab programs CAN, if they can afford it, and for some there are also programs that help to pay for that. I bring it up to question the NEED FOR FORCED REHAB. We have seen, time and time again REPEAT offenders who have done time, been through rehab multiple times, yet still do the same things every time they are released. Many people claim this is a sickness. Some of it is, but most are people who REFUSE to have their decisions made for them. The most important thing to remember with ANY addictive substance, is that a person has to WANT to quit. People who are FORCED into rehab, do not want to quit. Some wake up to some facts they didn't know before, but MOST don't want to quit. They are just playing the game the justice department FORCES them to play(and also feeds the Justice Department money, in fines, court costs etc.). More importantly, let's look and ask why these people started drugs to begin with? The black market has a LOT to do with that. It aids distribution and profitability of the drug dealers, it allows inner city youth and adults to equally gain profits in large amounts by supplying a consumer with a product IT IS DEMANDING. It provides money non-stop, though the economy may fluctuate. At the same time that the black market hurts society, it helps the government. It justifies the ever raising costs of more police, more police funding, more federal funding for "The War on Drugs", more violations of civil rights "to catch these modern terrorists in our inner cities", more division between economic classes, more Federal funding for our local police departments, and ALL OF THAT MONEY, COMES OUT OF JOE TAXPAYERS POCKET!

Now, ask yourself this;

If the need for the War on Drugs was legitimate, would the government use false propaganda, and unconstitutional methods to apply it?

The answer should be no, as its need would be evident. Then take a look at the facts concerning the drug war and how the government seeks to implement it.

Why we need to question the motives of government.

Those who believe, that their government in this country is looking out for the peoples best intrest, and the good of the people, ask yourself these few questions;

How would our nation be today, if all people accepted slavery as being right, since the government endorsed it?

How would our nation be today, if all people would have laid down, and accepted segregation as being right, because the government endorsed "equal but seperate" as a means of justice in the face of illegalized slavery?

How about if people like Vernon Johns, Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks had all accepted their government was looking out for their best intrests?
What if they had not DEMANDED their rights, even though they were shunned in mass, and their followers were few in the beginning?

How would our nation be today, had it not been for the first few to start the fight for equal rights for women, and their right to vote?

My answer would be, it wouldn't be a nation I was proud to live in, or a government I was proud to live under. These things were all guaranteed in our Constitution and Bill of Rights, yet they had to be argued and fought about and died for, in order to have justice reign by the will of the people. Hard lessons learned one would not think easily forgotten. Yet today, I see people willingly laugh in the face of those that cry for equal rights, I see people scorned for believing they have the right to make up their own mind. I see the blind masses led by a master who has no compassion for his soul, nor respect for his wishes. A master who enjoys inflicting his will upon those that serve him, a master who does not recognize your voice as equal, your pain as worthy of relief. A master who will willingly take your tax money on promises never meant to be kept, or deeds to be judged.

Ask yourself this; What justified the will of the people in the repeal of prohibition of alchohol, yet not their worthiness to be asked on the repeal of unconstitutional anti-drug laws, propaganda, and programs that violate the very rights of those people?

Current drug laws, and the entire "War on Drugs", has led to legalized descrimination, segregation and classism, on a NATIONAL LEVEL. It has also created a black market that is out of control, and justifiably.

The "War on Drugs", is a campaign designed to take away the will of the people, to rob the people of their rights to decide what and how they, by their own hand consume, or take things into their own bodies. A campaign that says "We the government, know better than the individual, what is best for any man, and have the power to enforce our will."

It is our God given right, to use all things on this earth that is provided naturally, in our quest for personal fullfillment, self medication and the pursuit of happiness. No government has the right to condemn any plant of God, or any man for his belief or use of said plant, if it is not harming another or infringing on anothers right to do the same. What if our first societies, and all societies since has deemed that wheat, corn and rice were evil plants, and had no good purpose? Would they have been right just because the laws of society said so?

If it weren't for government intervention, the designer drugs that have proven to be so lethal, and so addictive, would have never had to have been created. The laws themselves forced the creation of drugs that would allow their use with no fear of prosecution, and cheap manufacture.

Is it the right of the government and civil authorities, to assume your guilt until you prove your innocence using proven faulty testing methods such as drug/urine testing. Is it the right of the government to say, if you refuse our unreliable testing, you will be ASSUMED guilty????? That is their current practice.

Is it the right of the government to say that before you can earn an honest wage, at an honest salary, they have the authority to test your blood or urine to see if you "measure up" to their beliefs? That is their current practice.(Drug Free Workplace-Workers Comp. kickbacks, healthcare descrimination)

Is it the right of the government to broadcast known false information about drugs, though they have independent scientific proof that proves those "alleged" facts are false? (Drug Awareness Campaigns)
That is their current practice.

Is it right that people who for personal belief, choose to use drugs, but are otherwise upstanding, morally sound, honest people are forced to the black market to buy drugs that are less harmful in some cases than tobacco or alchohol, be treated the same as murderers, rapists and child molesters? (Drug users/dealers often have to serve longer, harsher sentences than the aforementioned also) That is their current practice.

Is it right, that because of personal beliefs, the government has the right to take a mans home, property, and belongings, should they become aware of his practices and said beliefs, though he causes no harm to any man other than possibly himself? (D.A.R.E. program, and similar) That is their current practice.

THIS IS WHY, I SAY THIS;

It is in the best intrest of all men and women of this nation, to free all citizens from the grasp of unreasonable oppression and aggression. All forms of descrimination, segregation and classism are evils our peoples of this nation have struggled against in the hopes of equality for all RESPONSIBLE citizens. In our fights against slavery, segregation, prohibition and the rights of women, we have made the stand that ALL MEN AND WOMEN ARE EQUAL, and entitled to their rights to vote, pray and believe and live as they see fit. We are a rational people, a compassionate people, therefore we place our trust and responsibility in the people, to live as they see fit individually, until they choose to harm another, or infringe on anothers right to live freely! THESE ARE OUR RIGHTS, and we DEMAND THEY BE RECOGNIZED!

THE PEOPLE MUST RECOGNIZE, that any attempt the government makes to remove the liberties of one man, is an attempt to set precedent for the removal of liberty for ALL MEN!
This is why, I choose to fight, for my rights, my beliefs, and my liberty.

As Vernon Johns once said: " If you see a good fight, GET IN IT!"

I have seen my fight, and it is the fight of the people. Won't you please help a fellow American, to secure his and your rights for the future, for if you don't, you are at the hands of an angry and unforgiving master. I sir, would rather die in that fight, than join the masses of the blind in their march to eternal servitude.

I beg you kind soul, think of your own personal beliefs, those most dear to you, and tell me how you would feel if the government chose that belief to target for slander, propaganda and descrimination.

This is why I ask for your support to stop this madness called the "War on Drugs".

IT'S WRONG, IT'S FLAWED, AND IT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL!

Support and enact legislation that rights these wrongs:
Marijuana needs to be classed as alchohol currently is in respect to legal sale, possesion, and recreational use. Hemp/Marijuana as a legal cash crop, much like tobacco. Heroin, Cocaine, restricted to "voluntary" prescription drug status with educational programs with REAL FACTS on their function, hazards and reasons to quit, along with options to (charity driven) treatment programs legally, without fear of imprisonment or cruel and unusual punishment. Tobacco is also being targeted now, as are the owners of private business with smoking sections, and this is clearly wrong to interfere in the private sector. Private business has the right to set their own rules for the establishment for these things, just as they have the right to refuse service to anyone. ALL "SIN" TAXES REPEALED IMMEDIATELY.

Stop the use of illegal search and seizure methods (FLIR,Trained Dogs,Digital Aerial Imaging,Drug Testing) unless being able to apply the requirements for STANDARD PHYSICAL search and seizure.

Stop the spread of programs and practices such as the "Drug Free Workplace" program, that allows Workers Compensation kickbacks and health insurance with mandatory random testing and premium sevices/benefits for those that comply. This results in poor UNGUARANTEED healthcare, and guilty until proven innocent tactics.

THE PEOPLE MUST RECOGNIZE, that any attempt the government makes to remove the liberties of one man, is an attempt to set precedent for the removal of liberty for ALL MEN!

Thank you for your time, and hopefully your clearly patriotic support.

PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION AT:
http://www.e-thepeople.org/a-1/p/10485

Sincerely,
Michael G. Wojtaluk


Petition of Redress of Grievances:
http://www.givemeliberty.org/default.htm

Canadian Lawsuit Against Their National Banks:
http://www.freewebs.com/classaction/


Osborn F. Enready
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 08:28 am   #10 (permalink) (top)
Compugasm
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Something just occured to me about the drug test. They ask you if you will submit to testing right on the application. Any answer other than "yes" is immediate disqualification. It doesn't matter what your reasons are.


Death to Videodrome! Long live The New flesh!
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 11:53 am   #11 (permalink) (top)
Milton Bradley
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Quote by: Compugasm View Post
Something just occured to me about the drug test. They ask you if you will submit to testing right on the application. Any answer other than "yes" is immediate disqualification. It doesn't matter what your reasons are.

That is why if you click on my name, and read my bio, ot say "occupation, Blacklisted".


I refuse to submit to fake science, and government/corporate agenda.
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