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Thread: Communism Can Work

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    </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by
    Sing Tao
    5th February
    Andrew Lim


    Communism finds its place in a quiet Chinese village

    In the quiet village of Xiaohong, located in the heart of Gansu, Communism has existed for over one thousand years.

    The village of Xiaohong has less than 200 people. Most of them know each other by name, and their families have lived in the same village for hundreds of generations. The village was recently "discovered" by a Chinese training newscrew on its way to film several expedition sites.

    The accepted leader of the village, Gu Yuanxi, told the newscrew that "We haven&#39;t seen strangers here since the civil war." Indeed, in this remote village, nothing seems to disturb the peace.

    Yet what is most unique about this village is its strict adherence to many Communist principles, despite the inability of most to read or write. Villagers share their fate, says the village leader. Most are too happy to help each other in times of calamity. Gu Yuanxi pointed the newscrew to an old shack, saying that the shack had been blown over during a storm, but every villager of capable hands had helped to repair it.

    The village, however, does not consider itself to be Communist or socialist. Marx is just another foreigner, Communism is just a vague ideology, and Mao just another in the long line of dynasties.

    The village remains isolated from the outside world. A far cry from the rapidly progressive cities on the Chinese coast, this village has remained in tradition for the past thousand years.

    There are no computers, shopping malls, or television. Villagers do not need any form of communication except by mouth; only a select few are literate. Young men and women do not date; they simply marry in their teenage years, raise a family, and carry on the simply life of peasant farmers. Instead of Shanghai&#39;s nightclubs and cinemas, Xiaohong village enjoys a weekly traditional dance and village dinner.

    While China&#39;s youth develop liberal attitudes, the people of this small village remain strictly conservative, skeptical of new ideas. Indeed, many of the villagers whose ancestors immigrated from the coastal cities continue to view any foreign habit as degrading to purity. Huang Lijing, a young farmer, explains his daily routine.

    "I wake up when the sun comes, then I work at the fields. I usually share a lunch of rice and vegetables with the other young men, and afterwards I work again until nightfall and go to bed. Occasionally, the young people of the village gather in the hall for dancing and listening to Gu Yuanxi tell stories."

    None of the village youth understand any of the concepts of modern China. Telephones, television, computers, and even public displays of affection are nonexistent. As Hu Jintao tours China, spreading his message of social equality and purity, he may well benefit from looking at this village.

    However, Professor Chen Jinfei says that using examples of these villages would not work in the cities.

    "Many small villages consist of several hundred familiar people, while the cities may hold tens of millions of strangers. While it may be possible to look onto these villages for inspiration, it would be difficult to implement such societies into China&#39;s cities. Firstly, the majority of Chinese villages are already exposed to Western culture, and could be considered liberal by China&#39;s standards. Maintaining a conservative structure of peasant farmers would be impossible logistically."

    Yet even as the village lives on, it has become inspiration to a darker side of China. A high school in Chengdu held a 4-hour demonstration, with many students calling for a "destruction of American imperialism" and a "purification of Chinese culture and cleansing of Chinese blood". Several students were arrested following a ceremony where English books and magazines were burnt, and a milk bar selling several English comic books was firebombed.

    None of this affects quiet Xiaohong village, which continues to live as it has one thousand years ago.
    <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

    Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

  2. #2
    former overlord Sean's Avatar
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    Castille,
    Please post partial articles, link to them, source them, and give a brief summary/opinion/question.

    So it goes

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    Igneous Magma
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    Thanks for the article Castile. That culture reminds me of the Native American society where property rights were unheard of and everyone worked for the betterment of the tribe.

    There were probably hundreds of those cultures in China that became displaced because of the construction of the Three Gorges Dam. The claim is to improve the quality of life, but these people have lived that way for several generations and have passed on rich traditions. In the haste for progress, who has stopped to ask what&#39;s at the end of that progress?

    Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups

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    Molten Ash
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    I quite agree. Communism can work in a small community of like minded people, as could most forms of government.


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    Sean - I already sourced the article. Its from the Sing Tao newspaper, 5/12/2004, reported by Andrew Lim.


    I agree that Communism can work in a small community of less than a few hundred people. But apply it to 1.3 billion people and you&#39;ll have trouble making it come close to success.

    I still prefer the big city though. I can&#39;t imagine spending my life in some traditional village that hasn&#39;t heard of "sex outside marriage"&#33; In a way a lot of the stuff we find entertaining (sex, clubbing, cinema, etc) have to live side by side with the negative aspects of consumerism (credit cards, greed, individualism, lack of family love).

    Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

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    Molten Ash
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    I think that sean guy was saying that you shouldn&#39;t post the entire article here, rather an exerpt, a link to the article, or whatever...

    Hmmm...if there was a way to have that with modern accessories, then I&#39;d be all for it...without the old beliefs, of course.

    &quot;Man acts as though he were the shaper and master of language, while in fact language remains the master of man.&quot;
    -Heidegger

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    I think theres a difference between communism and tribalism. Both are based on communal living, working together, and sharing property and so on. In a small isolated community, this tribalism works perfectly, as the group is small enough that mindsets are similar, and everyone has the same view of the community. Communism on the other hand is on a national scale, where a centralized government controls the flow of labor and resources, sets prices for goods and so on. The system is simply too suceptable to corruption, and it just doesn&#39;t work when it has to trade internationally. In essence, their really two very differnt things. Communism is economic, tribalism is social, and implies not having to work with the rest of the world.

    -B


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    Molten Ash
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    Actually, communism is both a type of government and an economic term...that&#39;s why when people usually ask me what I like, I say, "Democratic socialism."

    &quot;Man acts as though he were the shaper and master of language, while in fact language remains the master of man.&quot;
    -Heidegger

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    </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (castille,)
    I can&#39;t imagine spending my life in some traditional village that hasn&#39;t heard of "sex outside marriage"&#33;<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

    Isn&#39;t marriage a product of western culture though? Before the western settlers came, people did not consider marriage like the weserners did. For example, there were tribes that allowed women to have sex with other men in case they were with a man that could not get them pregnant. I believe the reason porn is so big here, is because sex is outlawed in most society in America, unless someone is trying to sell you something. I.E. porn, commercials, movies, TV, magazines, ect.


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    Igneous Magma
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    Yes I agree that communism can work, but the democratic principles and human rights must be retained in such a system for it to be succesful on a large scale.
    The centralisation of soviet communism was as much a function of consolidating stalins and succinctly the beurocratic dictatorship in which a democracy naturaly rebels against: that was the original intent of the bolsheviks, for the democratic proccess to naturaly wittle away at the beurocracy (like it does so today in every democracy).
    Unfortunetly this isnt very successful when the man who takes power decides to kill all of the main political activists in Russia: the Bolsheviks.
    The Maoists dont have a democratic tradition either, right from the moment they took power it was a dictatorship.
    Their is no pressure towards communism in china, in fact it is going in the oppossite direction.

    <span style='font-size:16pt;line-height:100%'><span style='font-family:Impact'><span style='color:green'>Vote NDP
    &quot;The independence of art for the revolution.

    &quot;The revolution for the complete liberation of art&#33;&quot;</span></span></span>

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    Molten Ash
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    </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (Bayou,)
    for the democratic proccess to naturaly wittle away at the beurocracy (like it does so today in every democracy).
    <hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>
    You are suggesting that in a political system where you have a professionsal political class charged with creating new legislation, buerocracy will decrease?

    As far as reataining human rights within a communist system, what about those who do not wish to particpate? It seems to me to depend on the scale of the system. If it is a matter of having a village opperate under "communism" with the option of someone leaving or joining according to their own wishes, it seems human rights could be respected. However, on any sort of large scale arangement, the communist would have to crack down on those who did not work with the system.


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    </span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (eburchelli,)
    I quite agree. Communism can work in a small community of like minded people, as could most forms of government.<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

    You forgot the part where most have to be illiterate for it to work.


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