Chem Weapons Used by US ?

[gr8fuldaniel]

Do you think we have become what we hate?
Would embedded US mainstream media report this, even if it were true?
I looked for a reliable source, I saw it on Rense first, then Rantburg, LOL, oh Brother.
If it is true, will we see it on ABC or CNN first?
We have these weapons, and we didnt just confiscate them, we developed them, why is it such a stretch to believe we would use them?

Islam Online [SIZE=3] US Troops Reportedly Gassing Fallujah [/SIZE] FALLUJAH, November 10 (IslamOnline.net & News Agencies) - US troops are reportedly using chemical weapons and poisonous gas in its large-scale offensive on the Iraqi resistance bastion of Fallujah, a grim reminder of Saddam Hussein’s alleged gassing of the Kurds in 1988. “The US occupation troops are gassing resistance fighters and confronting them with internationally-banned chemical weapons,” resistance sources told Al-Quds Press Wednesday, November 10. The fatal weapons led to the deaths of tens of innocent civilians, whose bodies litter sidewalks and streets, they added. “They use chemical weapons out of despair and helplessness in the face of the steadfast and fierce resistance put up by Fallujah people, who drove US troops out of several districts, hoisting proudly Iraqi flags on them. Resistance has also managed to destroy and set fire to a large number of US tanks and vehicles. “The US troops have sprayed chemical and nerve gases on resistance fighters, turning them hysteric in a heartbreaking scene,” an Iraqi doctor, who requested anonymity, told Al-Quds Press. “Some Fallujah residents have been further burnt beyond treatment by poisonous gases,” added resistance fighters, who took part in Golan battles, northwest of Fallujah. In August last year, the United States admitted dropping the internationally-banned incendiary weapon of napalm on Iraq, despite earlier denials by the Pentagon that the “horrible” weapon had not been used in the three-week invasion of Iraq. After the offensive on Iraq ended on April 9 last year, Iraqis began to complain about unexploded cluster bombs that still litter their cities. Media Blackout The sources said that the media blackout, the banning of Al-Jazeera satellite channel and subjective embedded journalists played well into the hands of the US military. “Therefore, US troops opted for using internationally banned weapons to soften the praiseworthy resistance of Fallujah people. “More and more, the US military edits and censors reports sent by embedded journalists to their respective newspapers and news agencies,” the sources added.

[bullshitdetector]

Islam online? I searched everywhere on the newsites and found ZERO coverage on this. I am sure its just a lie.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Originally posted by bsd, I am sure its just a lie.

You are sure?
Is that because you have unflinching faith in an institution whose primary purpose is to kill, would find it objectionable?

Is it your patriotism that doesnt want to believe it?

Even if it turns out to be true, would you brush it off as a rule for THEM? But not us, because we are the "good guys".

I want to be SURE too. How did you arrive at your confidence?
Is it because of our, er, unblemished record?

[Technosoul]

I think some attempts were made to block some of the news about the war but that story is most likely to be just a rumor,

I checked the Democarcy Now news group and they did not even carry that story, and they would if it had any solid foundation.

Of course, way back when the USA did develope and use chemical weapons which were lager banned.

Howver in a war I guess something could have got bombed that contained gas, like a gas line (if they have those in Iraq?) or some chemicals could have been blown up that were already there in that city.

I do not think A-q is doing a good job at creating a conspiracy theory, they better stick to their sticks and stones.

Techno

[bullshitdetector]

I arrive my conclusions the same way anyone does, just you do, I base them on my personal veiwpoints, observations and beliefs. This is not credible unless it is coming from a credible source in my opinion. You believe our news sources are backed by big brother and I do not. I believe their news sources are questionabole and you do not. That is the heart of this matter, Gr8ful. So, what do we have here then? We will never agree because we both are at opposite ends of this apparently. What we have left is you post what you think is credible based on who you care to believe and what they say and I will do the same, all in all it isn't discourse it is blogging on Seans dime, isn't it?

If this story is true I would accept it and levy blame where it belongs, if it is us then we are wrong.

I just haven't seen any evidence this story is credible from any credible bonified news source in this country.

[Technosoul]

Bull is right, and I am sure some Western reporters will be looking into the matter and so we should wait and see if any better developed story comes forth. But doubt if any story will be forthcoming, now if they had used non-deadly tear gas like they do on protesters to make people leave a building then that would be different. That is standard procedure even by our local police to toss in some tear gas to force people out in the open, less dangerous then rushing into a building. However we do not even have proof that our military uses that type of method.

I know that some of those people in Iraq have filmed their self blowing up USA vechiles and what not, they got cameras, otherwise how do they sneak out those films of people being taken hostage? How can we say that the Arab news media is being censored when they keep coming up with such film clips from Iraq? Where is their "fimed footage"? Where is their interview with some doctor about a person being killed by poison gas?

[The Dunedan]

I've seen this report as well.
If you look at the photographs of Marines in Fallujah which accompany this story, you'll note that they are not wearing their MOPP anti-chemical gear. They're not even masked; nor is the tank in the background of one shot "buttoned up;" the driver's hatch is raised.
If chemical weapons were being used, these leathernecks would be wearing at least their gas-masks and probably full suits of MOPP gear, and the tanks would be buttoned up.
Based upon this, I believe this report to be false.

[bullshitdetector]

Good catch, Dundean. You're right, looking at it I had to chuckle after reading your post.

[Technosoul]

In another post about the 800 dead that the Red Cross is counting based on rumors also they mentioned that the dead people are starting to stink because no one can take time out from the conflict to burry them. That smell from dead bodies could account for the reports of "smelling chemical gas" if the people reporting that story has misstaken one smell from another smell.

Just a guess.

[The Dunedan]

I'm with Techno on the smell. There are some chem. weapons to really do smell like rotting flesh!

The thing is this: if someone is smelling a chemical weapon, they're not gonna live long enough to write about it, ESPECIALLY the nast non-persistant stuff the US has. VX kills in about 15 seconds.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Originally posted by Tech Where is their interview with some doctor about a person being killed by poison gas?

Remember we bombed the hospital? Isnt that where you would normally find their doctors?
I dont know how trustworthy Rense is, but I doubt he made this up. He usually provides a link

Iraqi Physican Confirms US Chem Weapons Use In Fallujah Rense Speaking on the condition of anonymity to the Panorama radio station, the physician said he had just examined two dead bodies and confirmed that the victims died of banned chemical weapons. The physician found no evidence of bullet wounds, shrapnel, or any objects penetrating the bodies.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Originally posted by The Dunedan, If chemical weapons were being used, these leathernecks would be wearing at least their gas-masks and probably full suits of MOPP gear, and the tanks would be buttoned up. Based upon this, I believe this report to be false.

Ever hear of a file photo?
Look I dont want to believe any of this either, but the way this admin has been playing hide and seek with Red Cross,. Completely ignoring Geneva and Human Rights, would it really surprise you. If it waddles like a duck............

[PatrickHenry]

If the dead had been gassed and the US was interested in hiding it(which they would be) those bodies on the streets would be picked up and buried or burned quickly.

I think US troops would have trouble with the ethics on this one, too. They know it's wrong. Too hard to cover up. IMO: Propaganda.

[kharmajunkie]

Dunedan's right about the MOPP gear; if they had just used chemical weapons, they'd be wearing the gear. What I'm wondering is would said reporter/photographer be in the hot zone, with or without MOPP gear?

Don't bother arguing sources with BSD though, he's made it very
clear that he is closeminded to any form of alternative media.

[Technosoul]

Okay I was wrong about them not having some reported interview with a doctor, seems that his was in thier news story (which I confess I have not read).

But that was based on examining only two dead people and I would think that in a war with some mega bombs going off it might be possible for people to die just from the impact of a bomb even if they are not struck by flying debree. And also heart attacks would be common place.

Just stating that no bulllet holes or scrap metel was found is not the same thing as stating what the real cause of death might have been - and gas would not be the only other cause of death possible for those two people.

And no one could debate that it is not a fact that they did in fact air the story (even if the story was made-up) so that is not a reflection upon the poster who made that story known to us.

Also the point that our men in uniform would object to the use of unlawful chemical warfare, I do not think the commanders over there would risk it because we do already in fact have a number of men-in-uniform who are unhappy about being there with the knowledge that no WMDs were ever found, some of them are having 2nd thoughts about the war and if they are doing the right thing or not - and if they were told to kill people with poison gas they might resign because of their consience and that would look real bad if that came out in the real news that most Americans watch. Those guys fighting the war in Iraq do talk to one another and the news would soon spread through-out the ranks, and the commanders know that sooner or later our own troops would start talkin'. The risk would not warrent it.

Technosoul.

[bullshitdetector]

Who aired the story Technosoul?

I agree with your post, the risk would be too great to send troops out to gas with deadly chemicals without proper attire AND at the very least it would be a large leap to ask the troops to kill innocent civilians.

[kharmajunkie]

It's also possible for people to die from regular tear gas if they were stuck in a place without ventilation; that would explain bodies without wounds.

[Dieval]

Originally posted by The Dunedan, I've seen this report as well. If you look at the photographs of Marines in Fallujah which accompany this story, you'll note that they are not wearing their MOPP anti-chemical gear. They're not even masked; nor is the tank in the background of one shot "buttoned up;" the driver's hatch is raised. If chemical weapons were being used, these leathernecks would be wearing at least their gas-masks and probably full suits of MOPP gear, and the tanks would be buttoned up. Based upon this, I believe this report to be false.

I think you hit the nail on the head with this one.

[Dieval]

Oh, BTW, take a look at what they found in Fullujah (the link is a series of pictures - take a look at #2) -
Fullujah Images

[kharmajunkie]

Originally posted by Dieval, Oh, BTW, take a look at what they found in Fullujah (the link is a series of pictures - take a look at #2) - Fullujah Images

What's your point?