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Nov 13, 2004, 10:00 am

http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/new...hp?storyid=1013

Follow the link to see some of the 9/11 conspiracy theories debunked. The proponent comes off as a wealthy moron.

gr8fuldaniel · Nov 13, 2004, 11:39 am

The rich guy (Walter) did a good job of debunking the government shill (Posner).

Walter had all the facts and Posner did nothing to refute Walters observations except to try to change the subject, repeatedly.

The hole in the Pentagon is just plain too small, and there is no evidence of a wing even scratching the building. Let alone those 5 ton turbine engines should have left a broken window or two.

Quote:

WALTER: Because there are no marks on the wings on the building. If you look at the hole, the engines, each of those engines weighs four to five tons, it's the heaviest and densest part of the aircraft. It's perched out on the wing. That engine should have produced a hole. It did not collapse up into the center hole. Furthermore, the engine should have penetrated further than the main fuselage since they are denser and heavier than the main fuselage.

Nov 13, 2004, 06:24 pm

This is why I didn't spend much time speaking on this garbage. No matter what, the true believers stay faithful to their conspiracy beliefs.

gr8fuldaniel · Nov 13, 2004, 07:44 pm

Yeah, I have trouble lying to myself.

Maybe by some freak of nature one of the turbine engines was shorn off and proceeded to follow the fuselage into the hole (that is to small for a commercial airliner to fit in), but both engines?
Come on.
Explain please.
Restore my faith in the geniuses that are trying to pull that off.
I cant just dismiss it like we are talking about Santa Claus.

Nov 13, 2004, 08:15 pm

gr8ful,

No thank you. I've dealt with clowns that have little to no knowledge on a subject before. They read one or two bad websites (perhaps watch a bad conspiracy video) and run around quoting the malarkey as if they were professors on the topic.

You can find the info for yourself with very little effort. Hell, I offer videos for free to serious people, but the 'professor' clowns always run away.

gr8fuldaniel · Nov 13, 2004, 09:22 pm

Why did you even post this if you werent prepared to debate?

Maybe the wings were shorn off by trees and bounced over the pentagon. Did anyone look in the back yard?

Just kidding.
OK have it your way.

edit to add: The real clowns are running the country

Nov 14, 2004, 11:44 am

gr8tful,

"Why did you even post this if you werent prepared to debate?"

This is exactly my point. I was at a conference and had a nut try to monopolize my time after a presentation. He was rasing his voice and wouldn't let other people speak to me. Anything brought up was 'impossible'. Of course, he never said why something was 'impossible. He just knew. I even gave him free material I was selling to make back the cost of the trip. He came back later that day or the next and said pictures in the magazine had been doctored. Did he cite any photographic training? No, he just knew. The man had no knowledge of eyewitnesses. We were having a group discussion and another gentleman said he had a problem with his claim because he had relatives that were eyewtinesses to the Pentagon 757. The guy looked like he was constipated at a buffet line and did not know if he should go use the facilities or continue eating. Basic research was never done. The only things he mentioned were the laughably horrible vonKleist video and 9/11: The Great Illusion.

Hell, I posted a review of the vonKleist video proving it to be garbage. Out of all the responses, no one took issue with a single point. It was all:

"You're a stooge."

or they would change the subject

"You're endorsement of the government conspiracy theory..."

when, of course, I had never posted anything about the overall picture. You could agree with them 90%, but you are the enemy if you do not endorse their pet conspiracy cult.

Even with the documented information in the review, no one posting bothered to look it up. Yet, the same sort of people are the ones sending me links to horribly done 50-page reports and crappy conspiracy videos. I am supposed to spend hours on their garbage, but the the sender cannot find maybe 15 minutes to read an article or watch video of eyewitnesses. As I said before, they would turn down free $20 or $30 videos.

If you would, send me a list of material you have gone through to reach your conclusions and I will consider having a discussion.

Melvyn · Nov 14, 2004, 03:22 pm

There is no doubt that all four planes that were crashed were organized by John Ashcroft to give the Bush administration credibility. Obviously what happened to the pentagon was not the lost passenger jet but a CIA explosion. The missing jet and passengers are really in Guantanamo. Or maybe that Island with Elvis and JFK.

Mel

gr8fuldaniel · Nov 14, 2004, 03:55 pm

Start with the one you have avoided here so far:
1) Where is the damage from Wings/Turbines?

2) Why was the Pentagon parking lot video surveillance film doctored before it was "leaked" (missing frames) ? This should be in the top 3 most secure sites in America, If there were nothing to hide, shouldnt there be reels of footage from a hundred angles? Instead they leak footage with only the tail visable.

3) What happened to SOP with ATC and NORAD. Stand down? The official story wants us to accept as fact that the confusion of war games scheduled coincidentally for 911, could not be just "switched off" by Dick Cheney, which power he DID indeed have and failed to implement.

There, that should be enough for now, in respect for the forum.

There should be very simple answers to these. Can I just have a concise explanation for these 3? Thanx, I really havent heard the official or any contrary response to these oddities, yet.

bullshitdetector · Nov 15, 2004, 10:18 am

Gr8, he offered you an opportunity to debunk him not pepper him with questions so you dont have to do any work. You're the big conspiracy god here, I would like to see you do the walk, talk the talk and not just babble the same shit over and over again. If you're not up to it just say so, just say you're happy having your hands cupped over your ears and your eyes wide shut humming "Teddy bear" by Evlis with visions of JFK at Guantanamo bay and nothing, even reality, will ever do for you. Why ask him to answer something which he already doesn't believe based upon your conspiracy? That is like asking him to prove there is no Santa by asking "Then how come I saw 8 reindeer and a fat man in a red suit fly over my house, StoneWT, huh huh huh??? TELL ME!!?" Are you getting the picture here, can you understand what real debate is? :rolleyes:

Nov 13, 2004, 07:44 pm	#4 (permalink) (top)
gr8fuldaniel Fire the Liars Location: California Posts: 7,090	Yeah, I have trouble lying to myself. Maybe by some freak of nature one of the turbine engines was shorn off and proceeded to follow the fuselage into the hole (that is to small for a commercial airliner to fit in), but both engines? Come on. Explain please. Restore my faith in the geniuses that are trying to pull that off. I cant just dismiss it like we are talking about Santa Claus. ~~ Helpful Linx * Huff Post * WRH * RAW STORY ~~

Nov 13, 2004, 09:22 pm	#6 (permalink) (top)
gr8fuldaniel Fire the Liars Location: California Posts: 7,090	Why did you even post this if you werent prepared to debate? Maybe the wings were shorn off by trees and bounced over the pentagon. Did anyone look in the back yard? Just kidding. OK have it your way. edit to add: The real clowns are running the country ~~ Helpful Linx * Huff Post * WRH * RAW STORY ~~

Nov 14, 2004, 03:55 pm	#9 (permalink) (top)
gr8fuldaniel Fire the Liars Location: California Posts: 7,090	Start with the one you have avoided here so far: 1) Where is the damage from Wings/Turbines? 2) Why was the Pentagon parking lot video surveillance film doctored before it was "leaked" (missing frames) ? This should be in the top 3 most secure sites in America, If there were nothing to hide, shouldnt there be reels of footage from a hundred angles? Instead they leak footage with only the tail visable. 3) What happened to SOP with ATC and NORAD. Stand down? The official story wants us to accept as fact that the confusion of war games scheduled coincidentally for 911, could not be just "switched off" by Dick Cheney, which power he DID indeed have and failed to implement. There, that should be enough for now, in respect for the forum. There should be very simple answers to these. Can I just have a concise explanation for these 3? Thanx, I really havent heard the official or any contrary response to these oddities, yet. ~~ Helpful Linx * Huff Post * WRH * RAW STORY ~~

Nov 13, 2004, 10:00 am	#1 (permalink) (top)
StoneWT Guest Posts: n/a	http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/new...hp?storyid=1013 Follow the link to see some of the 9/11 conspiracy theories debunked. The proponent comes off as a wealthy moron.

Nov 13, 2004, 06:24 pm	#3 (permalink) (top)
StoneWT Guest Posts: n/a	This is why I didn't spend much time speaking on this garbage. No matter what, the true believers stay faithful to their conspiracy beliefs.

Nov 13, 2004, 08:15 pm	#5 (permalink) (top)
StoneWT Guest Posts: n/a	gr8ful, No thank you. I've dealt with clowns that have little to no knowledge on a subject before. They read one or two bad websites (perhaps watch a bad conspiracy video) and run around quoting the malarkey as if they were professors on the topic. You can find the info for yourself with very little effort. Hell, I offer videos for free to serious people, but the 'professor' clowns always run away.

Nov 14, 2004, 11:44 am	#7 (permalink) (top)
StoneWT Guest Posts: n/a	gr8tful, "Why did you even post this if you werent prepared to debate?" This is exactly my point. I was at a conference and had a nut try to monopolize my time after a presentation. He was rasing his voice and wouldn't let other people speak to me. Anything brought up was 'impossible'. Of course, he never said why something was 'impossible. He just knew. I even gave him free material I was selling to make back the cost of the trip. He came back later that day or the next and said pictures in the magazine had been doctored. Did he cite any photographic training? No, he just knew. The man had no knowledge of eyewitnesses. We were having a group discussion and another gentleman said he had a problem with his claim because he had relatives that were eyewtinesses to the Pentagon 757. The guy looked like he was constipated at a buffet line and did not know if he should go use the facilities or continue eating. Basic research was never done. The only things he mentioned were the laughably horrible vonKleist video and 9/11: The Great Illusion. Hell, I posted a review of the vonKleist video proving it to be garbage. Out of all the responses, no one took issue with a single point. It was all: "You're a stooge." or they would change the subject "You're endorsement of the government conspiracy theory..." when, of course, I had never posted anything about the overall picture. You could agree with them 90%, but you are the enemy if you do not endorse their pet conspiracy cult. Even with the documented information in the review, no one posting bothered to look it up. Yet, the same sort of people are the ones sending me links to horribly done 50-page reports and crappy conspiracy videos. I am supposed to spend hours on their garbage, but the the sender cannot find maybe 15 minutes to read an article or watch video of eyewitnesses. As I said before, they would turn down free $20 or $30 videos. If you would, send me a list of material you have gone through to reach your conclusions and I will consider having a discussion.

Nov 14, 2004, 03:22 pm	#8 (permalink) (top)
Melvyn Igneous Magma Posts: 229	There is no doubt that all four planes that were crashed were organized by John Ashcroft to give the Bush administration credibility. Obviously what happened to the pentagon was not the lost passenger jet but a CIA explosion. The missing jet and passengers are really in Guantanamo. Or maybe that Island with Elvis and JFK. Mel

Nov 15, 2004, 10:18 am	#10 (permalink) (top)
bullshitdetector BANNED Posts: 598	Gr8, he offered you an opportunity to debunk him not pepper him with questions so you dont have to do any work. You're the big conspiracy god here, I would like to see you do the walk, talk the talk and not just babble the same shit over and over again. If you're not up to it just say so, just say you're happy having your hands cupped over your ears and your eyes wide shut humming "Teddy bear" by Evlis with visions of JFK at Guantanamo bay and nothing, even reality, will ever do for you. Why ask him to answer something which he already doesn't believe based upon your conspiracy? That is like asking him to prove there is no Santa by asking "Then how come I saw 8 reindeer and a fat man in a red suit fly over my house, StoneWT, huh huh huh??? TELL ME!!?" Are you getting the picture here, can you understand what real debate is? :rolleyes: