Was the 2004 Election Stolen?

[bullshitdetector]

That is just silly, he was elected, the numbers came out right in 2000 and they most definately came out right this election. For you to say the whole nation is blind and ignorant while Jeb Bush plays uncle Ernie with the ballots while the entire united states is being fiddled like Tommy at Holiday Camp is outright laughable.

[PatrickHenry]

I smell a rat. It has that distinctive and all-too-familiar odor of the species Republicanus floridius. We got a nasty bite from this pest four years ago and never quite recovered. Symptoms of a long-term infection are becoming distressingly apparent.

By Colin Shea
http://www.freezerbox.com/archive/article.asp?id=321

The facts as I see them now defy all logical explanations save one--[SIZE=3]massive and systematic vote fraud. [/SIZE]

[OberonDOtherseid]

It's bloggggg...it's bloggggg, conspiracy theories of Bush

It's bloggggg....it's bloggggg, They never say anything good~

[rcne]

Actually I voted for you sour grapes people.

But, Snouter point of the snowbirds - residents in multiple states was waiting in the wings. I actually would be curious to see how many duplicate votes were actually cast.

I think the entire election process is to easy to manipulate and question.

For instance - why don't we have to show a photo ID to vote in the most powerful nation in the world.

I need a photo ID to cash a check - but not to vote.

Now that's crazy.

[PatrickHenry]

Originally posted by OberonDOtherseid, It's bloggggg...it's bloggggg

Yeah. Ok , Oberon. Don't examine evidence, who needs the truth anyway? (irony)

You know everything you need to-- Your guy "won"

I think you really don't care about vote rigging if your candidate is the occupant of the White House.

Who needs a representative democracy anyway?(irony)

[OberonDOtherseid]

Originally posted by PatrickHenry,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (PatrickHenry,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-OberonDOtherseid, It's bloggggg...it's bloggggg

Yeah. Ok , Oberon. Don't examine evidence, who needs the truth anyway? (irony)

You know everything you need to-- Your guy "won"

I think you really don't care about vote rigging if your candidate is the occupant of the White House.

Who needs a representative democracy anyway?(irony)[/b][/quote]

Yea, that's it, I don't care. I said let there be a investigation not let there be a declaration because you have sour grapes and blogs upon blogs of random opinions, not facts. Someone offering their opinion on a stupid blog is not evidence.

[OberonDOtherseid]

Originally posted by rcne, Actually I voted for you sour grapes people. But, Snouter point of the snowbirds - residents in multiple states was waiting in the wings. I actually would be curious to see how many duplicate votes were actually cast. I think the entire election process is to easy to manipulate and question. For instance - why don't we have to show a photo ID to vote in the most powerful nation in the world. I need a photo ID to cash a check - but not to vote. Now that's crazy.

Where did you vote? I had to produce a valid picture ID.

[PatrickHenry]

Obe, you did not read it, did you? Because your mind has already been made up?

[OberonDOtherseid]

Originally posted by PatrickHenry, Obe, you did not read it, did you? Because your mind has already been made up?

Read what Patrick, the blog entry of electoral conspiracy along with charts done on somebodys Excel97 program? No, I confess, once I saw the source I already knew the content.....It's blogggg....it's bloggggg

[PatrickHenry]

I thought so.

Like I said before, accurate vote counting is irrelevant to you and those like you. Winning is everything.

I simply hope your attitude doesn't indicate something dark about the future of America.

[Suburbanite]

Originally posted by OberonDOtherseid,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (OberonDOtherseid,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-rcne, Actually I voted for you sour grapes people. But, Snouter point of the snowbirds - residents in multiple states was waiting in the wings. I actually would be curious to see how many duplicate votes were actually cast. I think the entire election process is to easy to manipulate and question. For instance - why don't we have to show a photo ID to vote in the most powerful nation in the world. I need a photo ID to cash a check - but not to vote. Now that's crazy.

Where did you vote? I had to produce a valid picture ID.[/b][/quote]

I didn't. I voted in Los Angeles. I also worked the polls for the primaries and was not required to get ID of any kind.

[Osborn F Enready]

Patrick said: Like I said before, accurate vote counting is irrelevant to you and those like you. Winning is everything.

I simply hope your attitude doesn't indicate something dark about the future of America.

I say: You forget Patrick, that even though we are all citizens, some amongst us must be against our ideologies, in order for this wave of corruption to have taken hold in such a strong manner.

"Enemies among us" would be a good term to use. That is what I often reflect on when I get my typical responses to my posts that attempt to avoid the point, and instead attempt to discredit my words, or my person. Even during our creation, when people like Thomas Paine were trying to gather people with his "Common Sense" article, and multiple publications, there were still those loyal to the tyranny of England. Is it any wonder, that after the melting pot has been being added to for this amount of time there ARE people who are willing to sign over their voice for a chance at security? There are people who know not the cost of tyranny, and those are the ones who often gloss over current event, turn a blind eye to the increasing Corporate/Fascism in this country.

Yes, the whole road that is in front of us, there will be enemies in our midst, but the truth shines bright for those who wish to see it.

Maybe, he is just part of the problem Pat, and that is that.

3 million vote madate=sour grapes for some extreme anti-Bushes. I'm liberal, and I am not going to yell stolen this time. We lost because moral values defined this election, and those values are not true universal values that Democrats can promote-they are right-wing evangelist ideals that the Republicans can use for the extra 4 million voters Rove needed this time.

[Rainbow]

Originally posted by dot, We lost because moral values defined this election, and those values are not true universal values that Democrats can promote-they are right-wing evangelist ideals that the Republicans can use for the extra 4 million voters Rove needed this time.

Are you suggesting that people who cultivate moral values are : right-wing evangelists ?

[rcne]

Originally posted by Suburbanite,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Suburbanite,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by OberonDOtherseid,@ <!--QuoteBegin-rcne, Actually I voted for you sour grapes people. But, Snouter point of the snowbirds - residents in multiple states was waiting in the wings. I actually would be curious to see how many duplicate votes were actually cast. I think the entire election process is to easy to manipulate and question. For instance - why don't we have to show a photo ID to vote in the most powerful nation in the world. I need a photo ID to cash a check - but not to vote. Now that's crazy. Where did you vote? I had to produce a valid picture ID.

I didn't. I voted in Los Angeles. I also worked the polls for the primaries and was not required to get ID of any kind.[/b][/quote]

I voted in the great state of Ohio - ring any bells.

[little zz]

Stolen? We don't know.

A better poll might be "Did the US hold a fair election". The concludion would have to be NO.

And, bottom line, isn't that more important even that who won?

Pretty scary to think that the US, the "most free" nation might have a problem in the area of free and fair elections. And now we are on the spread our special brand of freedon to Iraq and beyond. Oh, my.

[OberonDOtherseid]

What was unfair about it?

[PatrickHenry]

Here's an article from the Hartford newspaper by a Yale Law School Dean: http://www.law.yale.edu/outside/html/Publi...yls_article.htm

I was shocked when the official election results started coming in so different from historically reliable exit poll results and my own gut sense of the results in Florida. But then the stories of voting irregularities poured in. There was the Ohio county where a memory card showed several thousand more votes for Bush than there were total votes cast. There was the machine in North Carolina that "lost" several thousand votes. There were the reports of several counties in Florida, all using optical scanner machines, where democratic precincts voted overwhelmingly for Bush. There was the realization that exit poll errors were correlated with the use of electronic voting machines. There was the sense that the data from the precincts where I had worked understated what felt like a Kerry landslide. And there were the increasing allegations of machine vulnerability to hacking made public by Blackboxvoting.org and others. And that's when I realized that I might have been an [SIZE=3]unwitting accessory to fraud[/SIZE]. Like every other Democrat, I had prepared to avoid the problems of 2000 only to be blindsided by new problems in 2004. We had been so worried about the safekeeping of paper ballots that we neglected the security of digital memory devices. We had been so worried about voting law that we neglected voting technology. Most important, we had been so worried about voter suppression in poor and minority areas that we didn't pay attention to voter inflation in Republican areas. We should have had trained observers - computer scientists, not lawyers! - verifying the integrity of polling data from machine upload through the tabulation of countywide and statewide results. Somehow we neglected the most vulnerable step in the vote-counting process, leaving a gaping hole for error and fraud, casting in doubt the validity of election results in many states.

See, Obe, fairness is not guaranteed in a system with win-at-any-cost Republicans in charge. Are you one of those? I hope not. I hope that anyone who cares enough to debate issues would care enough to want an accurate vote count.

[Rainbow]

And that's when I realized that I might have been an unwitting accessory to fraud.

The phrase "I might have been" does not supply (a reader) with any data that leads to a conclusion as if that took place (in fact).

[little zz]

Originally posted by OberonDOtherseid, What was unfair about it?

Hi Oberon.

There are many things that seem to have been unfair about the election. Here's one example that surfaced today: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...d=694&ncid=2043

There are dozens of others. One only needs to do a bit of research to think we might have a BIG problem here.