Obama birthplace cover-up revealed

[RickSp]

Quote by: Apeman81 You use of race is in no way amusing. To the contrary, it is a disingenuous, and yes, cowardly attempt to censure debate through the invocation of the despicable and revolting practice of racism. That, as you have stated, you “can find no other rational basis for the continuation of this foolishness.”, speaks volumes of your thought processes and mindset. Upon what “rational basis” do you assert that only racist tendencies can explain this situation?

Be careful that you don't fall off your high horse.

I guess you will now claim that no racism is involved in the Republican mailer showing watermelons planted on the White House lawn or the images of Obama as witch doctor in a loin cloth with a bone through his nose.

And I have still seen no rational reason for the birther hysteria in the face of documentation that Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: loser Personally, I really do believe that fraud was committed so that Obama could run for POTUS.

So what was that fraud?

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Zeebadee Obviously, from your rant, you really need some help getting over this. For the record, I've never claimed that he wasn't the president, I personally believe he has met all the requirements of his office, and I am not a member of the "birthers", no matter how much you claim I am. There is a large group of people that are not convinced that Obama has met the standard, though, and the refusal to release that last piece of paper is breeding citizen mistrust in our government, something we do not need more of. As for "escalating demands", that's simply a lie. All anyone has asked for is the original long form of the birth certificate, the release of which has been refused. So, get off my back, maybe try to sooth your anxiety with some more childish name calling.

Obviously you ARE a birther or you wouldn't have joined in with soothsayers side.

There is a large group of people that believe we never landed on the moon... are you going to defend them as well?

As for escalating demands, YOU are lying. They originally demanded his birth cert. and he posted the same thing everyone else would have posted. Then the birthers said that wasn't good enough, they want the long form...

He has passed the government's test like EVERY OTHER PRESIDENT so asking for more is nothing more than noise from the wingnuts.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Zeebadee Ah, another braindead post. What makes me a "birther"?? I've never made any claims about Obama's eligibility, I've only said that he could easily put the issue to rest.

What makes you a birther is speaking up for the birthers. Denying that you are a birther after defending their stupidity reveals you as a closet birther. That makes you worse than the birthers who at least have the nutsack to stand up and admit to being nutty.

"...repeating the same lies..."?? What "lies" are those? That the long form birth certificate hasn't been released?? Who's the one lying here?? Only the braindead seem to think it has.

And there's another lie from you. No one said the long form has been released. Mostly because it no longer exists according to the State of Hawaii. Are you going to claim that the State of Hawaii is colluding with the Obama admin to defraud the country? Go ahead and put another birther nail in that coffin, I dare you.

[Dan_77]

Quote by: Apeman81 What an absurd argument to make. Hawaii won't provide a copy of your personal birth certificate? Hawai‘i State Department of Health Here's how Hawaii does it.

And if you follow those procedures, you can get one of two things.

1) A COLB, which Obama has obtained and provided to anyone who asks to see it.
2) A "verification" of the document, which the Hawaii Secretary of State has provided numerous times on Obama's behalf.

"Certified copy" does not mean "photocopy." I repeat: You cannot obtain a copy of your so-called "long form" birth certificate from the State of Hawaii.

And before calling my statements "absurd" you should probably make sure yours are correct.

[Apeman81]

Quote by: RickSp Be careful that you don't fall off your high horse. I guess you will now claim that no racism is involved in the Republican mailer showing watermelons planted on the White House lawn or the images of Obama as witch doctor in a loin cloth with a bone through his nose. And I have still seen no rational reason for the birther hysteria in the face of documentation that Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.

Of what relevance are these assertions of what some other person may have done to what you have personally done by bringing race it this topic?

What profane leap of logic do you attempt to excuse what you have done by these purported examples?

You have demonstrated yourself a race baiter. You find yourself at the same level as those you decry in your post. Is that your defense? I’m no worse than these guys?

[Apeman81]

Quote by: Dan_77 And if you follow those procedures, you can get one of two things. 1) A COLB, which Obama has obtained and provided to anyone who asks to see it. 2) A "verification" of the document, which the Hawaii Secretary of State has provided numerous times on Obama's behalf. "Certified copy" does not mean "photocopy." I repeat: You cannot obtain a copy of your so-called "long form" birth certificate from the State of Hawaii. And before calling my statements "absurd" you should probably make sure yours are correct.

Susan Nordyke seems to have so obtained one.

Unveiled! Hawaii's 1961 long-form birth certificates | No Compromise when you're Right!

Please source your assertion that the state will refuse the individual a copy of his birth record.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Apeman81 There exist two conclusions to draw from the lack of transparency concerning the birth place of Obama. First, he was not born in Hawaii as claimed. Second, the use of “those people are crazy” obfuscation is so political successful that they choose to keep it in play. You may wish to remember his affinity for Saul Alinsky’s strategies for dealing with opposition.

There exists no lack of transparency on this matter. That you believe there to be so indicates your willingness to ignore the facts and continue to make the same assertions regardless. Obviously you do not care about facts but rather, your own selfishness desire to promote nonsense.

Once again you prove that you are not the logical creature you claim.

The “birthers” title is quite snappy in its derisiveness, after all.

Because they deserve nothing less. What do you call an idiot other than, and idiot. Would you prefer we called them "Obama birth idiots"?

My argument is not so much with Obama. After all, why should he feel the need to disprove this assertion while he is surrounded by a buffering group of fawning sycophants who would never dream of questioning his ascendancy?

Again, he has disproved the assertions. He has met all of the requirements to prove to the government that he is indeed a legal citizen born in the State of Hawaii.

Almost as disquieting as the complete apathy toward the law of the land concerning who may run for the presidency is the actual use of the “the law’s archaic” defense by some. Would these people make the same allowances for someone whose candidacy they did not support? I have seen far too much evidence to the negative to believe otherwise.

Regardless of your opinion of Obama supporters, you are incorrect, the requirements dictated by the "law of the land" have been met. What's disquieting is the denial of such by idiots.

Was Obama legally born in the United States? I don’t know. And that’s the important issue. Why should the proof of birth be so seemingly evasive?

Why do you require more documentation than any other president has been required? Could it be because you are another racist? When all other reasons have been disposed of we seem to be left only with racism. I guess you get to join soothsayer in the short list of racists we have right here on Volconvo. Will Z join it too or will he denounce the birthers and admit that the question is settled by law?

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Zeebadee Again, I only stated that it hasn't been released. If you want to prove me wrong, show me where it has.

Show us where the law indicates that he has not met the lawful requirements to be president.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Diogenes I said that and not Dan. And have you even read the Constitution or my previous post?

Thanks for reminding me, your post on the Constitution is wrong, contextually.

No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, and been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution,

office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty five years, *** and *** been fourteen Years a resident within the United States.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Apeman81 Ah. The true nugget of a typical “defend at all costs” response. You see, if you question Obama, about anything, the defense will eventually fall back on their tried and false strategy of personal attack, and in the case of Obama, accusations of racism.

When all other explanations are exhausted... not to mention that the birthers and their ilk have no problem conflating their demands with personal attack. You really can't admonish one without admonishing the other, unless you are one of those others.

This pathetically vapid fallback strategy of the weak of mind only works to placate their sense of propriety. It need not be true. It is enough that they are able make these baseless accusations.

Your feigned outrage exposes you as insincere.

My wife is blacker than Obama and my children just as black. So call me a racist, you ignorant poltroon, by all means. For I question much about Obama. His place of birth, his intentions for our country, the Marxists he surrounds himself with, and his own political ideology. You reveal yourself in your words, and the revelation repulses.

And you are free to do so. I too question much about Obama's admin (note the difference?) but I don't continue to question the same things once they have been answered. The Birth Cert question has been answered.

Actually, you simply send all the signals of a racist. So you can hardly blame the people who lump you in with the other people who are saying the same thing. I'm not saying that I don't believe that your wife and kids are black but I have no proof and I will therefore have to fall back on the evidence provided by you. That evidence makes you a racist.

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: NoJingoLingo What makes you a birther is speaking up for the birthers. Denying that you are a birther after defending their stupidity reveals you as a closet birther. That makes you worse than the birthers who at least have the nutsack to stand up and admit to being nutty.

What an incredibly ignorant post. If I stand up for equal rights for blacks, does that make me black?? Do I become Jewish if I speak up for Jews?? I suppose if I support the second amendment that makes me an NRA gun nut??

Quote by: NoJingoLingo And there's another lie from you. No one said the long form has been released.

You better go back and read some more. I never claimed anyone had said that.

Quote by: NoJingoLingo Mostly because it no longer exists according to the State of Hawaii. Are you going to claim that the State of Hawaii is colluding with the Obama admin to defraud the country? Go ahead and put another birther nail in that coffin, I dare you.

Again, your ignorance is showing.

"The Associated Press quoted Chiyome Fukino as saying that both she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate."
FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A.

How could she have done so if it had, as you claim, been destroyed?

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Apeman81 Not really. Hawaii will most assuredly provide a copy of the original documentation to the individual as well certain levels of family. So if Obama wanted to do "he can to prove his citizenship", he could rather easily provide the documentation. Thus, we are left to ponder why he has not. Why, indeed, so many around him work so hard to ensure it does not happen. The question is not so much what the facts are, but rather why the acquisition of the facts is denied, and why so few choose to ask. Obama is the elected president and it is unlikely beyond reason to expect that this will change. But pointing out the situational lack of interest has merit in itself.

Please address your nuttyness to this man.

"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago...."

Hawaii: Obama birth certificate is real - USATODAY.com

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Zeebadee Geez!! Once again, please pay attention this time. I have made no such claim!! All I've ever said was that if the long form was released, it would put a stop to such claims.

Please address your nuttyness to this man.

"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago...."

Hawaii: Obama birth certificate is real - USATODAY.com

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: Dan_77 I repeat: You cannot obtain a copy of your so-called "long form" birth certificate from the State of Hawaii. And before calling my statements "absurd" you should probably make sure yours are correct.

Well, that is an absurd statement, as you and I both know. If the President of the United States called the clerk and asked for a copy of his long form, we both know that he'd get it.

Rules are broken and waived all the time in the name of "national" interests. Surely national unity on this issue would be sufficient to get a waiver of the release rules.

[NoJingoLingo]

Quote by: Zeebadee What an incredibly ignorant post. If I stand up for equal rights for blacks, does that make me black?? Do I become Jewish if I speak up for Jews?? I suppose if I support the second amendment that makes me an NRA gun nut?? You better go back and read some more. I never claimed anyone had said that. Again, your ignorance is showing. "The Associated Press quoted Chiyome Fukino as saying that both she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate." FactCheck.org: Born in the U.S.A. How could she have done so if it had, as you claim, been destroyed?

Mea Culpa, I had at first been under the impression that when they went to electronic filing that the originals had been destroyed. See how easy it is to admit when you are wrong?

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: NoJingoLingo No one said the long form has been released. Mostly because it no longer exists according to the State of Hawaii.

Quote by: NoJingoLingo Please address your nuttyness to this man. "I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawaii State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago...."

Well, which is it???? You're contradicting yourself.

Edit to add:

Sorry, didn't see your post when I submitted this one.

[Dan_77]

Quote by: Apeman81 Susan Nordyke seems to have so obtained one.

.... in 1966, if you had cared to read the actual photostat.

Unveiled! Hawaii's 1961 long-form birth certificates | No Compromise when you're Right! Please source your assertion that the state will refuse the individual a copy of his birth record.

What is provided is the COLB, which you helpfully proved through your own link there (note the title of the document).

Over the years, information has been removed from the COLB because it is (1) not germane to the issue at hand and (2) involves possible HIPAA violations, since revealing the name of a patient in a hospital to someone else (even the patient's son) would violate HIPAA.

In 1966, one could get one with all that information on it. Today, not permitted. I could link you to HIPAA laws, but frankly after three years of law school I can barely muddle through them; assuredly they would be of little use to you.

Again, show me where an original, long-form birth certificate can currently be obtained.


The COLB is prima facie evidence of Obama's birth in any court of law. Therefore, unless you have something else, like a Kenyan birth certificate in his name, there is no debate.

[Apeman81]

NoJingoLingo;661810]When all other explanations are exhausted... not to mention that the birthers and their ilk have no problem conflating their demands with personal attack. You really can't admonish one without admonishing the other, unless you are one of those others.

All other explanations? Really? This is demonstrative of limited reasoning. Absent the dissemination of the original birth, for whatever reason you choose to believe it remains “secret”, you can no other possible explanation.

1. Some people think the persons claiming to have seen the actual record don’t believe them. (that must be racist!)

2.People may simply desire the ability to verify for themselves what others have been given the privilege of seeing. (Racists!)

Two possibilities that do not require racism.

Your feigned outrage exposes you as insincere.

And you know my “outrage” is feigned how?

Actually, you simply send all the signals of a racist. So you can hardly blame the people who lump you in with the other people who are saying the same thing. I'm not saying that I don't believe that your wife and kids are black but I have no proof and I will therefore have to fall back on the evidence provided by you. That evidence makes you a racist.

Oh this should be very elucidating. Please, pray tell, list the “signs” of which you speak and relate them to what I have “evidenced”.

[Dan_77]

In defense of "birthers," I don't happen to think they're all racists. I think a good number of them are just stupid, or credulous, or both.

In all cases, they have the psychological flaw common to conspiracy theorists, that of confirmation bias.