Another reason not to live in California

[Scribbler1]

Originally posted by Pooeypants, Btw, do you guys know what the Fuel tax rate in the UK is like? Look it up and you'll feel much better (supposing you're American).

I know. The last time I was there I saw a gas station sign that said .99. I thought that was pretty good until I saw it was PER LITER! (at least I THINK it was .99, but it was right around there in any event).

But I don't think the government's "tax it until it is so high people will conserve" line of BS is the answer. The people who can afford the Ford Expeditions and the Hummers can easily eat the difference while the poor slob with the '79 Grand Prix he bought for $50 will be the one gouged in the end. Besides, we don't need to be giving the government more money to toss into the mystery fund.

[westcoastdog]

Here's a question that I've been mulling over. How would my life change if gas cost $5/gallon, like in Europe? Every year I drive from San Francisco to the northwest, Portland and Seattle, a round trip of 2000 miles. Currently the total gas costs is $110. At $5 gallon, the fuel costs increases to $285. Depending on the increase of airfare, I may be tempted to fly rather than drive.

Because SF has excellent public transportation, I don't use my car more than a few times a week, so my lifestyle would not be affected locally.

While we will not see $5 gallon gas soon, I would not be surprised to see it around the year 2010.

Would your lifestyles change drastically?

[Mr.Vicchio]

I f gas artificially cost that much, then there would be a revolt.

[Compugasm]

Originally posted by westcoastdog, Would your lifestyles change drastically?

No, because there are no shortage of stores/malls in San Diego. Reducing the number of shopping trips, might save me 5miles a week. However, the drive to work is 35 miles, takes no less than 1hr each way, assuming there isn't a vehical on fire, or a matress in the road.

[Scribbler1]

Originally posted by Compugasm,+--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='0' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Compugasm,)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin-westcoastdog, Would your lifestyles change drastically?

No, because there are no shortage of stores/malls in San Diego. Reducing the number of shopping trips, might save me 5miles a week. However, the drive to work is 35 miles, takes no less than 1hr each way, assuming there isn't a vehical on fire, or a matress in the road.[/b][/quote]

I think a lot of people who live on or near the coast (west or east) don't really understand just how much driving the rest of the country does. I've known a few people (Texas, Colorado, for example) who think nothing of jumping in the car and taking a 500 mile DAY TRIP, and returning the same day. I'm south of Philly and I can get to the shore, New York, Baltimore and DC as a day trip, but if a trip[ lasts longer than an hour, one way, we get a motel room.
You put that kind of mileage on the buggy and you WILL see a big difference.

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Scribbler1, I know. The last time I was there I saw a gas station sign that said .99. I thought that was pretty good until I saw it was PER LITER! (at least I THINK it was .99, but it was right around there in any event). But I don't think the government's "tax it until it is so high people will conserve" line of BS is the answer. The people who can afford the Ford Expeditions and the Hummers can easily eat the difference while the poor slob with the '79 Grand Prix he bought for $50 will be the one gouged in the end. Besides, we don't need to be giving the government more money to toss into the mystery fund.

Price right now is about 80 pence/litre (about $1.40 per litre) average nationwide. I think about 70% of that is tax, though I'm not exactly sure where all the money is going...

[Scribbler1]

Originally posted by Pooeypants, Price right now is about 80 pence/litre (about $1.40 per litre) average nationwide. I think about 70% of that is tax, though I'm not exactly sure where all the money is going...

I'm not sure either. Here in Delaware the taxes are supposed to go to road maintenence but who knows. Out of sight out of mind. Is there a federal tax on gas?

[PatrickHenry]

Originally posted by Scribbler1, Is there a federal tax on gas?

18.3 cents per gallon http://www.artba.org/economics_research/cu...s/real_cost.pdf

[Mr.Vicchio]

Down in Texas, its nothing for me to make a trip from Corpus to San Antonio, 2 hours or so. Visit my Grandparents and Aunt in Kerrville (another 1 hour r so.) Spend the night, head to Houston fto see more family, (3.5 hours) then head home two days later. 4.5 hours.

That was just for a 4 day weekend, once a month.

Tottal time in car on average, would be 20 hours driving over 4 days, 2 fillups by the time I hit the house again.

[Compugasm]

I thought we were talking about daily drive kinda stuff?

[Mia]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, Imagine pulling up to the gas pump, and instead of the usual gas tax - 18 cents per gallon in California - the pump charges you a fee based on the miles you drove since your last gas purchase. A computer in your car, connected to your odometer, transmits your mileage to a computer in the pump, which calculates the fee and adds it to your gas bill on the spot. Imagine pulling up to the gas pump, and instead of the usual gas tax - 18 cents per gallon in California - the pump charges you a fee based on the miles you drove since your last gas purchase. A computer in your car, connected to your odometer, transmits your mileage to a computer in the pump, which calculates the fee and adds it to your gas bill on the spot. http://www.sacbee.com/content/politics/sto...-11221326c.html Scared yet? You should be.

You should be scared of a lot more than gas taxes. What you wrote is yet more evidence that big brother is here.

[Mr.Vicchio]

Thats what I was reffering too Mia, Big Brother.

[Compugasm]

This message from another post, is relevant here:

Originally posted by Pooeypants, I'm talking about extreme measures to curb Pollution that can be bad for the environment...can't see anything [in your post] to show me.

Ok, fair enough. It isn't "extreme" on the surface, so in this post, I'll twist logic to make it so: They've taken one freeway lane, and one entrance lane and turned them into carpool lanes. The carpool lanes are now empty. How can that be, when 2 occupants are considered a carpool? Because traffic does not work like water through a garden hose.

California is the model for urban sprawl. There are many occupations, like delivery drivers, where carpooling makes no difference. All trucks/cars trying are now squeezed into a single entrace ramp. In a ripple effect, this backs up the regular streets and intersections.

As pointed out by people in other states, Californians don't have to drive far. This makes it even harder to arrange carpooling. Carpooling is utopian thinking for working in large buildings and long distances. NOT, small stores and short trips.

If they repealed the carpool lane rules tomorrow, and reduced millions of drivers daily commute to work by even 1 minute, you do the math. It's now my view that this new legislation is extreme. They'll pat each other on the back for the next 5 years as "doing everything they can to lower pollution". The freeway will still be jammed, but it WILL reduce your drive time if you can get on the damn thing. Or bypass the people trying to get onto it.

[Compugasm]

Encouragement to work alternative working shifts should be highly pushed. Especially delivery drivers. Between 9pm and 5am, the freeways are comparative ghost towns.

[Pooeypants]

Or how about we encourage people to take public transport when possible and to actually share vehicles?

[Mr.Vicchio]

Encourage is fine, when you legislate such, then it becomes wrong.

The freedom to choose how one gets to work is something that makes living in America great.

[Pooeypants]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, Encourage is fine, when you legislate such, then it becomes wrong. The freedom to choose how one gets to work is something that makes living in America great.

If people won't take the incentive then it should be enforced. Air pollution is a real issue, even if people think ignorance is bliss.

[Mia]

Originally posted by Mr.Vicchio, Thats what I was reffering too Mia, Big Brother.

You mean Big Jr. He's the one bringing all this about!

Sorry, I know he's your buddy. But if you don't like the Big Brother Concept, why do you love the man bringing it into your life?

Please don't go on a rant. I asked a legitimate question.

[Compugasm]

Pooey, here is a fun kitchen experiment. Take some sugar, and pour it into a container with a funnel. Keeping the funnel half full. Now, repeat the experiment, this time pure the sugar until it spills over the side of the funnel. Is the sugar coming out the hole any faster? No matter what size the hole is, the sugar travels at the same speed. This is our traffic situation. Openning the carpool lane will not end traffic, but it will widen the hole.

Every once and a while, a clump of sugar comes out, and blocks the hole. This could be a truck, a matress, an accident, etc... It's easier to clear this blockage when the funnel is not filled to the brim.

[westcoastdog]

Here are some gasoline taxes on gasoline by state. The last column is the total state/fed. Sorry about the lack of formatting.

State State
Excise Other State
Taxes Total State
Taxes Total Federal &
State Taxes

Alabama 16 5 21 39.4
Alaska 8 8 26.4
Arizona 18 1 19 37.4
Arkansas 21.5 0.2 21.7 40.1
California 18 14 32 50.4
Colorado 22 22 40.4
Connecticut 25 4.7 29.7 48.1
Delaware 23 23 41.4
Dist. of Columbia 20 20 38.4
Florida 13.6 16 29.6 48
http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/statisti...state_2002.html