American Taxpayers deserve their $700 BILLION bailout tab!

[johnwk]

.

I am hesitant in writing what I’m about to write, but it’s time to step up to the plate and lay blame exactly where blame belongs, and time to end pointing fingers at the “greedy” Wall Street Crowd which merely seized upon an golden opportunity handed to them on a silver platter by the gullible American voter.

If there is a root cause responsible for the Fannie/Freddie collapse and the American Taxpayers being left on the hook for over $700 BILLION, surely it would be the tens of millions of default payments on high risk mortgages which were made possible by activist groups such as ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now), President Clinton and other elected members of Congress via Freddie and Fannie, a government created entity in which its political plum job holders raked in millions upon millions as CEO‘s, while losses were well known would eventually be dumped in the laps of the gullible American Taxpayer.

But fear not, millions of undeserving individuals were handed the American Dream while being bribed for their vote during federal elections. But then again, this is how the Washington Establishment’s political plum job empire operates___ it pretends to help the poor while it rewards itself with outrageous salaries, top of the shelf federal medical plans and a very generous pension plan, all of which Mary and Joe Sixpack can only dream of having but are taxed to finance!

And so, taxpayers who have elected and reelected public servants who knowingly lowered mortgage loan standards, and who closed their eyes to risky loans, and even encouraged these bad loans to continue by blocking Freddie/Fannie legislative reforms in order to continuer bribing voters with the American Dream, are now being held responsible with a $700 BILLION bailout tab for voting these scoundrels into office. Keep in mind this $700 BILLION bailout appears to be a first installment to partially cover foreign investors who had their money tied up in Freddie and Fannie loans.

And what does our current election reveal? Obama is ahead in the polls. A con artist is ahead in the polls who worked with ACORN, which not only encouraged risky loans to be handed out via Freddie and Fannie to unqualified loan seekers, but actually organized scare tactics against targeted banks, alleging racism when loans were denied, and threatened legal action under CRA [the Community Reinvestment Act passed in 1977] if risky loans were not handed out, all of which has now resulted in Obama’s undeserving loans coming home to roost, and, the American Taxpayer being burdened with a $700 BILLION bailout tab. And Obama is ahead in the polls? I suggest that Obama is part of the problem and not the solution. I also suggest that Barney Frank, Chris Dodd, Chuck Schumer and all those in Congress who worked to prevent reform legislation to end irresponsible loans being given out via Freddie and Fannie ought to be pinked slipped from Congress, tarred and feathered for their complicity in the Freddie and Fannie melt down, and then banished from America.

Another part of the problem are voters who believe they can vote a free lunch from the federal treasury. But the bottom line is, there is no magic wand in government force being used to tax one individual for the personal economic needs of another which changes the definition of theft. These voters are not only a very real problem in preserving a free market system on American soil, but they are in fact domestic enemies of our constitutionally limited “Republican Form of Government” which is guaranteed to us by Article 4, Section 4 of our federal Constitution. How we deal with these thieves is something which the lovers of liberty must quickly figure out.

In closing, can anyone reading this imagine Obama making the following statement during his political campaign, which was made by one of our nation’s founding fathers:

"Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man's labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny." ___ Rep. Giles, speaking before Congress February 3rd, 1792

JWK

If we can make 51 percent of America’s population dependent upon a federal government check, we can then buy their vote, keep ourselves in power and keep the remaining portion of America’s working population enslaved to pay the bills ____ Obama’s game plan, a plan to establish a federal plantation on American soil.

[ironeagle]

I don't think so. I do htink americans are responsible to some degree as we don't tend to pay much attention to what our government does and even when we do we do little if anything to stop them from overspending and using our money for things that are not something our money should eb spent on, but honestly I blame liberals and socialists for this problem. They rae the ones who always try to pass laws,a dn get money for more coddling of people, more tax refunds more programs, but they fund unecisary programs and ignore the programs that really need funding. I thinkl they are the ones who are responsible. Don't put all Americans in your category. I did not vote for any of these morons who are stealing our money, nor did I vote for any of these socailistic programs, they soend our money on. The 401K's are gambling and it is the people's own fault for not saving it into an intrest bearing account instead. I don't want to see innocent families who have chosen not to gamble their life savings, paying for the mistakes of others.

[Deadeye]

The really terrible element in this whole sub-prime mess is the folks who created it, are now telling us they'll fix it. They are just looking for a way to give out more sub-prime loans. They think that giving loans to those who do not qualify is actually good! Well, it's actually bad.

Now, here comes Obama. His financial advisor, a fellow named Raines; is the same fellow who cooked the books at Fannie Mae to cause this mess in the first place. And it's men like Obama who helped to run ACORN who put the system in place and then extorted banks to effect the sub-prime loans. And now Obama is about to show up in the White House with Raines on his right hand.

What a mess is in our future. The market was down 800 points today, and this is after the "bail out" bill has been passed. So the market doesn't like it, but I'll bet Democrats do....some Repubs as well. Certainly the president is behind this.

The subprime tragedy and the economic downturn that has accompanied this is a construct of government. Failed government to be sure, but they don't seem to have learned their lesson. Maybe we will see the demise of our capitalist system and maybe we will see the United States formed along the lines of socialists European nations. Certainly that's the goal of the Democrats.

[grandpa]

Quote by: Deadeye The really terrible element in this whole sub-prime mess is the folks who created it, are now telling us they'll fix it. They are just looking for a way to give out more sub-prime loans.

They're unlikely to clean up this mess. The subprime
lenders have become more aggressive. That's part of what the bailout is about.

Grandpa h.

[Morality Games]

Quote by: Deadeye The really terrible element in this whole sub-prime mess is the folks who created it, are now telling us they'll fix it. They are just looking for a way to give out more sub-prime loans. They think that giving loans to those who do not qualify is actually good! Well, it's actually bad. Now, here comes Obama. His financial advisor, a fellow named Raines; is the same fellow who cooked the books at Fannie Mae to cause this mess in the first place. And it's men like Obama who helped to run ACORN who put the system in place and then extorted banks to effect the sub-prime loans. And now Obama is about to show up in the White House with Raines on his right hand. What a mess is in our future. The market was down 800 points today, and this is after the "bail out" bill has been passed. So the market doesn't like it, but I'll bet Democrats do....some Repubs as well. Certainly the president is behind this. The subprime tragedy and the economic downturn that has accompanied this is a construct of government. Failed government to be sure, but they don't seem to have learned their lesson. Maybe we will see the demise of our capitalist system and maybe we will see the United States formed along the lines of socialists European nations. Certainly that's the goal of the Democrats.

Those "socialist" European nations have it pretty good. I wish I were as prosperous as the Scandinavians.

[johnwk]

Quote by: Deadeye The really terrible element in this whole sub-prime mess is the folks who created it, are now telling us they'll fix it. .

You don't know how right you are! And just where does the sub prime loan mess begin?

The seeds of today's financial meltdown lie in the Community Reinvestment Act - a law passed in 1977 and made riskier by unwise amendments and regulatory rulings in later decades. CRA was meant to encourage banks to make loans to high-risk borrowers, often minorities living in unstable neighborhoods. That has provided an opening to radical groups like ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) to abuse the law by forcing banks to make hundreds of millions of dollars in "subprime" loans to often uncreditworthy poor and minority customers. Any bank that wants to expand or merge with another has to show it has complied with CRA - and approval can be held up by complaints filed by groups like ACORN. In fact, intimidation tactics, public charges of racism and threats to use CRA to block business expansion have enabled ACORN to extract hundreds of millions of dollars in loans and contributions from America's financial institutions. Banks already overexposed by these shaky loans were pushed still further in the wrong direction when government-sponsored Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac began buying up their bad loans and offering them for sale on world markets. Fannie and Freddie acted in response to Clinton administration pressure to boost homeownership rates among minorities and the poor. However compassionate the motive, the result of this systematic disregard for normal credit standards has been financial disaster. _________ CLICK HERE for the full story

As we find out, the engine behind our current Fannie Freddie melt down began in the 1990’s when Madeline Talbot, a close friend and business associate of Obama, worked together with ACORN who started to use intimidating tactics to literally force banks to hand out sub prime mortgage loans to individuals who were not financially qualified to payoff these loans. The charge of “racism” was successively used as one of ACORN’s most powerful weapons to gain these high risk sub prime loans which Freddie and Fannie were literally force to buy! A specific Clinton policy required half of Freddie and Fannie loans to be sub prime loans, and which culminated in our current economic crisis in which the pensions and life savings of prudent hard working Americans have been stolen. And who do we have to thank, Obama, his friend Madeline Talbot, and the socialist ACORN gang which is now working to steal the election and put a socialist democratic party in power over the United States of America!

And let us not forget the above does not even take into account Obama’s pals in Congress like Barney Frank, Christopher Dodd, Maxine Waters , and other democrat socialists who blatantly stood in the way of proposed legislation to regulate Fannie and Freddie sub prime loan hand outs.

McCain needs to talk about the economy and point to Obama’s direct association with ACORN, Madeline Talbot a “community organizer” which started the slippery slope with high risk mortgage loans being handed out to people without the financial means to meet their payments. Another good article on this issue is O'S DANGEROUS PALS

The unadulterated truth is, Obama had his hand in starting the financial melt down engine [high risk loans] which we are now paying for through the nose. And Obama wants to talk about the economy? He’s responsible for our economy’s current condition!


JWK

[Night]

Quote by: Morality Games Those "socialist" European nations have it pretty good. I wish I were as prosperous as the Scandinavians.

Oh yes, the Europeans are doing fabulous.

European Banks: The Bailouts Continue - BusinessWeek

Bank falls hit European shares | Herald Sun

Europe Struggles for a Response to the Bank Crisis - TIME

BBC NEWS | Business | UK economy 'already in recession'

That $100b bailout plan being drawn up in Britain? Its just your imagination.

BBC NEWS | Business | British Government to unveil bank rescue

[Deadeye]

Quote by: Night Oh yes, the Europeans are doing fabulous. European Banks: The Bailouts Continue - BusinessWeek Bank falls hit European shares | Herald Sun Europe Struggles for a Response to the Bank Crisis - TIME BBC NEWS | Business | UK economy 'already in recession' That $100b bailout plan being drawn up in Britain? Its just your imagination. BBC NEWS | Business | British Government to unveil bank rescue

Well, be careful what you wish for. Your desires are about to be adopted in the US. Obama and his band of merry Democrats will work to shape the US in the European mold. So what you desire is about to happen. Least I think so.

I don't know what "real Americans" will be able to do about it. I guess we'll just have to sit back and take it in the shorts. This will cause the left overwhelming glee.

[Deadeye]

Quote by: grandpa They're unlikely to clean up this mess. The subprime lenders have become more aggressive. That's part of what the bailout is about. Grandpa h.

It was not the lender who were the source of the problem. It was regulations put in place by the government agences that we all know of as Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac. It was they who established the underwriting guidelines. It was they, along with organizations such as ACORN who forced banks to make the sub-prime loans.

Rules to provide a loan were,

1. no social security card

2. no proof of citizenship required

3. no proof of long term, reliable employment

4. no downpayment required

Many banks were required to loan to illegal immigrants....in LA half of all of the sub-prime recipiants were illegal immigrants.

Now the government set these rules and it was the government that demanded that the banks use them to loan money. It was the government who demanded that the banks loan the money, if not they were called racists, etc... It was Obama's job to teach ACORN operatives how to extorte money from the banks in the form of sub-prime loans.

Now the system is run by the same idiots who put the problem in place in the first place. I just wonder what the economic situation will look like in four years after Obama is elected.

I wonder how the terrorists will deal with their victory in Iraq and in the Middle East. No worry, Obama will imploy his great wealth of experience to deal effectively with the terrorists. Surrender will, of course; be his first and favorite move.

[Nono]

Quote by: Night The Europeans are doing fabulous.

We Europeans have our economic ups and downs like everybody else. But wealth is redistributed more equitably in our societies (well, in Western Europe) than in the US -- there aren't the Third-World-style extremes of poverty'n'wealth here that you see in the States.

Europe realizes that a healthy, well-educated populace is more productive than a bunch of nail-biters watching their tax dollars being wasted on nutty military adventures.

[Deadeye]

Quote by: Nono We Europeans have our economic ups and downs like everybody else. But wealth is redistributed more equitably in our societies (well, in Western Europe) than in the US -- there aren't the Third-World-style extremes of poverty'n'wealth here that you see in the States. Europe realizes that a healthy, well-educated populace is more productive than a bunch of nail-biters watching their tax dollars being wasted on nutty military adventures.

And right you are. Americans should tax all of it's people for all of their income and then divide the money collected by the number of the people and then distribute it equally. This is a Liberal ideal.

Eveyone knows that taxing the people to a maximum amount causes them to become more productive and better workers. Europeans have been trying to explain this to Americans for decades.

Soon, because we refuse to build nuke power plants and will not drill, gasoline will become too expensive for us to buy. Then we'll all walk, or take the bus or a train. Just as Europeans do today. Sure some drive, but it's really expensive to do so; only the very rich drive lots.

Obama wants to make us all equally poor. He also wants the US to be as weak militarily as are European countries. Obama seeks a mediocre America. So do you.

Say, who is going to stick their chins out against the Red Chinese? We certainly won't be strong enough to do it. I guess it'll be up to you guys.

[WindWip]

Quote by: johnwk If there is a root cause responsible for the Fannie/Freddie collapse and the American Taxpayers being left on the hook for over $700 BILLION, surely it would be the tens of millions of default payments on high risk mortgages which were made possible by activist groups such as ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now), President Clinton and other elected members of Congress via Freddie and Fannie, a government created entity in which its political plum job holders raked in millions upon millions as CEO‘s, while losses were well known would eventually be dumped in the laps of the gullible American Taxpayer.

Lets break down your claims and get some support for them. You named ACORN and Clinton specifically, I'll ignore the rest unless you wanted to be more specific with those politicians.

Lets start with ACORN. ACORN is a community association. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think that community associations have the power to force banks to provide loans for low income housing.

As for Clinton - are you saying he is to blame because he agreed to let Fannie and Freddie get affordable-housing credit by buying subprime securities which includes loans to low-income borrowers?

And what does our current election reveal? Obama is ahead in the polls. A con artist is ahead in the polls who worked with ACORN, which not only encouraged risky loans to be handed out via Freddie and Fannie to unqualified loan seekers, but actually organized scare tactics against targeted banks, alleging racism when loans were denied, and threatened legal action under CRA [the Community Reinvestment Act passed in 1977] if risky loans were not handed out, all of which has now resulted in Obama’s undeserving loans coming home to roost

Which scare tactics were you referring to. Any sources on that? Any evidence of the threats of undeserved legal action?

I didn't find much validity to the remainder of your arguements. If you can support your claims I'd love to discuss them with you.

[Nono]

Quote by: Deadeye This is a Liberal ideal.

No it ain't. Rubbish. As are the other misrepresentations of fact in your post.

But then you're the fella who said that Eisenhower had kept taxes low.

[HelioPrime]

Quote by: Morality Games Those "socialist" European nations have it pretty good. I wish I were as prosperous as the Scandinavians.

Is Iceland among those nations? Are they not facing there own bank worries now? At least according to the news Russia is looking to bail them out at the possible cost of basing military forces there to keep power in the Atlantic.

I don't think we can ever compare ourselves to small nations like that. They have nowhere near the population numbers or mass numbers of lower class citizens and non citizens.

[ironeagle]

I have an idea then why don't we just put up a sign that says illegal irmmigrants welcome, please come to your local DHS office and recieve your free, house, free medical insurance, card, free car, monthly cash grant, and food stamp card. Enjoy free education in our substandard schools and pick any American's job for yourself, we'll give it to you for free!

[johnwk]

Wake up America, this is what our Socialist Democrat Party has been doing to win elections.


First they get “poor people”, most of whom do not pay taxes, registered to vote via ACORN. And then they buy these “poor people’s” vote by promising to loot the federal treasury. They promised to give “poor people” everything from a sub prime mortgage loan to buy a home which they could not meet the payments on; they promised to give “poor people” free health care which is free for them but paid by taxpayers; and they promised to give “poor people” every other imaginable economic need which in fact would always be paid for by those paying taxes. And what did these “poor people” have to do to change their economic circumstances? Nothing which has to do with paying taxes. All they had to do is vote for a Socialist Democrat who has promised to loot the federal treasury.


The sad truth is, this political game plan has now resulted in our current economic collapse which began with a Socialist Democrat party policy of handing out reckless mortgage loans to “poor people” which then bled into Freddie and Fannie and has played a major part in our nation’s economic collapse. This economic collapse then creates more “poor people” and strengthens the Socialist Democrat Party’s potential voting base. Does this explain why our founding fathers required people who vote to be tax payers [property owners]?


This election can be summed up as follows: TAX PAYERS vs. TAX GETTERS


JWK


If we can make 51 percent of America’s population dependent upon a federal government check, we can then bribe them for their vote, keep ourselves in power and keep the remaining portion of America’s working population enslaved to pay the bills ____ Obama’s Marxist political game plan, a plan to establish a federal plantation.

[Dan_77]

Quote by: Deadeye Rules to provide a loan were, 1. no social security card 2. no proof of citizenship required 3. no proof of long term, reliable employment 4. no downpayment required Many banks were required to loan to illegal immigrants....in LA half of all of the sub-prime recipiants were illegal immigrants.

Utter and total nonsense. Any proof that these were the "rules" to provide a loan governing banks?

I wonder how the terrorists will deal with their victory in Iraq and in the Middle East. No worry, Obama will imploy his great wealth of experience to deal effectively with the terrorists. Surrender will, of course; be his first and favorite move.

Ah yes, no drooling "conservative" post is complete without the "T" word!

[xyzer]

Nono..Do you realize how silly some of your assertions are?

Europe realizes that a healthy, well-educated populace is more productive than a bunch of nail-biters watching their tax dollars being wasted on nutty military adventures.

You evidently echo some of Sen Obmas nonsense about costs.
How does $70 billion a year stack up against $700Billion in one "fell swoop'? More yet to come as financial markets world wide are affected! That healthy, well educated populace over the world is due for a financial shock.

The cost of the Iraqi war/occupation is "chump Change" when compared to perfidy of some in the Democrat Party of the USA who aided and abetted the loan scandal! Senator Obama himself aided and abetted....UPDATED: Obama Sued Citibank Under CRA to Force it to Make Bad Loans | Media Circus in this travesty of political correctness gone wild. "Every Citizen has a right to own a home and we Democrats will assure that" was the refrain by do gooders from the Clinton Years onward. Representatives Frank and Pelosi, Senators like Dodd, Obama/ Reid and others promoted and protected these tainted loans!All are culpable in this travesty inflicted on the tax payers!

It wasn't just legislation, it included blocking attempts at reform and assuring the populace everything was going great. Tivodan is spot on! Deadeye gives examples of the ridiculous travesty.
You are an example of the ignorance of most of the masses. That ignorance and media sensationalism will help perpetuate in office the political criminals involved and may verywell elect one culprit to the office of the Presidency in the USA? After a Democrat majority was achieved in the Congress a couple of years bac k, it was proudly announced that there were hundreds of congressional oversight investigations in progress ferreting out law breakers in government. Guess what... the issue of fraudulent loan practices was not subject to said Democrat oversight?

[grandpa]

Quote by: Deadeye It was not the lender who were the source of the problem. It was regulations put in place by the government agences that we all know of as Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac.

It was government policies and, of course, a whole lot of corruption.

Grandpa h.

[Nono]

Nono..Do you realize how silly some of your assertions are?

Fraid I don't, x.
But hearing it from you is mighty reassuring.