Talking to terrorists.

[Technosoul]

I can understand why it is wrong to talk to terroists because if you give into their demands you would encourge more rude acts like hostage taking and so forth.

But I think we should open more doors for the purpose of communicating and listening to the real concerns of people who get so fustrated they lash out with certain acts of so-called terrorism and/or violent protests.

Bin Laden once offered to share his wisdom with the immoral nations that he did not like after he declaried his holy war agenda but before the 9-11 attacks took place. No one in high office thought it was important to listen to his complaint or to attempt to make some effort to debate the problems he was worried about.

Now if a SWAT TEAM arrives at a hostage emergency they try to get on the phone and talk the guy into a more peaceful settlement (without giving into demands), why can't President Bush do the same thing (meaning allowing experts to do it). Why is it taboo to do that? Why can't we at least try to understand their concerns about walmarting the middle east with capitolism and freedom of nudity? Why can't we concider that this might be a direct attack on the Islamic belief system? Why can't we look at alternative solutions to those economic and morality issues and see if we can deal with that in a respectful manner, instead of shooting them or having the Vice President telling them to F...off like he did Congress?

What's your opinion?
Technosoul.

Note; do not bring peace pipe because it is unlawful to smoke in public meeting halls.

[Samildanach]

I agree to a certain extent, however you are assuming that they can be talked out of it. There is a difference between some guy in a building who has a hostage and a terrorist organisation. The guy in the building usually ends up in that kind of situation as a last resort, its usually not planned and hence you have a chance to talk him out of it because hes not hell bent on self destruction.
Terrorists usually have a stated aim/purpose/agenda they will stick through hell and high water due to religious fanaticism and indoctrination from an early age...a good example would be republicans. Indoctrinated from an early age with such books as 'Right wing beliefs for beginners', 'Don't question the leader', 'War is a good thing' and 'Oil at any cost' they are a prime example of how fanaticism can be applied to young pliable minds to warp them into submission. Keep your children away from the latest right wing books out there, 'Moore is the devil' and 'No oil, no rights.' coming to a bookstore soon near you.

[Technosoul]

It would seem that is possible to commuicate a solution with a terrorist leader of an organizaton more so then with some emotional and unpredictable who has self-destructive or depressive mind set.

If they are intelligent enough to plan out a complext plot and are smart enough to know how to talk their pawns into beliving their philosophy or religious dogma then they should likewise be intelligent enough to see the benifits of debate and how worded communicaton can effect the results they hope for. And in some cases all they hope for is some respect for their points-of-view.

Such as the cases of hostage taking in Iraq, did we ever concider that their demands that we end our occupation might be right, and that we are just to blockheaded to admit we are wrong?

What would happen if we opened Iraq TV stations and allowed those people to debate us in a public forum about our occupation and attempted controls over their political system? And what if we allowed the people to vote or announced we would allow a 3rd party (UN?) to conduct a poll among the people to find out which side of the debate they believe in and want done? At which time we would continue reconstruction or pull out in conformity with the desires of the public opinions in Iraq? They would not have to take hostages and make demands if they knew they could go on TV and debate the issues and have hope of gaining their demands in a respectful way. A lot of them are upset just because they are out of work and we are paying outsiders big bucks to drive the reconstruction trucks and to contract for repair jobs. It is more like a union protest then it is terrorism.

Why are we not listening to that part of the demands nor doing something effective to get them employed doing what we hire outsiders to do?

I hope I have properly related what might be on the minds of those hostage takers in Iraq, but note I am not a spokesperson for them so I might be in error. What do you all think? Technosoul.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Then, of course, there is the chance that al Qaida is actually trained and organized by CIA and we HAVE BEEN (caps for emphasis) in communication all along, and things are going along smoothly according to script.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Originally posted by Technosoul, And what if we allowed the people to vote or announced we would allow a 3rd party (UN?) to conduct a poll among the people to find out which side of the debate they believe in and want done? At which time we would continue reconstruction or pull out in conformity with the desires of the public opinions in Iraq?

Only problem with that.... You would have to check with the Big W to see if that would interfere with any Imperial Agenda.

[Technosoul]

Only problem with that.... You would have to check with the Big W to see if that would interfere with any Imperial Agenda.[/quote]

Well if Big W will not cooperate we will just go it on our own, Big W has had enough time to prove he can bring peace to the Middleeast and he was too weak with all his weapons to enforce peace through violence. So we must go it on our own and stay the corse until we reconstruct the fallen status of the USA and until wisdom wins.

And if Bush attempts to terroorise our peace agenda, bring em on. Who's afraid of the Big Bad Bush, no one.

Power to the people. hip hip hooray.

Technosoul.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Send me an email if you need any help with that.

[Scribbler1]

I think Bush's biggest failure was not that he didn't bring peace to the Middle East but his attempts to make us think he COULD! These fine fellows hated our guts before Bush got to Washington and will hate us after he leaves. Of course they hate us MORE now, but we weren't exactly on their christmas card list before.

[Technosoul]

So what? Disscrimation is everywhere. Why half the folks hate Republicans and the other half hate Liberals and that is just the people living here in the USA.

What I am saying is that such hatred cannot be truely resolved by dropping cluster bombs on my neighbors house because he is a Republican and hates my guts. At best we should just avoid each other or become involved in debates and conversations that can generate a better undersanding between us. It demands intelligence to know how to debate in a respectful way so that you both can come to a common ground that can be agreed upon by both perspectives.

Sort of like the rules set up here by the monitor department. People need to study up on conflict resolution methodlogies. Most so-called terrorist are not just crazy people who went kookoo. They are people like you and me with passions for a side or a cause of some kind that believe in dealing with such hatred the same way Bush deals with his. "Off with their heads" as the Queen in the Alice (through the looking glass) book would shout. That is no way to run the world.

If we do not learn the arts of communication we will all end up like the people at the tower of Babel. With no common cause or common purpose, just seperated people who keep typing "I do not understand where you are coming form".

Techosoul.

[Samildanach]

I do not understand where you are coming from.

[Compugasm]

Originally posted by Samildanach, indoctrination from an early age...

Only the brainwashed would assume the others are brainwashed.

[Samildanach]

Thats the best comeback you've got? Come on give me something to work with. The rest of the indoctrinated republicans stayed sensibly silent.

[Young]

Comp isn't Pro Bush....You can tell by his Signature.....He's spoofing Bush's use of Terrorism to gain control and acting Bushwashed to give those on the verge of seeing the light....something to "Look" 4......3 Ker Bush, also referred to as Kurry Bush...was what The Ram Caught Its Horns In....that being the Ram Abraham Sacrificed instead of having to Sacrifice Isaac....because the Preparation to do it Proved that He Loved and Honored the Lord.....So We must Sacrifice Them....Jesus says "In 3 Dayz" I write that with a Z, so You can follow, Nov. 3rd "In a Daze" In 3 Daze....Rebuild, First Two are Parties of Destruction, Glory be on the 3rd day....Party.....Ralph Nader....Ralph/Puke/Purge, Nader... Redan/Reading "As in to Kids" Ralph/Puke Over 7 Minutes/Tower 7

7. At that time salt and water will be sold by the weight, there will be only one kind of cereal, the cardinal directions will be reversed, the prasad will be of saffron.

8. When four hours (only) will remain before the universe (is destroyed) the ak tree will give mangoes, the margosa tree (nim) raisins, the ker bush will give pan leaves measuring one hand and a half, the Peepal will give flowers weighing one kilogram,

9. Gold will give a pleasant smell, Kalinga will plough (the earth), it will be necessary to churn the milk of the she-camel and of the she-elephant. He (the Lord) will give children to sterile women,

10. Having summoned Balchand he will make him a firm promise. The Swami Raja will cause everybody to eat and vomit all the grains that have been stored on the earth (the meaning is indeed rather obscure), bringing them all to one opinion (mind), and gathering all this together he will give a banquet.

http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0784caradh.html

Our Deliverance ?

http://www.realbikaner.com/palace/junagarh/site.html

Answers Jesus

http://www.jesusanswers.com/christia.../sacrifice.htm

Explanation

http://www.raptureready.us/ishmael.htm

Who wants to Play on My Field?

{Gen 22:13} Abraham looked up and there in a thicket he saw a ram caught by its horns. He went over and took the ram and sacrificed it as a burnt offering instead of his son. {14} So Abraham called that place The LORD Will Provide. And to this day it is said, "On the mountain of the LORD it will be provided."

***VERY important....

God provided the ram as a substitute for Isaac. God provided his Son who died as our substitute for our sins.
The mountain of the Lord is the same mountain that Jesus was crucified.
The Lord will provide - Jehovah-jireh
{Gen 22:15} The angel of the LORD called to Abraham from heaven a second time {16} and said, "I swear by myself, declares the LORD, that because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son, {17} I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies, {18} and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because you have obeyed me." {19} Then Abraham returned to his servants, and they set off together for Beersheba. And Abraham stayed in Beersheba.

God ratifies his covenant to Abraham, see Gen 17:19, Gen 21:12
"through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed" ,This is fulfilled when Jesus died for our sins, then people from every nation will be blessed (Great commission, Mat 28:19), Rev 5:9.
"because you have obeyed me", because Jesus obeyed God, he would bring many sons to glory. Heb 2:10
God did not withhold his only son, Rom 8:32
Abraham received his son 'back from the dead', Heb 11:19.
{Gen 22:20} Some time later Abraham was told, "Milcah is also a mother; she has borne sons to your brother Nahor: {21} Uz the firstborn, Buz his brother, Kemuel (the father of Aram), {22} Kesed, Hazo, Pildash, Jidlaph and Bethuel." {23} Bethuel became the father of Rebekah. Milcah bore these eight sons to Abraham's brother Nahor. {24} His concubine, whose name was Reumah, also had sons: Tebah, Gaham, Tahash and Maacah.

After Isaac was 'sacrificed' his Bride Rebekah was born. The Church is the Bride of Christ, and was born out of the sacrifice of Jesus, 1 Pet 1:23.
Jesus was descended from Isaac according to the flesh, Mat 1:2.
Like Isaac we are children of the promise Gal 4:28
Isaac was forty years old when he married Rebekah Gen 25:20

Think!

http://www.apocalipsis.org/Abraham.htm



10. Having summoned Balchand he will make him a firm promise. The Swami Raja will cause everybody to eat and vomit all the grains that have been stored on the earth (the meaning is indeed rather obscure), bringing them all to one opinion (mind), and gathering all this together he will give a banquet.

10. Third party means Defeat. They will cause Redan/Nader/reading/learning/gaining/eating & Vomit/Ralph/Purge Grains/Gains/Knowledge, making them all ANTI BOTH/One Opinion/Opinion like 3'Holes....Everybody's got One...shot/chance, Gather everything and build a Coalition to Push It and you'll be granted the strength for Victory/Banquet.

[Samildanach]

Thats a damn complicated post if ever I saw one.

[gr8fuldaniel]

Anything about the future is speculation and opinion and is not debatable. Time to find a new God if your God is telling you to kill your kids.

[Technosoul]

Originally posted by Samildanach, Thats a damn complicated post if ever I saw one.

"let me make this perfectly clear" Richard Millhouse Nixon. "Edwards is not the son of Millhouse".

Gee, you do not understand the Bible? Then I guess you will have to remian a student and do what you are told. (just kidding - my funny bone was acting up again). Technosoul.

[Young]

The Point Is, That God Sacrificed a Son for Our Sins, when he wouldn't ask the same of Man. Now Man Is to Face Revelations.....but If We Sacrifice the Ram (Manchurian Global) with its Horns (Satan/money/stockoptions) caught in a Bush (Kurry/Bush) that we won't Lose Our Children.....who'd I lose, I present the other Evidence because three Religions back this Claim.

[Technosoul]

Originally posted by Young, Comp isn't Pro Bush....You can tell by his Signature.....He's spoofing Bush's use of Terrorism to gain control and acting Bushwashed to give those on the verge of seeing the light....something to "Look" 4......3 Ker Bush, also referred to as Kurry Bush...was what The Ram Caught Its Horns In....that being the Ram Abraham Sacrificed instead of having to Sacrifice Isaac....because the Preparation to do it Proved that He Loved and Honored the Lord.....So We must Sacrifice Them....Jesus says "In 3 Dayz" I write that with a Z, so You can follow, Nov. 3rd "In a Daze" In 3 Daze....Rebuild, First Two are Parties of Destruction, Glory be on the 3rd day....Party.....Ralph Nader....Ralph/Puke/Purge, Nader... Redan/Reading "As in to Kids" Ralph/Puke Over 7 Minutes/Tower 7 7. At that time salt and water will be sold by the weight, there will be only one kind of cereal, the cardinal directions will be reversed, the prasad will be of saffron. 8. When four hours (only) will remain before the universe (is destroyed) the ak tree will give mangoes, the margosa tree (nim) raisins, the ker bush will give pan leaves measuring one hand and a half, the Peepal will give flowers weighing one kilogram, 9. Gold will give a pleasant smell, Kalinga will plough (the earth), it will be necessary to churn the milk of the she-camel and of the she-elephant. He (the Lord) will give children to sterile women, 10. Having summoned Balchand he will make him a firm promise. The Swami Raja will cause everybody to eat and vomit all the grains that have been stored on the earth (the meaning is indeed rather obscure), bringing them all to one opinion (mind), and gathering all this together he will give a banquet. http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0784caradh.html Our Deliverance ? http://www.realbikaner.com/palace/junagarh/site.html Answers Jesus http://www.jesusanswers.com/christia.../sacrifice.htm Explanation http://www.raptureready.us/ishmael.htm Who wants to Play on My Field? {Gen 22:13} Abraham looked up and there in a thicket he saw a ram caught by its horns. He went over and took the ram and sacrificed it as a burnt offering instead of his son. {14} So Abraham called that place The LORD Will Provide. And to this day it is said, "On the mountain of the LORD it will be provided." ***VERY important.... God provided the ram as a substitute for Isaac. God provided his Son who died as our substitute for our sins. The mountain of the Lord is the same mountain that Jesus was crucified. The Lord will provide - Jehovah-jireh {Gen 22:15} The angel of the LORD called to Abraham from heaven a second time {16} and said, "I swear by myself, declares the LORD, that because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son, {17} I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies, {18} and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because you have obeyed me." {19} Then Abraham returned to his servants, and they set off together for Beersheba. And Abraham stayed in Beersheba. God ratifies his covenant to Abraham, see Gen 17:19, Gen 21:12 "through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed" ,This is fulfilled when Jesus died for our sins, then people from every nation will be blessed (Great commission, Mat 28:19), Rev 5:9. "because you have obeyed me", because Jesus obeyed God, he would bring many sons to glory. Heb 2:10 God did not withhold his only son, Rom 8:32 Abraham received his son 'back from the dead', Heb 11:19. {Gen 22:20} Some time later Abraham was told, "Milcah is also a mother; she has borne sons to your brother Nahor: {21} Uz the firstborn, Buz his brother, Kemuel (the father of Aram), {22} Kesed, Hazo, Pildash, Jidlaph and Bethuel." {23} Bethuel became the father of Rebekah. Milcah bore these eight sons to Abraham's brother Nahor. {24} His concubine, whose name was Reumah, also had sons: Tebah, Gaham, Tahash and Maacah. After Isaac was 'sacrificed' his Bride Rebekah was born. The Church is the Bride of Christ, and was born out of the sacrifice of Jesus, 1 Pet 1:23. Jesus was descended from Isaac according to the flesh, Mat 1:2. Like Isaac we are children of the promise Gal 4:28 Isaac was forty years old when he married Rebekah Gen 25:20 Think! http://www.apocalipsis.org/Abraham.htm 10. Having summoned Balchand he will make him a firm promise. The Swami Raja will cause everybody to eat and vomit all the grains that have been stored on the earth (the meaning is indeed rather obscure), bringing them all to one opinion (mind), and gathering all this together he will give a banquet. 10. Third party means Defeat. They will cause Redan/Nader/reading/learning/gaining/eating & Vomit/Ralph/Purge Grains/Gains/Knowledge, making them all ANTI BOTH/One Opinion/Opinion like 3'Holes....Everybody's got One...shot/chance, Gather everything and build a Coalition to Push It and you'll be granted the strength for Victory/Banquet.

In the religon and philosophy forum of this webpage I posted a message about sccrafice and it's roots relative to the evolution of concepts. It is under the topic heading "Domestic God". (how early man attempted to domesticate a wild God through sacrafice offerings). The ariticle will help explain for you some of the things you have attempted to interpret from your bilbical readings, check it out.

Technosoul.

[Young]

The thought that maybe you missed here wasn't just that i brought Hindu,Christian, Jewish, and Muslim works together supporting the same Ideas, what i was trying to get across was.... If Man could turn away from Sin, Man would be Very happy, and then We could do for the Lord, what the Lord did for Abraham....allow him to not have to Sacrifice his Son.

[socpolitics]

Originally posted by Samildanach, I do not understand where you are coming from.

That statement is enormously humorous in that I have read this guys post all over the news groups. Do NOT try to make sense of his banter. There is none.
It is not just that he is stupid. The really frustrating thing is that he cannot me convinced he is! ROFL

Sorry
I wont be back.. enjoy the humor and if you get frustrated please don’t hit your wife or children.

ROFLMA!