Price of Living - Killing people

[Young]

First of all I'd like to point out that this needs to be looked at in different areas. Elderly couples, widowed/single Elderly, middle aged married, Middle aged W/S, single young adults, married young adults, single parent young adults....I'll also add that sometimes any of these can become responsible for an Elderly person or a child as well.

Now i shall start a List i hope others will help me with this, but here goes things that i have witnessed going up in price at an alarming rate.

Gasoline was $1.58 LY, Now $1.94

Milk was $1.98 LY, Now $3.95

Medicine atleast 10%

College Tuition about 5%

Cigs were $2.75 LY, Now $$3.75

Movie ticket was $7.25 LY, Now $8

Beef is up 2 lb was $3.58 LY, Now $4.95

Ice Cream was $2.15 a Pint LY, Now $2.85

Dow Chemical up 40%...contributes to cleaning supplies

Power bill average $41.99 LY, Now $58.36

3 books for college $210 LY, same class New books this year $318

Now using my calculator, average cost of Living Here is up...just based on the above mentioned items counting the book desparity and dividing it by 6, power increase, cleaning supplies, 2 pints of ice cream, 8 lb's of beef, 2 movies, 15 packs of cigs, college tuition increase divided by 6, Medicine based on my worst doctors visit by price this year divided by 3, 4 gallons of Milk, and 60 Gallons of fuel....Per month it costs me $142.76 more to Live than it did last year....and i'm making a quarter more an Hour, at 38 hours a week which yes that means i'm one of 48 Million Americans without Healthcare, My salary is up $38 dollars a month...the offset is $104.76 & to be Honest i stopped smoking...Cigs so that saves me $56.75 a Month...so i'm really only paying $48 more per month this year over last year.

$48 that i don't have and have to borrow or add onto at 16%, unless i don't get sick.....I have to occasionally give stuff up that i need, not to mention stuff you want, and i don't remember when i last bought new clothes.

Per Year that increase is $576

Now when i have to give up something its simple or i'm able to adjust and i have family...but what about those who don't have family or are raising children alone...i can't even imagine all the extra costs, and Our Elderly :(

When they must choose because of lack of funds, they have no place to turn...and that is just sick.

Please add on any items you have seen jump in price and feel free to make your own estimate on your cost of living and see if your in as bad a shape as me....not that i included everything.....but i used what i have seen increase in...that i know i use, be more detailed if you'd like.

[Technosoul]

My rent went up about 50 dollars a month, and the Landord said the big jump was because the property taxes for this area when up.

I have noticed some strange things also, like the cost of a can of coffee at Walmart is about $5. but the same can (and brand name) is $10. at Vons markets.

Also the cost of gas at a Argo gas station in one section of the city could be as much as 5 cents more per gal as in another section of the city, as they claim some areas the demand is greater then in other areas (like you pay more next to a freeway, then you would someplace where you have less traffic).
My Mama told me, you better shop around.

The problem is we cannot go to the boss and tell him that it is costing us more to come to work and so we are going to charge him more for our services.
Everyone can pass on the costs to the next guy, except for the factory worker and those with "them" types of jobs.

I notice big jumps in the cost of living because I tend to compare today with the 1950s (when gas was 25 cents a gal). Back then it would cost about 5 bucks to get into Disneyland for a day's fun, now people spend much more.

You would think in a free market the competition would keep prices in check and that they would even be going down (due to faster production using modern technology) - but Nay - nearly everything continues to cost more.

I loaded 16 tons and what do I get, another day older and deeper in debt.
I think if we looked at our economic history here in the USA we would find that the cost of living as been going up every year (at least from the depression of the 1930s through nowadays). At a much slower rate our wages have gone up - I think burger flippers got paid about $3 bucks an hour back then.

In the 1950s it cost me a buck to buy my first 78rpm record of the top rock and roll song of the day - today I can go on-line and download that same song or any new tune that is now popular for about a buck. Long live rock and roll.
(okay you can get 'em free at shared files webpages - but that is different).

One bad thing is that my advice is still free, I cannot get anyone to pay me for it and I've been at this for 30 years. Perhaps I should have found a better occupation? Even Lucy gets 5 cents an hour from Charlie Brown.

So about your list.

Rent for apartments, spaces, seems to go up every year or twice a year.

The cost of those cigarettes was due mostly to the added taxes, aka sin taxes, that the government added.

In some cases the cost of banking has gone up, if you use cards they can tag on all kinds of little fees, like if you stick your bank card into a machine to buy something for under 10 dollars the store will add on an extra charge of 40 cents (which is what the bank (or someone) charges them for each machine transaction. So compared to the value you get using cash with the value you get for using cards (ATM or credit cards) we can see that the "cost of buying", because they now charge extra to just for the abiltiy to pay for something with a card has gone up. Apparently electronic buying costs you more then cash buying due to different factors - fees. Plus banks keep coming up with new service fees for - and if (at our bank) you accidently overdraw on your account they can charge you 30 bucks a day (deductable from your next deposit) each day your account is below what you deposited. I did not know this and one time I overdrew $300 on my account - by my next deposit (once a month automatic deposit from Social Security) that 3 dollar overdraw cost me hundreds of dollars - all profit for the bank.

One more thing, not to sound like I am a liberal welfare person, the cost of being rich has gone up, it costs a lot of money to be a rich person, like if you are a movie star must are expected to keep up your image which can be very expensive when you are in the public eye, and if you own a company the costs of "doing lunch" with a client or having an expensive car to impress your investors = high overhead. A doctor must pay for an office in the best and most expensive rental buildings if he wants to get ahead of the game.
ETC.

Okay, what about the cost of a haircut in your area? I think that has gone up for men's haircuts (with rare exception of a small private barber shop - but the chain store barbers have doubled the cost of haircuts (1970s - $6.00 - 2003 - $12.00 (peak hour prices).

Technosoul.

[Technosoul]

Made an error in above post - I had overdrawn my back account by $3.00 and it ended up costing me hundreds of dollars in fees because they charge $30.00 a day for "that automatic loan". I goofed and said I was overdrawn by $300 instead of $3. (forgot the dot). Technosoul.

[Young]

Tech the Barbers here will trim you up for $10.....but if you get crazy and walk in a mall where women use sizzers and a comb/fingers & then Gel you up.....its $18 & they'll get rude if they don't get a tip.

My tip go to the barbershop.....& talk Politics.

Here in the South Religion & Politics are actually mixing.....all over preachers are telling people that since Bush/Kerry are both crooked Frat brothers....we're gonna vote in the Republican party and try to throw the Power of the church into Impeaching Bush after Nov.

You cannot have people in their 80's saying Food or Medicine!

You cannot have Mothers saying Food or Gas to get to work!

You cannot have Gov't controlled by Corporations!

The People will Not stand for this.

[bishop]

you guys definitely aren't alone.. studies have been showing that the middle class and poor are fairing worse now than before bush took office. the only people who have benefitted are those in the upper income brackets.. and even people who are considered upper-middle class haven't seen amazing increases either. the extra $5-$10 thousand has been eaten away by other increases in living costs that you both cited already.

meanwhile, the AMT still isn't being reformed at the same time as bush goes around begging for tax cuts for the rich.

[XGropo]

Wow Bishop, just say that you think Bush is the cause of all the world's problems and be done with it. Bush lowered taxes for every bracket (i.e. everyone who pays taxes) and he is not begging for tax cuts for the rich. Kerry is going around stating that taxes should be increased for the "wealthy" by 2%. Is that enough for you? How much would you prefer? Now define "wealthy".

Bush does not control the economy, nor does Congress. We have a market economy. It's worth noting however that many of the things Young mentioned are either heavily regulated (gasoline, cigs, power) or monopolies (tuition, books, gasoline). Note that gasoline is both. Food prices are regional in inflation (my price for milk is not 3.95, it's still about 2.50). Medicine (prescription drugs) are up because because of the goofy patent law combined with goofy FDA regulations. If you want to stem prescription prices, just extent the default patent length of new drugs from 10 years to 20 years.

Many things not mentioned have stayed relatively stable in price.

New home prices in my city are way up and steadily climbing in all those areas people want to live in, should government step in and fix prices or provide subsidies to new home buyers?

Given that prices for certain things are inflating too quickly, how would you stop it? Price fixing? Food stamps? Socialization?

[XGropo]

Piece of an article for y'all:

Originally posted by Bryan L. Boulier@ professor of economics at George Washington University From 1990 to 2004, average ticket prices rose from $4.22 to $6.26, an increase of nearly 50 percent. To put this in perspective, the price of a barrel of oil today is only 4 percent above its price in October 1990. This unwarranted increase in ticket prices is driven by rapacious mega-corporations, which are concerned only with the bottom line and not the welfare of consumers. Michael Eisner, former CEO of Disney, once said: "We have no obligation to make history. We have no obligation to make art. We have no obligation to make a statement. To make money is our only objective." The profits generated by "The Lion King" exceeded $1 billion, and revenues of the top 10 media conglomerates increased by nearly a third between 1995 and 2000. Hollywood accounts for 85 percent of worldwide movie screenings and earns more than half of its revenues from overseas sales. It also rips off the American consumer to subsidize these sales abroad. Movie ticket prices are dramatically lower in foreign countries. An adult ticket to "Spiderman 2" in Ottawa is 18 percent lower than in Manhattan. Movie ticket prices in Mexico City average $3.50, while adult ticket prices in New York City are now regularly $10. Must our veterans and senior citizens trek to Canada or Mexico to view movies? While even the newest movies are made readily available on DVD in foreign countries like China, the industry fights to prevent Americans from importing these low-cost alternatives. Contributing to this rise in ticket prices are the outrageous salaries of undeserving corporate executives and movie stars. Ben Affleck earned $600,000 for his work in "Armageddon" in 1998, but $12.5 million for "Gigli" in 2003. How many hard-working Americans have seen their rate of pay increase 20 times over the last five years? Did Mr. Affleck or the executives who produced "Gigli" offer to refund their salaries when losses on this film reduced Sony's profits and share prices, lowering the value of many Americans' pension funds? The movie industry also serves unhealthy portions of high-priced, high-cholesterol carbohydrates in its theaters. Gaudy and seductive advertisements prior to each movie prey upon young children, encouraging consumption of empty calories and contributing to the serious problem of obesity. To protect its interests, the movie industry contributes heavily to political parties. A fund-raiser for a presidential candidate raised $5 million in June of this year. It also employs well-connected lobbyists, such as Jack Valenti (formerly press secretary to Lyndon Johnson) and now Dan Glickman (formerly secretary of agriculture in the Clinton administration) as its Washington representatives. It is time for new initiatives in government policy. A commission to investigate the practices of this industry and to formulate needed regulations is urgently needed. The millions of Americans who work hard every day at minimum wages should not have to worry about sacrificing food, clothing and shelter so that their children and elderly parents can go to movies. A tax credit for tickets would help those who are deprived, so that they, too, can share the benefits of movie attendance already enjoyed by those who are more fortunate.

[Technosoul]

Is the only alternaitve for capitolism emobided in socialism? Can we not come up with a 3rd alternative?

Is the merging of major chains and companies a problem, is monopoly defeating and making to non-effect the concepts of capitolism?

Why is debating with terrorists and protesters so taboo? Why can't we listen and find out why they are lashing out in such fustration at the powers of capitolism? Why can't we see if some adjustments can be made to clam things down and generate a little peace for a change?

Technosoul.

[bishop]

Wow Bishop, just say that you think Bush is the cause of all the world's problems and be done with it. Bush lowered taxes for every bracket (i.e. everyone who pays taxes) and he is not begging for tax cuts for the rich. Kerry is going around stating that taxes should be increased for the "wealthy" by 2%. Is that enough for you? How much would you prefer? Now define "wealthy".

heh.. here's to talking at a high school level.

did i say bush was the cause of all the world's problems? nope.

bush did not cut taxes for everyone. in order to cut taxes for everyone he would have had to have cut payroll taxes. did he do that? nope. i forgot, payroll taxes don't count as taxes. silly me.

kerry was very clear on who he said he'd roll back tax cuts for. cry me a river about them poor millionaires and billionaires.. i'm paying my way through grad school, they can suck my balls. and, they can pay their taxes without sacrificing anything.

Bush does not control the economy, nor does Congress. We have a market economy.

i've come to notice how people who don't know much about economics, particularly partisans who excuse ineffective republican presidents, claim that the government doesn't control/impact the economy. you really don't know what you're talking about i'm afraid.

example #1: months back, the only jobs that were being created weren't being created by the private sector. they were being created by the government.

example #2: months back, bush's temporary tariff on steel imports cost the american consumer billions.

example #3: bush's weak-dollar posture has put additional upward pressure on oil prices.

example #4: bush's trade policies have rewarded companies for outsourcing to developing countries.

example #5: bush's idiotic medicare drug program has increased drug prices paid by the consumer.


if you need me to explain any of them, i'll lend a helping hand.

Given that prices for certain things are inflating too quickly, how would you stop it? Price fixing? Food stamps? Socialization?

sensible interest rates, fiscal responsibility - and the currency stability that fiscal responsibility creates. fyi, bush spends worse than a socialist. so much for your anti-socialist credentials. :)

[Young]

When the President says "We created 1.5 Million jobs", what they're not saying is that you'd have to subtract the jobs we've lost from that number....the only way you know is when people contact the welfare dept. I have been jobless a few times but i've never been on welfare, i'm in no way putting you down if you have....i'm just saying that these Numbers are way off. Think about how many High School students that won't attend college that have graduated over the past 4 years added onto the college kids who graduated and when you subract 1.5 Million.....it doesn't begin to equal those looking for work.

[jose]

http://www.gold-eagle.com/editorials...i080604pv.html
If you had purchased $1000.00 worth of items in 1913, those same items would have cost you an amazing 18,992.55 today in 2004! To say it another way, in the year 2004, it would take $18.99 to buy what cost $1.00 in 1913! If I did my math correctly, that means that as of this year, 2004, a dollar held since 1913 is now worth a grand total of .053. FIVE cents! Staggering is it not?

[bishop]

it's all relative.. especially as long as wages increase with inflation. (but that hasn't been the case with bush in office)

[m5lange1]

This is a pretty obvious fact.
When cost goes up (inflation)
But average wages for citizens goes down (deflation)
Guess who gets hosed.
Sorry, politics aside, but those who say our economy is on the upswing must be getting the cash from those higher prices and not be depending on those lower wages.

[bishop]

[m5lange1]

Sure would love to see that chart extended from 2000 to 2004.

Since it is only "full time male workers" I also wish it would include all the unemployed as 0 so we could see that effect as well.

If Bobo and I each earned $50,000 last year and he earned $60,000 this year but I got laid off and earned zipidy doo dah, our average income just dropped to $30,000.

But if you get to discount me because I was not employed. Wow then our average income just went up 20%.

Hmmm.

That means that between the two of us we only have $60,000 to spend instead of $100,000 dollars to spend.

Yep I think figuring the unemployed into the economy is pretty damned important.

[jose]

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/yearoftheslave.html
You are a slave.
sorry to bring it up but if not why not?

[bishop]

from the harvard political review:

http://www.hpronline.org/news/2004/07/19/C...on-692881.shtml

In the years between World War II and 1981, the Gini coefficient for U.S. families, the most common numerical measure of income inequality, fluctuated between .35 and .38, levels about on par with the modern-day United Kingdom.

Then, in 1981, Congress passed the Economic Recovery Tax Act, effectively signaling a sea change in the philosophy behind the tax structure. The act significantly reduced both the top income tax rate and the capital gains tax rate. It was then followed by the Tax Reform Act of 1986, which lowered the top income tax rate to 28 percent, half its level in previous decades. Moreover, these tax cuts were paired with an accelerated schedule of Social Security tax increases, which fall disproportionately on lower-income taxpayers. Although these changes were slightly moderated in the early 1990s, the tax cuts of 2001 and 2003 have returned the overall tax structure to what Williamson calls a long-running "inegalitarian trend." These alterations to the tax code have corresponded with an unprecedented climb in the Gini coefficient. After over three decades of relative stability, in the 1980s inequality began a steady increase, reaching an unprecedented high of .435 on the Gini coefficent scale in 2001, a level slightly more unequal than what is experienced in Turkey. According to data from the U.S. Census Bureau, since 1980 the wealthiest 20 percent have enjoyed a 14 percent increase in their share of aggregate income, while the poorest 20 percent have experienced an 18 percent drop.

if it was .435 in 2001, imagine what it is now. we are the most unequal developed country in the world by a long shot. in all other developed countries, prosperity hits a broader swath of their citizens.

fyi, the gini coefficient is a value on the lorenz curve that measures inequality in a society. 0.0 is total equality and 1.0 is total inequality.