I don't get why McCain is only a few points behind Obama.

[Gods_Mercenary]

Obama is a pretty good choice, better than most others the Dems have pumped out, he appears pragmatic enough to suit my tastes, and despite his posturing I don't think he'll suddenly up and leave Iraq. And he's right, Afghanistan is needing more attention. Plus, I'm not too afraid about any liberal policies that I dislike he'll put in, He has Bush's courts and the democratic history of not dactually doing anything too drastic to prevent that.

Quote by: maximdewinter All what gaffes by John McCain?

Have you not been keeping up?

See Critics Pile On As McCain Gaffes Pile Up

and

CBS scrubs a second McCain flub from interview broadcast

I could add more but I'm not running a current affairs educational service. Google "John McCain gaffes" for more examples. The man's a buffoon.

Quote by: loser How could any American even consider voting for a Muslim extremist? A vote for Obama is a vote for the destruction of America.

You've given me a deeper understanding of why the polls are so close between Obama and McCain. I didn't realize there were so many grossly misinformed people like you in America.

Quote by: maximdewinter This just in:The Obama gaffe du jour is that Barry just canceled a scheduled visit of wounded US soldiers in Germany. Let's see how he bungles this one. He already looks like an idiot in Germany anyway.

Once again, you might want to keep current with the news. See Obama camp says Pentagon nixed troop visit.

Apart from yourself, to whom does Obama look like an idiot in Germany? Certainly not the 200,000 Germans who attended his speech.

Do you just make up these "facts" or is there some source that provides you with them, like Fox News (excuse the oxymoron)?

[thebuescherman]

Quote by: sdbest You've given me a deeper understanding of why the polls are so close between Obama and McCain. I didn't realize there were so many grossly misinformed people like you in America.

I think we need to teach the forum a lesson in sarcasm.

[thebuescherman]

Quote by: Gods_Mercenary Obama is a pretty good choice, better than most others the Dems have pumped out, he appears pragmatic enough to suit my tastes, and despite his posturing I don't think he'll suddenly up and leave Iraq. And he's right, Afghanistan is needing more attention. Plus, I'm not too afraid about any liberal policies that I dislike he'll put in, He has Bush's courts and the democratic history of not dactually doing anything too drastic to prevent that.

I agree with a lot of that. Obama, despite his most insincere attempts to say otherwise, will not be leaving Iraq anytime soon. He will be leaving when the generals tell him it is alright to leave. No one should think otherwise. As for Afghanistan, I agree 100% with Obama. The War or Terror actually made sense there! And as for the incompetence of the Democrats to actually do something meaningful? I see no reason that will change anytime soon.

Quote by: thebuescherman I think we need to teach the forum a lesson in sarcasm.

It utterly flabbergasts me that people will write--and truly believe--things that are patently false. It's astounding. Sarcasm is the least I can do.

[xyzer]

I think the working public mistrusts Obama! He is golden tongued(in scripted performances) but has proved wrong and ill informed on matters of security and the two middle eastern campaigns designed to counter terrorism. That is a worry and should be to a nation that has been hit by several terrorist attacks and spent money and lives trying to stabalize the middleeast.

McCain hasn't put out any BS about the matter. He is loyal to the issue and troops in harms way. Plus he appears intent in avoiding the personal criticism and backfighting that goes with a Democrat campaign? And of course the utter sillyness of Obamas foreign trip? Does anyone really think that what the Germans think about one of our candidates means anything? They can't vote for him, can they? Doesn't the press remind us of how the foreign countries hate us because of our policies? Is it a German citizens business whether he advocates raising our taxes? Is his opposition the NAFTa going to help or hinder Germans? Come on now, its stupid nonsense!


Obamas popularity is primarily with the leftist US press and an awed bunch of students, unemployed and barely productive citizens looking for bigger government and more handouts. Those of us who have to pay the bills are less impressed with his promises of more government control and handouts.? He is making a big deal out of nothing, hoping the media will enhance his reputation of campaign foolishness. McCain is at least acting normally?

[blue saki]

"Uh, uh, are, uh, uh, uh, um. That's -- that's a bunch -- so -- so let me tick these off. Deh... Uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, um, uh. So the issue is not a perception that, uh... Weh, weh, let me put it this way. Uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, We're -- we're trying to -- you know, we've got a bipartisan group here and -- and -- and, uh, uh, uh, uh, um, uh, uh, uh."

"uh, uh, uh, you know, uh, uh, uh, uhh, is...? Uh, is of -- of their work, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, we, uh, uh, I called, uh, uh, and I'm -- I'm -- Uh, with, uh, uh, as, uh, that, uh, and uh, uh, um, uh -- And we have to do this, uh, uh. As -- as well as, eh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh. Well, uh. I, uh, uh, uh, um. We, uh, and, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh. Uh, now, uh, right now and then identify if -- if, uh, you want to, uh, uh, uhhhh. Ummmm. That's -- that's a bunch. Umm, so let me tick these off. Um, it is true that, uh, uh, uh, uhhh, uh, uh. What, uh, uhhh, uh, and, uh, uh, in I-iraq, uh, uh, are seen as, uh -- and so, uh, uh, uhhh, uh, uh, and if I was -- i-if I were in his shoes, uh, uh, uhh, and so, uh, a, uh, um, uh, from some -- someplace else, uh, theeee, uh -- and, uh, t'see, uhhh, that, uhhh --"

- B. Obama Amman , Jordan



John McCain Barack Obama debate anyone? No teleprompter or free rock concerts if you don't mind.

[GHook93]

Few reasons:
(1) Before the election left, the right and the middle all had great respect for McCain
(2) Believe it or not there are still many conservatives in America and they might not be in love with McCain, but they fear an Obama White house
(3) The Iraq War has changed and is not seen as much of a negative as it was during the primaries
(4) Obama is low on experience, while McCain is not and that matters to people
(5) McCain does better with the Latinos then most Republican candidates.
(6) The Wright controversy turned off many whites to him
(7) Americans don't want to live in communism

[Clarence]

Quote by: GHook93 Few reasons: (1) Before the election left, the right and the middle all had great respect for McCain

false. the right and some of the middle at least didn't dislike him. Most people realize that voting for him is voting for more of the same

(2) Believe it or not there are still many conservatives in America and they might not be in love with McCain, but they fear an Obama White house

fear. perfect strategy. define conservatism then tell me whether most self-proclaimed "conservatives" actually approve of conservative candidates or policy

The Iraq War has changed and is not seen as much of a negative as it was during the primaries

says who?

(4) Obama is low on experience, while McCain is not and that matters to people

you're right. McCain has been actively involved in creating this country's problems for many many years.

(5) McCain does better with the Latinos then most Republican candidates.

does better with the latinos...just one group that deedee pointed out anyhow. Why classify them as latinos? If they vote, then they are United Statians.

(6) The Wright controversy turned off many whites to him

did not

(7) Americans don't want to live in communism

lol. how about facism?

[GHook93]

Quote by: Clarence false. the right and some of the middle at least didn't dislike him. Most people realize that voting for him is voting for more of the same fear. perfect strategy. define conservatism then tell me whether most self-proclaimed "conservatives" actually approve of conservative candidates or policy says who? you're right. McCain has been actively involved in creating this country's problems for many many years. does better with the latinos...just one group that deedee pointed out anyhow. Why classify them as latinos? If they vote, then they are United Statians. did not lol. how about facism?

Let me guess your voting for McCain!

Quote by: GHook93 Few reasons: (1) Before the election left, the right and the middle all had great respect for McCain (2) Believe it or not there are still many conservatives in America and they might not be in love with McCain, but they fear an Obama White house (3) The Iraq War has changed and is not seen as much of a negative as it was during the primaries (4) Obama is low on experience, while McCain is not and that matters to people (5) McCain does better with the Latinos then most Republican candidates. (6) The Wright controversy turned off many whites to him (7) Americans don't want to live in communism

You had me fooled into thinking you were making a rational argument until number (7). No President could ever turn America into a communist country. A police state, yes--as we've seen. A military theocracy--as we've seen. An oligarchy--as we see. But a communist state--impossible. And why not a communist state? Because Americans mistrust and abhor the common man and worship and fawn over the rich and powerful, deluded that they can become one of them.

[Dan_77]

Quote by: xyzer I think the working public mistrusts Obama! He is golden tongued(in scripted performances) but has proved wrong and ill informed on matters of security and the two middle eastern campaigns designed to counter terrorism.

Which two middle eastern campaigns to "counter terrorism"? I am only aware of one.

That is a worry and should be to a nation that has been hit by several terrorist attacks and spent money and lives trying to stabalize the middleeast.

No, it shouldn't be. We've already been through this. Terrorism simply is not a major danger, nor will it ever be, no matter who is President.

McCain hasn't put out any BS about the matter. He is loyal to the issue and troops in harms way.

Loyalty to the troops in harm's way is saying we're going to keep them in harm's way for 100 years? You have a funny definition of loyalty.

Plus he appears intent in avoiding the personal criticism and backfighting that goes with a Democrat campaign?

You mean like "swiftboat" ads? "flip-flop" accusations? Criminal undermining and dissemination of known falsehoods? Oh wait, those are all Republican attacks. What were you thinking of?

And of course the utter sillyness of Obamas foreign trip?

This, of course, being a classic, asinine Republican tactic... "You can't vote for Obama, he hasn't been to the middle east, his views aren't credible." He goes to the middle east... "You can't vote for Obama, he's spending all his time courting foreigners. It's Americans that matter.

Really, the fact that you can say that without a whit of irony is testament to the fact that there are some people out there who actually believe this garbage. It's amazing.

Does anyone really think that what the Germans think about one of our candidates means anything? They can't vote for him, can they?

Our foreign image is important, yes. Has the last 8 years not taught you that?

Doesn't the press remind us of how the foreign countries hate us because of our policies? Is it a German citizens business whether he advocates raising our taxes? Is his opposition the NAFTa going to help or hinder Germans? Come on now, its stupid nonsense!

Yes, of course, it is stupid nonsense for a political candidate to visit one of the countries where the greatest number of overseas Americans live and is location of the largest US military bases outside of the US... Such stupid, stupid, nonsense...

Obamas popularity is primarily with the leftist US press and an awed bunch of students, unemployed and barely productive citizens looking for bigger government and more handouts.

Any proof of that? I'm just wondering, because his poll numbers indicate something quite different to what you are saying, so either you have new, unfound evidence, or you are talking out your a**. Just wondering.

Those of us who have to pay the bills are less impressed with his promises of more government control and handouts.? He is making a big deal out of nothing, hoping the media will enhance his reputation of campaign foolishness. McCain is at least acting normally?

Umm... so why, then, are you any more impressed with McCain's promises of more government control???



I'm so sick of saying this I really feel like a broken record, but it has to be said once more because apparently the media is still passing out a false message...

IF YOU THINK REPUBLICANS ARE GOING TO GIVE YOU SMALLER, LESS CONTROLLING GOVERNMENT YOU ARE A WOEFULLY ILL-INFORMED PERSON WHO SHOULD BE BANNED FROM VOTING IN ANY ELECTION ANYWHERE.

I'm not speaking to anyone here, I'm not personally attacking anyone since no one here has said that, just going on what I see as common misconceptions people still have despite all evidence to the contrary.

[maximdewinter]

Obama Gaffe Watch:

He's with Sarko today in France. Je me demande s'il dira quelques phrases à Sarko en français pour montrer comment il est un Américain trés cosmopolite. Maybe he'll just say merci beaucoup.

We took a brief respite from the Barry adulation--actually more like a coronation--to have Katie Couric ask him if he would change his mind about opposing the surge considering that it is the surge that was obviously the right way to go.

Obama: Surge Doesn't Meet Long-Term Goals, In An Exclusive Interview With Katie Couric, Illinois Senator Defends Position On Troop Buildup - CBS News

Couric: But talking microcosmically, did the surge, the addition of 30,000 additional troops ... help the situation in Iraq?

Obama: Katie, as … you've asked me three different times, and I have said repeatedly that there is no doubt that our troops helped to reduce violence. There's no doubt.

Couric: But yet you're saying … given what you know now, you still wouldn't support it … so I'm just trying to understand this.

Obama: Because … it's pretty straightforward. By us putting $10 billion to $12 billion a month, $200 billion, that's money that could have gone into Afghanistan. Those additional troops could have gone into Afghanistan. That money also could have been used to shore up a declining economic situation in the United States. That money could have been applied to having a serious energy security plan so that we were reducing our demand on oil, which is helping to fund the insurgents in many countries. So those are all factors that would be taken into consideration in my decision-- to deal with a specific tactic or strategy inside of Iraq.

Couric: And I really don't mean to belabor this, Senator, because I'm really, I'm trying … to figure out your position. Do you think the level of security in Iraq …

Obama: Yes.

Couric … would exist today without the surge?

Obama: Katie, I have no idea what would have happened had we applied my approach, which was to put more pressure on the Iraqis to arrive at a political reconciliation. So this is all hypotheticals. What I can say is that there's no doubt that our U.S. troops have contributed to a reduction of violence in Iraq. I said that, not just today, not just yesterday, but I've said that previously. What that doesn't change is that we've got to have a different strategic approach if we're going to make America as safe as possible.



So Obama can't say what would have happened if his surrender strategy were applied in Iraq yet he still says that he would oppose the surge were it put before him again? Huh? And now he is pushing for a surge in Afghanistan. Using Obama-pretzel-logic what makes him think that a surge in Afghanistan will work if he couldn't call it in Iraq?

Ron Paul is looking more sane everyday.

[maximdewinter]

Quote by: sdbest You had me fooled into thinking you were making a rational argument until number (7). No President could ever turn America into a communist country. A police state, yes--as we've seen. A military theocracy--as we've seen. An oligarchy--as we see. But a communist state--impossible. And why not a communist state? Because Americans mistrust and abhor the common man and worship and fawn over the rich and powerful, deluded that they can become one of them.

The United State is a police state? Please explain that one. I hope you realize that warrantless searches are legal in Canada under certain conditions just as they are in the USA. Also your blitzkrieging military are Afghanistan too, pal. What...you guys looking for lebensraum?

I just went to the Montreal Fireworks last weekend with friends and your border storm troopers wouldn't let us bring any dog food into your country (no joke.) What sort of canine food theocracy is at work there?

[maximdewinter]

Quote by: sdbest Once again, you might want to keep current with the news. See Obama camp says Pentagon nixed troop visit.

Obama drops visit to wounded U.S. troops in Germany | Reuters

But the Pentagon insisted it had been ready to welcome Obama at the hospital -- without his campaign staff or accompanying reporters.
"We advised that Sen. Obama would be welcome to visit Landstuhl or any other military hospital in his capacity as a U.S. senator, but his campaign staff would not," Pentagon press secretary Geoff Morrell said.


Obama could have gone without his papparzzi retinue. He could have quietly visited the wounded soldiers without worrying about his tie and makeup. This was a big, big mistake on the part of the boy wonder. It makes him look vainglorious....and for someone who is trying to build his image as potential Commander in Chief it will be considered a misstep by people who pay attention.

Quote by: sdbest Apart from yourself, to whom does Obama look like an idiot in Germany? Certainly not the 200,000 Germans who attended his speech. Do you just make up these "facts" or is there some source that provides you with them, like Fox News (excuse the oxymoron)?

He looks like an idiot here not there. Once again for reading impaired Obama said on July 11th:
"You know, it's embarrassing when Europeans come over here, they all speak English, they speak French, they speak German. And then we go over to Europe and all we can say is 'merci beaucoup!'"
He just chided Americans for not being able to say anything in a foreign language and then he goes to Germany and can't even memorize an introductory sentence in German or even say "Wie geht's". Even Petula Clark was able to sing Downtown in French and German. So is Barry embarrassed now at himself ?

[Thanatos]

Quote by: evensaul Just about 60% of the population. I think he even voted against limiting partial birth abortion. That would put it above 80%.

Curiously after eight years of solid Republicans its still legal. Imagine that. Perhaps there's something you've missed.

McCain wants to increase drilling, increase alternative energy, and reduce the gas tax. Sounds pretty comprehensive. Obama is against increased production and has no problem with $5 per gallon gasoline. He just says we got to that price "too fast"

Which will take ten years to take effect by the last estimate I read. Hybrids and such are ready to go now. Also, see the bit about oil companies further down.

No, he wants higher taxes on anyone who has worked hard to build a business, to give more money to people through the "earned income program" who don't pay taxes to begin with. People who don't pay a dime in income tax get thousands of dollars in tax refunds. That makes a lot of sense.

You seem to have lost your ordering here. You were talking about borders and my reply was intended to convey the fact that this isn't really Obama's position. Reviewing the element of tax law that you spontaneously switched to, its an attempt to help the poor without actually giving them money and really quite well thought out. Oh, and the tax bills really do scale in such a way that regardless your taxes are lower if you make less than 250k a year. That's most people.

Whose tax plan is better for you? Obama vs. McCain :: CHICAGO SUN-TIMES :: Barack Obama

And he wants to take "excess profits" from oil companies. Which means he'll take earned dividend money from all of the small and larger investers who own stock in energy companies. Oil companies won't suffer. The millions of ordinary citizens who own stock will.

Coincidentally the owners happen to hold stock. Rather a lot of it in most cases. Trust me, they'll care. Regardless by scaling the taxes you can make the oil companies actually profit more from providing gasoline efficiently...

And he'll raise the minimum wage which will put many, many small businesses completely out of business. Eliminating millions of lower paying jobs will do wonders for unemployment, won't it?

Actually when those workers go to buy stuff with the extra cash it will work out just fine for business. There will be inflation too so its a worthless policy, but you attacked it from an ignorant and wrong angle.

Obama said the surge of troops in Iraq would fail. It has succeeded despite all democrats predicting failure and claiming the war was lost. Obama has not once said we should "win" in Iraq. He only wants to cut and run, and allow the country to fall into civil war.

If its worked why do we still need to be there? Given the fact that this was not the first surge expecting it to fail was not unreasonable. What made this one different? Oh right, because its worked because we're bribing the insurgent leaders into leaving our troops alone. This will work perfectly indefinitely.

We don't need a new straw man.

Then stop building yourself one. You've backed off from the worst of your untruths but the math of the tax bills is hard to argue with. After that's done we'll actually be having a proper debate.

[maximdewinter]

Quote by: Thanatos Which will take ten years to take effect by the last estimate I read. Hybrids and such are ready to go now. .

What?! What sort of hybrids are "ready to go now?" Most hybrid cars now on the market are gasoline-electric. The rest are diesel-electric. Pardon me for pointing this out but you still need fossil fuels to power hybrids.

Also that ten year number for getting oil out of the ground keeps turning up like a bad penny. It is based on development estimates for 2008 with all our environmental dithering and obstructionist regulations from another era when oil drilling was much more polluting.

In World War II the United States went from a feeble producer to a powerhouse in 3 short years. We supplied the world with vast amounts of materiel. If we gave complete attention to drilling and building platforms in the same way that the greatest generation did, we could slash that ten year time by 2/3.

[xyzer]

This too is a laugher tivo.

This, of course, being a classic, asinine Republican tactic... "You can't vote for Obama, he hasn't been to the middle east, his views aren't credible." He goes to the middle east... "You can't vote for Obama, he's spending all his time courting foreigners. It's Americans that matter

Who is going to vote in the US presidential election? The German, French or British citizenry? Does a 'whirl wind" brief visit to speak to foregners about what he intends to do really seem genuine or realistic to you? If so you belong in the misinformed rabble that this addresses.

He ventured forth to bring light to the world | Gerard Baker - Times Online

Obamas views have been quite clear to most of us for the past couple of years He said the wars couldn't be won? He said the 'surge wouldn't work? He has repeatedly indicated to us that he wants a timed withdrawal from Iraq(which is really more valuable to Al Qaida and other terrorist groups and is uninformed speculation by a man who hasn't been close to a military or foreign policy campaign?) If we can decipher his stimulating generalities he is for change. Does such change portend greatger government involvement in our lives? Probably! But he does sound good and he wants theEuropeans to participate in our change? Brilliant!

Wouldn't it be more realistic to say that attempting to counteract international terrorism is a rational desire of our nation as a whole rather than one political party? Your 'Messiah" hasn't been aroumnd long enough to lead anything of the size and importance of the nation? Did he ever even lead a Boy Scout troop? What are the duties of a community organizer? Back slapping and promiss? If so hehas had experience qualifying him for leadership? Now if he just wouldn't flip flop and keep uttering verbal pauses he might be considered rational.