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nature of reality · Nov 7, 2003, 08:27 am

So in "pure" communism i read in some other threads, there isn't a government. How the hell is a command economy supposed to work without a government?

G. Adams · Nov 7, 2003, 08:37 am

Its not a command economy under pure communism.

wow, that was easy.

castille · Nov 7, 2003, 08:46 am

Different Communists have different ideas about their vision of Communism.

Some want a dictatorship run by poor people (ie. small group of elite poor), others want Stalinist policies, while some just want to get back at their employers. A few want a country without government (although anarchy is more a term for them).

I wonder how all the different Communists will solve their problems after the Revolution....I guess we'll just have to have another war to decide which version of Communism has the strongest guns.

G. Adams · Nov 7, 2003, 09:26 am

Well because of the splits between communist thought you mentioned, most communists wouldn't dare fight alongside other types. I for instance wouldn't dream of fighting for the Socialist Worker Party, because they are a top down, bureucratic socialist party. Which is, I think most would agree, what stalinism is.

And because of this, more than anything else, a revolution may not occur. Communists are principled and don't like to compromise, hell if your gonna kill for a cause your gonna make sure its the right one, so compromise is a bad thing in that sense.

And capitalists know this. Their opponents have divided and conquered themselves.

nature of reality · Nov 7, 2003, 08:01 pm

If its not a command economy, and its not a market economy, what the hell is it? a "traditional" economy? LOL, try that with an industrialized nation. Not like industry would last very long under true communism, where we all get to live happily as draft animals.

I hope i get a good stable.

EDIT:

How wrong of me! That was just my greedy bougriese backround. I hope i get a crappy stable....

For the glory of the Common Good!

castille · Nov 10, 2003, 01:08 am

If you're ambitious, you can succeed in any environment.

A few of Stalin's top leaders were in fact former Imperialists and even capitalists.

And with plastic surgery today, in a Communist world most capitalists can escape the murderous wrath of the Communist Secret Police by changing their identity.

"Who is Bill Gates the evil dictator? My name is Sanchez Miguel, loyal Communisto from Mexico! I be in your secret police, yes?"

Scribbler1 · Jan 3, 2004, 04:10 pm

</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (castille,)
If you're ambitious, you can succeed in any environment.

A few of Stalin's top leaders were in fact former Imperialists and even capitalists.

And with plastic surgery today, in a Communist world most capitalists can escape the murderous wrath of the Communist Secret Police by changing their identity.

"Who is Bill Gates the evil dictator? My name is Sanchez Miguel, loyal Communisto from Mexico! I be in your secret police, yes?"<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'>

Ambitious, yes. However if you're talking about not just plastic surgery and abandoning your principles and beliefs I'd hardly call that successful. On the other hand, if you know you'd be shot or tortured by criticizing the status quo, it's a good idea to go with the flow, or just clam up. But it still may mean, at the very least, abandoning your personal morality and/or principles.

I believe personal success is achieving something you set for yourself and not what a group, or government wants you to achieve. If Stalin's top dogs were successful by your measure, they either agreed with him or they assimilated, for their own gain or survival. If memory serves, a lot of people didn't agree with him (or at least HE thought they didn't) and ended up dead.

(sorry to comment so long after the fact but I didn't see your post until now)

castille · Jan 13, 2004, 08:44 am

You can't be successful if you're dead.

Try telling Stalin Communism sucks and he sucks even more. Its deportation time. Welcome to Siberia.

G. Adams · Jan 13, 2004, 09:33 am

Didn't have to even do that much. If you opened his office door without his permission he's shoot you. That's why he spent a day dying in his office alone because the guards were too afraid to go in and find he had just been in a typing frenzy all night.

Nov 7, 2003, 08:27 am	#1 (permalink)
nature of reality Molten Ash Posts: 134	So in "pure" communism i read in some other threads, there isn't a government. How the hell is a command economy supposed to work without a government? Whats wrong with Liberty?

Nov 7, 2003, 08:37 am	#2 (permalink)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,457	Its not a command economy under pure communism. wow, that was easy. "I'd like to tell you what a wonderful person you are. But that would make me a septic gash of a c*nt who quite frankly had no concept of right or wrong." Sleep Talkin' Man

Nov 7, 2003, 08:46 am	#3 (permalink)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	Different Communists have different ideas about their vision of Communism. Some want a dictatorship run by poor people (ie. small group of elite poor), others want Stalinist policies, while some just want to get back at their employers. A few want a country without government (although anarchy is more a term for them). I wonder how all the different Communists will solve their problems after the Revolution....I guess we'll just have to have another war to decide which version of Communism has the strongest guns. Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

Nov 7, 2003, 09:26 am	#4 (permalink)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,457	Well because of the splits between communist thought you mentioned, most communists wouldn't dare fight alongside other types. I for instance wouldn't dream of fighting for the Socialist Worker Party, because they are a top down, bureucratic socialist party. Which is, I think most would agree, what stalinism is. And because of this, more than anything else, a revolution may not occur. Communists are principled and don't like to compromise, hell if your gonna kill for a cause your gonna make sure its the right one, so compromise is a bad thing in that sense. And capitalists know this. Their opponents have divided and conquered themselves. "I'd like to tell you what a wonderful person you are. But that would make me a septic gash of a c*nt who quite frankly had no concept of right or wrong." Sleep Talkin' Man

Nov 7, 2003, 08:01 pm	#5 (permalink)
nature of reality Molten Ash Posts: 134	If its not a command economy, and its not a market economy, what the hell is it? a "traditional" economy? LOL, try that with an industrialized nation. Not like industry would last very long under true communism, where we all get to live happily as draft animals. I hope i get a good stable. EDIT: How wrong of me! That was just my greedy bougriese backround. I hope i get a crappy stable.... For the glory of the Common Good! Whats wrong with Liberty?

Nov 10, 2003, 01:08 am	#6 (permalink)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	If you're ambitious, you can succeed in any environment. A few of Stalin's top leaders were in fact former Imperialists and even capitalists. And with plastic surgery today, in a Communist world most capitalists can escape the murderous wrath of the Communist Secret Police by changing their identity. "Who is Bill Gates the evil dictator? My name is Sanchez Miguel, loyal Communisto from Mexico! I be in your secret police, yes?" Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

Jan 3, 2004, 04:10 pm	#7 (permalink)
Scribbler1 Just passin' through Posts: 8,804	</span><blockquote><span class="smallfont">Quote:</span><hr size="1" />Originally Posted by (castille,) If you're ambitious, you can succeed in any environment. A few of Stalin's top leaders were in fact former Imperialists and even capitalists. And with plastic surgery today, in a Communist world most capitalists can escape the murderous wrath of the Communist Secret Police by changing their identity. "Who is Bill Gates the evil dictator? My name is Sanchez Miguel, loyal Communisto from Mexico! I be in your secret police, yes?"<hr size="1" /></blockquote><span class='postcolor'> Ambitious, yes. However if you're talking about not just plastic surgery and abandoning your principles and beliefs I'd hardly call that successful. On the other hand, if you know you'd be shot or tortured by criticizing the status quo, it's a good idea to go with the flow, or just clam up. But it still may mean, at the very least, abandoning your personal morality and/or principles. I believe personal success is achieving something you set for yourself and not what a group, or government wants you to achieve. If Stalin's top dogs were successful by your measure, they either agreed with him or they assimilated, for their own gain or survival. If memory serves, a lot of people didn't agree with him (or at least HE thought they didn't) and ended up dead. (sorry to comment so long after the fact but I didn't see your post until now) Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

Jan 13, 2004, 08:44 am	#8 (permalink)
castille Citizen #21521 Posts: 2,599	You can't be successful if you're dead. Try telling Stalin Communism sucks and he sucks even more. Its deportation time. Welcome to Siberia. Ideological loyalty is the act of giving your soul to a vague concept, to be manipulated by people smarter than you.

Jan 13, 2004, 09:33 am	#9 (permalink)
G. Adams Fyrdman Location: Middlesbrough UK Posts: 4,457	Didn't have to even do that much. If you opened his office door without his permission he's shoot you. That's why he spent a day dying in his office alone because the guards were too afraid to go in and find he had just been in a typing frenzy all night. "I'd like to tell you what a wonderful person you are. But that would make me a septic gash of a c*nt who quite frankly had no concept of right or wrong." Sleep Talkin' Man