Ron Paul's View of Health Care

[Objectivist]

Here is a list of what Ron Paul supports in regard to health care (From Ron Paul 2008 — Hope for America)

Making all medical expenses tax deductible. Eliminating federal regulations that discourage small businesses from providing coverage. Giving doctors the freedom to collectively negotiate with insurance companies and drive down the cost of medical care. Making every American eligible for a Health Savings Account (HSA), and removing the requirement that individuals must obtain a high-deductible insurance policy before opening an HSA. Reform licensure requirements so that pharmacists and nurses can perform some basic functions to increase access to care and lower costs.

What I like about his plan is that it avoids intense government intervention and gives more freedom to individuals and small business.

I think the most original part of his plan, is in regard to the HSA's. (For those people who do not know what HSA's are: Wikipedia: Health Savings Accounts)

By opening up HSA's to everyone instead of only the people who have high deductible health plans, it gives people the option of avoiding health insurance companies and save money in a tax-free account. This gives people two very important options (that insurance companies do not give you): save money or spend money.

By allowing pharmacists and nurses to perform basic health procedures (such as a pharmacist writing prescriptions for certain medicines for colds/coughs/antibiotics perhaps) gives more access and more freedom to customers. Instead of having to pay the doctor, then the pharmacist... you only pay the pharmacist saving money.

Any comments or problems with his plan?

[Compugasm]

Sounds good... why woudln't anyone want this?

[Objectivist]

Quote by: Compugasm Sounds good... why woudln't anyone want this?

I have yet to figure it out. My best bet: ignorance.

[simple simon]

Quote by: Objectivist Any comments or problems with his plan?

i see a huge problem with his plan ...... i realize Ron Paul is a Dr but im not sure how this is escaping his plan .... or maybe he figured no one would notice

one reason Dr's charge so much is because of malpractice insurance .... you really think all these pharmacists and nurses will want to pay such costly insurance .. of course they will have to ..... if a nurse prescribes something that actually harms you you dont think they will pay the damages out of pocket do you ?

on top of that .. your insurance will make you see a Dr for all serious ailments .. do you think they will also pay for you to be seen by this nurse and/or pharmacist in Dr Paul's fantasy plan ?

[Objectivist]

Quote by: simple simon one reason Dr's charge so much is because of malpractice insurance .... you really think all these pharmacists and nurses will want to pay such costly insurance .. of course they will have to ..... if a nurse prescribes something that actually harms you you dont think they will pay the damages out of pocket do you ? on top of that .. your insurance will make you see a Dr for all serious ailments .. do you think they will also pay for you to be seen by this nurse and/or pharmacist in Dr Paul's fantasy plan ?

If nurses and pharmacists intend to make a profit they will. And I'm assuming that they already pay malpractice insurance as it is. (I know my aunt is a nurse and the hospital she works for pays for it, although it's not as extensive as a doctor's)

Ron Paul's plan doesn't force you to deal with insurance companies if you don't want to.

[Capitalist Pig]

Why not do away with the licensure altogether? "Collectively" negotiate? That sounds a lot like unionizing. Oh well, I guess you have to get votes somehow.

[Objectivist]

Quote by: Capitalist Pig Why not do away with the licensure altogether? "Collectively" negotiate? That sounds a lot like unionizing. Oh well, I guess you have to get votes somehow.

While that may not be a bad idea, it is not practical (in the country's present political system) to do away with licensure. It will take many years of government rollbacks and a systematic demantling of government institutions, programs, and regulations. Ron Paul is only a step along the way.

[GHook93]

Making all medical expenses tax deductible.

Great idea and should be done. However, Radical Paul suggests to get rid of the income tax and reduces taxes enormously. Where will the Feds get money? Why does everyone think that having such a weak central government is a good thing. Too strong is bad, but too weak is worse!

Eliminating federal regulations that discourage small businesses from providing coverage.

This is the reason that small business don't provide group insurance plans. It comes down to cost. Its economics. The larger the company the less expensive the plan. And vice versa. This point won't have any effect.
Private insurance, insurance for the elderly and insurance on small business will still be extremely expensive.

Giving doctors the freedom to collectively negotiate with insurance companies and drive down the cost of medical care.

Hospitals already do! With Radical Paul's deregulation agenda he will in effect give the insurance companies more power and the Doctors will be more at the mercy of the insurance companies.

Making every American eligible for a Health Savings Account (HSA), and removing the requirement that individuals must obtain a high-deductible insurance policy before opening an HSA.

Won't do d!ck for the lower class (who RP doesn't care about anyway) and the middle class that works pay check to pay check.

Reform licensure requirements so that pharmacists and nurses can perform some basic functions to increase access to care and lower costs.

Wow this ideas a winner! Have the people that don't go to medical school to do the doctor's job. Great idea! How about having police officers and fireman occassionally fill-in for judges and prosecutors also. Who cares that the lawyers and judges went to law school.


Radical Paul's plan doesn't tackle any of the real issues. Like everything he packages lower taxes to the sheeple without any solutions and they eat it up.
He doesn't address:
(1) The rapidly rising high cost of healthcare
(2) The rapidly rising cost of health insurance
(3) The rapidly rising uninsured citizens
(4) The drain on the hospitals of illegals, uninsured and indigent people
(5) The unaffordability of insurance to the elderly, private insurer, self-employeed and small-business owner.
(6) The inadequacies of HMOs
(7) The fact that medical bills are a leading cause of bankruptcy and poor credit in America
(8) The fact that people tend to stay away from the doctor in order to save money
(9) The fact that minorities tend to get much less of a level of healthcare than whites.
(10) The fact medical malpractice insurance premiums are becoming outrageous and unaffordable (and don't say the solution is to prohibit lawsuits or cap awards - some people's lives are ruined because of a Doctor's negligence)

[Objectivist]

Quote by: GHook93 Radical Paul's plan doesn't tackle any of the real issues. Like everything he packages lower taxes to the sheeple without any solutions and they eat it up. He doesn't address: (1) The rapidly rising high cost of healthcare (2) The rapidly rising cost of health insurance (3) The rapidly rising uninsured citizens (4) The drain on the hospitals of illegals, uninsured and indigent people (5) The unaffordability of insurance to the elderly, private insurer, self-employeed and small-business owner. (6) The inadequacies of HMOs (7) The fact that medical bills are a leading cause of bankruptcy and poor credit in America (8) The fact that people tend to stay away from the doctor in order to save money (9) The fact that minorities tend to get much less of a level of healthcare than whites. (10) The fact medical malpractice insurance premiums are becoming outrageous and unaffordable (and don't say the solution is to prohibit lawsuits or cap awards - some people's lives are ruined because of a Doctor's negligence)

(1) He recognizes why basic health care and medicine are rising, while procedures such as plastic surgery and optic surgery have decreased: Government intervention and regulation

(2), (3), (4), and (5):

Our Crazy Health-Insurance System
Control Your Own Healthcare

(4) and (7) Paying for your medical care is expensive... and it may be better for hospitals to work with patients for better payment plans... But a hospital does not have indefinite funds. It needs money.

So if it costs $50,000 for 50 patients. That means every patient needs to pay $1,000... if however only 25 patients pay, then the hospital is short $25,000. That means that if the hospital wishes to stay in the business of treating patients, the hospital must charge those 25 patients that do pay, not only their $1000 dollars, but $2000 to make up for the 25 that don't pay.

You will find a correlation between the people that strain the system by not being able to pay, and the people that do pay and the high prices of medicine overall.

(8) The reverse is true. When people do not have to pay for it, they use a lot more of it. Say hello waiting lines!

(9) So what? Is it discrimination or a reflection of their socio-economic status as determined by the individual's choices, determination, and goals.

(10) People in America are sue-happy. And unless stricter guidelines and restrictions on lawsuits are created... that will not change -- and neither will the cost of malpractice insurance.

[Compugasm]

Quote by: GHook93 Its economics. The larger the company the less expensive the plan. And vice versa.

Doesn't that mean then, you have to be employed with a large company to get an affordable plan?

[GHook93]

Quote by: Compugasm Doesn't that mean then, you have to be employed with a large company to get an affordable plan?

Yep and that is part of the problem, which Radical Paul is not addressing. Don't state the BS part of the removal of regulations. All of Radical Paul's initiatives would empower the large corps more. It solves nothing.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: Objectivist Here is a list of what Ron Paul supports in regard to health care (From Ron Paul 2008 — Hope for America)

Yet another no-solution concept.
Blah, blah blah, except for re-structuring the fundaments for insurance companies policies, supported by setting up the limits for lawsuits.

We have the following options :
- democracy for all, with limited health-care programs
- less-democratic appraoch, with health-care programs available for all

Try to understand it, guys :
- setting up the limits for lawsuits is a Mandatory factor
- supervising insurance companies policies, in order to enforce them to follow those policies
Other-than-that, we have yet another "developer" on a horizon, with his/her "wonderful" solution (on a paper), and not much behind it.

[GHook93]

Quote by: Rainbow Yet another no-solution concept. Blah, blah blah, except for re-structuring the fundaments for insurance companies policies, supported by setting up the limits for lawsuits.

Too be fair I don't think any of these guys are really setting up great health care programs accept maybe Mitt Romney (but we will see if the MA plan could go national and the jury is still out on the results of the MA plan). It seems like the rest of the Rep's want status quo, which is just arrogant. And the Demo want to socialize the healthcare system, which could bring on some unexpected results.

Honestly Kerry had by far the best HC plan I heard, I wish someone would try to pick up his views.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: GHook93 To be fair I don't think any of these guys are really setting up great health care programs accept maybe Mitt Romney (but we will see if the MA plan could go national and the jury is still out on the results of the MA plan). It seems like the rest of the Rep's want status quo, which is just arrogant. And the Demo want to socialize the healthcare system, which could bring on some unexpected results. Honestly Kerry had by far the best HC plan I heard, I wish someone would try to pick up his views.

Here, it is the core issue :
- a special status has been granted to insurance comapnies in U.S.
Those guys Are : UnTouchable, as of today !!!

[grandpa]

Quote by: Rainbow Here, it is the core issue :- a special status has been granted to insurance comapnies in U.S. Those guys Are : UnTouchable, as of today !!!

Kind of like the Mafia, right?

Grandpa h.

[Rainbow]

Quote by: grandpa Kind of like the Mafia, right ?

One may say that.

[Chancellor]

Quote by: GHook93 Wow this ideas a winner! Have the people that don't go to medical school to do the doctor's job. Great idea! How about having police officers and fireman occassionally fill-in for judges and prosecutors also. Who cares that the lawyers and judges went to law school.

There are already physician's assistants and nurse practitioners providing basic healthcare and writing prescriptions. As for your comments about lawyers and judges, many judgeships on the local and state level are elected positions and one need not necessarily be a lawyer to run for the job. Also, for much of the history of our grand republic, federal judgeships - including the Supreme Court - were filled by men who were not attorneys.