Israel: The Most Racist Illegal Nation.

[Nono]

Quote by: Tashah Shall I bring you up to speed?

Oh yeah, could we please have some more of that endless, nauseatingly self-righteous process of the Israelis telling us how horrible "the Arabs" are and the Palestinians* telling us how horrible "the Jews" are.

What a bunch of two-year-olds -- on both sides. You richly deserve each other. Neither group is adult enough to give itself an honest appraisal, it's always "Well Johnny started it, not me!"

The real difference between the two sides is that one has absolutely unconditional (think about that term) support from the world's most powerful country, and thus has complete military dominance and can do whatever it pleases with impunity.

* Not so long ago "Palestinian" was a taboo word in Israel. So there's progress.

[shrike]

The real difference between the two sides is that one has absolutely unconditional (think about that term) support from the world's most powerful country, and thus has complete military dominance and can do whatever it pleases with impunity.

And the other side was heavily supported by USSR and now by high oil prices.

[Nono]

Quote by: shrike Jews (...) returned to their homeland that there etnically cleansed from it.

Well now, why only you guys? Let's reverse the many thousands (or millions) of cases of "ethnic cleansing" over the past two thousand years. That'd be a pretty picture.

(...) wanted to live in peace with local population even though their ancestors illegally occupied the land.

Speaking of pretty pictures, what a load of censored, cherry-picked, perfumed-up history. That's your trouble, shrike, your tribal loyalty totally prevents you from engaging in the slightest objectivity. And your statements suffer from a corresponding lack of credibility.

[shrike]

Quote by: Nono ... can do whatever it pleases with impunity.

If its really was the case the confilct would be solved long time ago.

[Nono]

Quote by: shrike And the other side was heavily supported by USSR and now by high oil prices.

Right, little buddy. That's why we see all those fat Palestinians flashing around Gaza in their air-conditioned Mercedes limousines, flitting from one party to another.

And the USSR... the USSR... Oh, yeah, that thing that ceased to exist (died of exhaustion) over a decade and a half ago. Jeez, that really puts us in the picture on the current situation. Pathetic.

[Nono]

Quote by: shrike If its really was the case the confilct would be solved long time ago.

Elaborate, I dare ya.

[shrike]

Quote by: Nono Well now, why only you guys? Let's reverse the many thousands (or millions) of cases of "ethnic cleansing" over the past two thousand years. That'd be a pretty picture.

Jews were only case (as far as I know) that were not only ethnically cleansed but deprived of their homeland and scattered around the globe.
The closest similar case is a Roma I think but I don’t think they have much cultural connection to India as Jews to land of Israel.

Speaking of pretty pictures, what a load of censored, cherry-picked, perfumed-up history. That's your trouble, shrike, your tribal loyalty totally prevents you from engaging in the slightest objectivity. And your statements suffer from a corresponding lack of credibility.

Please no hollow sentences say exactly what do you object?

[shrike]

Quote by: Nono Right, little buddy. That's why we see all those fat Palestinians flashing around Gaza in their air-conditioned Mercedes limousines, flitting from one party to another.

If would be possible if they would not wast all the millions they recieve on killing Israeli civilians.

[Nono]

Z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z ....

[Tashah]

Quote by: Nono Oh yeah, could we please have some more of that endless, nauseatingly self-righteous process of the Israelis telling us how horrible "the Arabs" are and the Palestinians* telling us how horrible "the Jews" are.

Praxius requested the information, and I provided it. What it sadly demonstrates, is that neither side is bereft of opprobrium in this. I personally find this behavior despicable but IMHO... to ignore it is also despicable.

On another level, I am a newbie to this forum and until proven otherwise, my posts naturally lack a certain measure of trustworthiness. Therefore when someone requests a verification, I provide such. My apologia if this current necessity offended you. Perhaps with the passage of time and the accretion of posts, this unpleasant modality can be dispensed with.

[Nono]

Quote by: Tashah I am a newbie to this forum and until proven otherwise, my posts naturally lack a certain measure of trustworthiness. Therefore when someone requests a verification, I provide such. My apologia if this current necessity offended you. Perhaps with the passage of time and the accretion of posts, this unpleasant modality can be dispensed with.

Perhaps. Though I see no reason for it and it didn't "offend" me. What offends me is the dogged pointing-of-finger at the Other Side.

Indeed, if you show yourself prepared to heap opprobrium wherever opprobrium is merited, you'll constitute a breath of fresh air after nearly two thousand tribally-correct posts by shrike, hitherto Israel's only representative on this board.

You'll notice that there are also Israel-bashers here. But there are others who attempt to apply the same moral yardstick to all.

[shrike]

Indeed, if you show yourself prepared to heap opprobrium wherever opprobrium is merited, you'll constitute a breath of fresh air after nearly two thousand tribally-correct posts by shrike, hitherto Israel's only representative on this board.

Speaking the truth and refute Israel-basher arguments is tribally-correct according to you?
I didn’t agree with many strategically Israeli government deacons along the years especially so called "peace" process that brought only pain misery and despair to Israel and Palestinians.

You'll notice that there are also Israel-bashers here. But there are others who attempt to apply the same moral yardstick to all.

All the problem that world wont apply the same moral yardstick to Israel as it apply to any other country in the world.

[arielmessenger]

Shrike, I've studied enough biology to tell you to dump all those Jewish ancestry claims. They are absurd but you won't believe because you'd rather stick with your Cult's inordinate propensity to tell whopper lies.

Until you provide Non-Jewish genetic information sources for those ridiculous Semitic ancestry claims no should pay any attention to you. You are just a Zionist propagandist seemingly here on these boards to continue the Zionist Jewish lies about Israel, and now about Ashkenazis. Does Wikipedia say Ashkenazis were Semitic? No. Because they were not. They were central European Khazars who were forced to convert by their king.

So many of us have traces of ancestry from a wide variety of ethnic groups. I think I remember my dna test showing one mine as a Guam Islander and like many Americans, there was an Indian in our family cupboard too. But only the Jews have jumped on any trace element to claim their European genes are really Semitic! Just more lies in a long string of them going all the way back to the story of Abraham.

[sevendogs]

This is language of war. I heard the same in Russia during WWII. Something like this sounded in USA, when Bush started his war with support of American conservatives. However, Israel is not less legal then Arab countries. They all emerged as a result of war, but it was long ago.

[billybobama]

I know the Jews have plenty of blood on their hands, but I just find Jew hateing to be extremely boring.

[arielmessenger]

promote genocide of Palestinian society? Why do you support your people coming from Europe and America to force the native peoples out of their own country?

Why do you do this when your religious cult has no more rightful claim to Palestine than any other European or American citizen. Gentile Christians did learn their lesson in the Crusades debacle but Zionist Jews haven't and as long as they haven't and are either utterly selfish or utterly stupid or both we have our religious war in the Middle East with Muslims and Israelis will never be safe.

Please don't tell me "G-d gave the land to us" bull-hockey because that story is exposed as the first of the Jewish whoppers--the Jewish monotheistic g-d promising the land of Canaan to a Hindu Vedic polytheistic god masquarading as a Hebrew--not exactly believable stuff even for ancient myths. So, with no Abraham promise of the Holy Land why do Jews expect Gentiles to rollover and die because Jews and Evangelical Christians believe in tall tales?

I am of Jewish descent but I would never be a Jew. I have four Jewish friends who have dropped their Jewish Cult identity to become other religionists--Muslim Sufi for one, Buddhist for another, New Age for one, and another starting his own religion (not mine). It's time for the Cult to disband because all it does is cause trouble for its members and the world. Deprogramming from the Cult is not a bad idea because the Cult's had its grasp on Jewish minds for thousands of years.

I would be saying the same words to Catholics and Prods if these were the 1600's and Catholic and Protestants were starting their Manifest Destiny version of the European genocidal waltz killing the darker-skinned natives that is now being played out in Israel.

[Praxius]

Quote by: Tashah Definitely not. You never responded to my first question though. How do you know where and when those pictures were taken? Are they archived (where) and copyrighted (by whom)? Unless these questions are addressed properly, you deal in assumption and conjecture.

Boing Boing: Image of the day: children send messages on missiles

Enjoy.... just this last summer and it is Israeli children.

Israeli Children Signing Bombs: Part II « C.A.R.D

Here's another source... not hard to look up you know? Guess what? If more people would look their own information up themselves, then perhaps you guys wouldn't be living lives of doubt and speculation when someone else actually makes a comment on something.

I provided a pertinent Ehud Olmert quote from The Guardian dated June 2007. Vastly different in content and context than the decades old Israeli quotes previously provided.

Like I said, actions speak louder then words.... as his actions prove this past year..... as do the above images.

Just because he can talk positively doesn't mean his real intentions are positive.... much like another leader... Even if Bush was a great speaker and was great with the media, doesn't mask actions.

Have all the citizens of the United States 'permitted' their current leaders to wage aggressive preemptive warfare?

Nope.... because he's a tyrant who doesn't listen to his people anyways.... good example though.

No offense intended but by any measure, your metric here is deceptively simplistic.

What's the point in giving a complicated answer to a simple question?

On another level, I am a newbie to this forum and until proven otherwise, my posts naturally lack a certain measure of trustworthiness. Therefore when someone requests a verification, I provide such. My apologia if this current necessity offended you. Perhaps with the passage of time and the accretion of posts, this unpleasant modality can be dispensed with.

Well I wasn't asking for proof, I just asked for it.

But I imagine that both sides have plenty of propaganda running on their medias...... that's a given.... if you got only one side dishing out propaganda, then eventually they'll begin to win.... propaganda requires balance with more propaganda.

[Tashah]

Quote by: Nono Perhaps. Though I see no reason for it and it didn't "offend" me. What offends me is the dogged pointing-of-finger at the Other Side.

Did you apply the same ethics-metric to the OP author? If not, then your ethically induced disgust is a bit hypocritical.

Quote by: Nono Indeed, if you show yourself prepared to heap opprobrium wherever opprobrium is merited, you'll constitute a breath of fresh air after nearly two thousand tribally-correct posts by shrike, hitherto Israel's only representative on this board.

I call 'em as I see 'em. I am brutally frank and averse to political correctness. Sometimes we'll find a common ground Nono, and other times we will politely agree to disagree.

In addition, it would be disingenuous to imagine that all Israelis are cookie-cutter clones. Political diversity is very much alive and well in Israel.

Quote by: Nono You'll notice that there are also Israel-bashers here. But there are others who attempt to apply the same moral yardstick to all.

I have noticed that facet. It's all good... been there done that lol. What many folks fail to consider, is that Israel and Palestine have been in conflict for six decades. It is simply impossible for such a protracted saga to be a sterile and innocuous affair. Both sides have indeed engaged in atrocious behaviors. Inexcusable, but that is the dark nature of the beast.

It has been my experience that most political debate forums with threads on the Israel/Palestinian conflict tend to focus on historicity and blame. The past cannot be changed, and neither side is blameless. Continually haggling over a past that is irrevocable is unproductive and debilitating. It is rare to discover I/P threads that dissect current events and attempt to extrapolate how these happenings may influence our tomorrows. Sadly I suppose, that is also the nature of the beast.

[arielmessenger]

"It has been my experience that most political debate forums with threads on the Israel/Palestinian conflict tend to focus on historicity and blame. The past cannot be changed, and neither side is blameless. Continually haggling over a past that is irrevocable is unproductive and debilitating. It is rare to discover I/P threads that dissect current events and attempt to extrapolate how these happenings may influence our tomorrows. Sadly I suppose, that is also the nature of the beast."

is that they will do anything to divert attention away from moral responsibility for Israeli actions against Palestinians. And folks, 60 years of conflict is not thousands of years and certainly can be analyzed for first causes.

The first cause of conflict in the I-P conflict is the imposing of partition of Palestine on the indigenous Palestinian peoples without their say or approval. That was the original moral error that has caused everything wrong in Israel. If Israel had gotten permission for the partition by Palestinians it would a different matter but they didn't and we all know why they and Europe and American leaders didn't even attempt to bring Palestinians into the equation. They didn't count. They didn't matter. They were Arabs. Europeans always mattered more.

There is only one survival plan, the Canaan Peace Plan, for Israelis now but their religious narcissism won't allow them to concede moral defeat. They will do anything to justify their immorality in my debating experience. And as we have seen already posted on Volconvo, Zionist Jews are quite willing to kill themselves and take down millions with them in order to protect the Cult.
A very sick paranoid cult mindset that has no place in power in the modern world.

All of Islam's terrorism practically can be traced back to Arab anger at the imposition of Israel on them in 1947.

[Nono]

Quote by: Tashah (...) the OP author (...)

You've lost me there, T. Mind spelling out initials that some of us are too slow on the uptake to understand?

It would be disingenuous to imagine that all Israelis are cookie-cutter clones.

Not only disingenuous, but dead wrong. I sure hope nobody on this board entertains such a supposition.

Israel and Palestine have been in conflict for six decades. It is simply impossible for such a protracted saga to be a sterile and innocuous affair. Both sides have indeed engaged in atrocious behaviors. Inexcusable, but that is the dark nature of the beast.

Right. The events of those six decades (or nine, depending on how you calculate it) give the shrikes on both sides an endless supply of grievance-fuel, so they can concentrate full-time on self-righteousness and thus avoid looking for a way out.

It has been my experience that most political debate forums with threads on the Israel/Palestinian conflict tend to focus on historicity and blame. The past cannot be changed, and neither side is blameless. Continually haggling over a past that is irrevocable is unproductive and debilitating. It is rare to discover I/P threads that dissect current events and attempt to extrapolate how these happenings may influence our tomorrows.

OK, Tashah, I think you and I have at least a generous modicum of common ground.