Apology before the attack

[jose]

well come on shrike

[jose]

Quote by: jose please try an answer; Shrike as a Russian immigrant, why do you feel you have more rights to live in Palestine, than native born Arabs

No answer:rolleyes:

[rez]

he thinks he has the right to live there because Jews lived on that land thousands of years ago.

[Pooeypants]

Quote by: jose well come on shrike

Jose, I do believe that everyone has a right to silence, further more, this is not debate behaviour as the opponent hasn't responded. You are now walking into the domain of trolling, please cease immediately.

[GHook93]

Quote by: rez I suggest Jews no longer consider themselves Zionists. America should give up a section of their own land in order to make room for a Jewish homeland. I suggest Texas, you ok with that shrike? You still may have to worry about religious fanatics though...so I do not know if that will solve your problem.

Why not give them New York! Shit the Jews already control it anyways, right PH?

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: GHook93 Why not give them New York! Shit the Jews already control it anyways, right PH?

I don't think that Americans living in Texas or New York would peacefully give up their land and homes to provide space for a Jewish Homeland. So why are Palestinians expected to do so?

[shrike]

So why are Palestinians expected to do so?

I think it’s expected from civilized people to leave in peace with their neighbors.

[shrike]

Quote by: rez he thinks he has the right to live there because Jews lived on that land thousands of years ago.

I don't answer personal question on debate forums I don't think it’s appropriate

[shrike]

Quote by: rez Everybody has this self-determination. Jews wanted their land back...Force was used to kick the Jews out, and now force is being used get back "their" land.

There was never intention to use violence in the first place it was arabs ussually as perptraitors of the violence. For example violent riots against Jews lead to creation of Hagana.

Yep, the only place where Jews could legitmately start a war to get their land back.

Jews don't started any War.

No the Jews started to immigrate back to the land, when they became a majority they wanted to fully control the government. The only way to fully control this piece of land was to use force. The war is NOT over

.
Israel accepted the Partition plan. It was the Arabs who started the violence. Palestinians don't want peace they showed it by electing Hamas government.

Only if they controlled the land.

Sources please.

Because they are the ones wining this war. The losers have to find somewhere else to live

So you say ethnic cleansing is your solution? That what extremists from both sides are proposing..

[rez]

Quote by: shrike I think it’s expected from civilized people to leave in peace with their neighbors.

Let's put it this way.

The Jews asked if they could own Israel. The people already living there said no. So the Jews used force to deny their right to say no. Self-determination is a bitch.

To shrike, a Jew living in Israel. Do you think it is worth all the fear and anxiety to live in Israel? Why or Why not?

[shrike]

The Jews asked if they could own Israel. The people already living there said no. So the Jews used force to deny their right to say no. Self-determination is a bitch.

They not used force it was the other side that did it.Jews used natural right of self defence that every nation in the world entitled to.

To shrike, a Jew living in Israel. Do you think it is worth all the fear and anxiety to live in Israel? Why or Why not

Again I don't answer personal questions. Personal experiences of the debater are irrelevant to the debated topic.
We of course can discuss was it right thing for the Jews to create Israel.
If you want it of course

[rez]

Quote by: shrike There was never intention to use violence in the first place it was arabs ussually as perptraitors of the violence. For example violent riots against Jews lead to creation of Hagana.

True or False. Jews proposed the idea that they ought to own the land of Israel.

Jews don't started any War.

Quote by: wikipedia Tensions between the Jews and Arabs started to emerge after the 1880s, when European Jews began to immigrate and augment Palestinian Jewish communities by buying land from Ottoman and individual Arab landholders, known as effendis, and establishing agricultural settlements in the historic lands of Judea and Israel, which were then part of the Ottoman Empire.

Who were these Arab landholders that accepted Jewish Money. Who were the Ottoman landholders? .

Israel accepted the Partition plan. It was the Arabs who started the violence. Palestinians don't want peace they showed it by electing Hamas government.

Isreal accepted the plan, but the Arabs did not. This is a conflict. The only way that humans know how to settle conflicts is by killing each other. Suggesting that Jews are above this method to settle conflict would be a LIE. Please do not continue to lie.

So you say ethnic cleansing is your solution? That what extremists from both sides are proposing..

This is what you are saying

Quote by: shrike There was a war that Arabs started.They lost.

What happens to people that lose?

[Zeebadee]

Quote by: shrike Israel accepted the Partition plan. It was the Arabs who started the violence. Palestinians don't want peace they showed it by electing Hamas government.

Of course Israel accepted the partition plan, they got what they wanted. And it's disingenuous to claim that after stealing something it's the other side that starts the violence when they try to get it back.

[shrike]

Quote by: rez True or False. Jews proposed the idea that they ought to own the land of Israel.

There were various streams in Zionism but yes many Zionist wanted Jewish homeland in Land of Israel. There were debate what should be state or for example some kind of autonomy but I don't see anything wrong with it

Who were these Arab landholders that accepted Jewish Money. Who were the Ottoman landholders? .

What do you mean who? There were people who owned the land and had a land deed for the land.

Isreal accepted the plan, but the Arabs did not. This is a conflict. The only way that humans know how to settle conflicts is by killing each other. Suggesting that Jews are above this method to settle conflict would be a LIE. Please do not continue to lie.

No I know other ways to settle conflict is to negotiate and coming to some kind of agreement. Israel as any democratic state prefer to solve conflict peacefully but it will fight back if it will be attacked.

What happens to people that lose?

Its depending on the circumstances.

[shrike]

Quote by: zee Of course Israel accepted the partition plan, they got what they wanted. And it's disingenuous to claim that after stealing something it's the other side that starts the violence when they try to get it back

How can someone claim that the other side stole something if it was never theirs?

[rez]

Quote by: shrike They not used force it was the other side that did it.Jews used natural right of self defence that every nation in the world entitled to.

ok Jewish people did not use physical force to own Israel. They used money and a list of excuses. You think Jews took back the land fair and square, but Arabs do not. You do understand there is a disagreement right?

Again I don't answer personal questions. Personal experiences of the debater are irrelevant to the debated topic. We of course can discuss was it right thing for the Jews to create Israel. If you want it of course

Obviously Jewish politicans are willing to own land that is not secure for citizens.

[rez]

Quote by: shrike How can someone claim that the other side stole something if it was never theirs?

Stop being dishonest. The land was theirs. You think it was not stolen because Jews lived there thousands of years ago. Thousands of years ago is not relevant to today's society.

[shrike]

ok Jewish people did not use physical force to own Israel

Of course they did. But like I said there were usually not perpetrators of the violence.

You think Jews took back the land fair and square, but Arabs do not. You do understand there is a disagreement right?

Of course but the disagreement can be solved in various way. Violence is not the only answer.

Obviously Jewish politicans are willing to own land that is not secure for citizens.

I think Jews in Israel secure than in any other country. You could see it by everyday anti-Semitic cases that happening in other countries in the world. Only in Israel Jews can fight against those who want to prosecute them and not asking others that they usually do nothing about it.
.

[shrike]

Quote by: rez Stop being dishonest. The land was theirs. .

There is a several ways to own the land private and state.So how they owned it?

You think it was not stolen because Jews lived there thousands of years ago. Thousands of years ago is not relevant to today's society

Jews was always lived there along the history.

[rez]

Quote by: shrike There were various streams in Zionism but yes many Zionist wanted Jewish homeland in Land of Israel. There were debate what should be state or for example some kind of autonomy but I don't see anything wrong with it

War is what is wrong with it. No matter how peaceful you make the Jews out to be, they are involved in a war.

What do you mean who? There were people who owned the land and had a land deed for the land.

wow I gave you legit argument and you threw it away. I will try again.

Why would Muslims sell the land to Jews if Muslims did not want Jews to live there. Sounds like a disagreement among Muslims...

No I know other ways to settle conflict is to negotiate and coming to some kind of agreement. Israel as any democratic state prefer to solve conflict peacefully but it will fight back if it will be attacked.

There are two sides when people negotiate. If one side disagrees there is no agreement. If Israel decided to solve the conflict peacefully then why would they put themselves in a position where they had to defend themselves?